Zionism’s Roots Help Us Interpret Israel Today

Discussion in 'Middle East' started by SamSkwamch, May 17, 2016.

  1. SamSkwamch

    SamSkwamch Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2016
    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    38
    This is a great read for anyone still trying to put all this together. So much history has been revised and we see that right here on this board daily. At the end of the day, this is more of real factual stuff that hasbara cannot explain away. Enjoy...

    It was an assessment no one expected from the deputy head of the Israeli military. In his Holocaust Day speech last week, Yair Golan compared current trends in Israel with Germany in the early 1930s. In today’s Israel, he said, could be recognised “the revolting processes that occurred in Europe … There is nothing easier than hating the stranger, nothing easier than to stir fears and intimidate.”

    The furore over Gen Golan’s remarks followed a similar outcry in Britain at statements by former London mayor Ken Livingstone. He observed that Hitler had been “supporting Zionism” in 1933 when the Nazis signed a transfer agreement, allowing some German Jews to emigrate to Palestine.

    More here: http://www.globalresearch.ca/zionisms-roots-help-us-interpret-israel-today-2/5525483
     
  2. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    18,965
    Likes Received:
    3,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    From your article and he himself admits that Livingston was at least clumsy

    It goes further than that. In the UK now criticism of Israel is antisemitism but according to Lilienthal in 'What Price Israel ?' that concept had been disseminated in the US prior to the end of WW2 although then it was I guess criticism of Zionism - no doubt why they're trying to hide it behind 'antizionism is antisemitism' in the UK now.
     
  3. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    73,644
    Likes Received:
    13,766
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I doubt many on this board have heard of Alfred Lilienthal much less read What Price Israel.
     
  4. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    18,965
    Likes Received:
    3,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    Do you think they have heard of Jonathan Cook who the OP article is about. I think he is the only foreign journalist who has chosen to live with Palestinians in Nazareth rather than in the usual Jewish towns.

    http://www.jonathan-cook.net/about/

    So to more remembrance. Here is an article on the Nakba by Ben White a British Jew - well worth checking out his site from time to time

    https://benwhite.org.uk/2016/05/16/nakba-day-returns-but-not-the-palestinians/

    As he says the Nakba shapes the present and is not forgotten. Going back to Lilienthal as he reports in his book the US State Department was against the partitioning of Palestine. They believed that Israel would continue being aggressive always claiming that she was the poor one only acting in self defence and of course understood that there would be no way that Zionists could secure themselves in another people's land except through perpetual violence.

    I think the State Department as well as realising that supporting the partition of Palestine and by so doing not allowing the right of the Palestinians to self determination, something both the UN and the US stood up for at the time would result in the Arabs of the ME not respecting the US - something according to him Russia also saw, hence why she was so keen for this to happen, but that it was going to create a tinder box in the region which we are experiencing today. Without judgement Israel as a Jewish State created by the taking over of another people's homeland which was correctly seen at the time as being something which could never be achieved without perpetual war must have been the biggest mistake that the UN has ever made and in it's beginning, it created the ground for continuous violence. Many Jews, both from Lilienthal's time and very much now question whether possibly Israel is the biggest danger to Jews rather than a place of safety.

    Given that it was known when the partition was agreed to, by his account after much blackmail and bribery, that the outcome would be what we have seen, it is very difficult to imagine any outcome which can make what was an untenable position become tenable.

    With thoughts to the Palestinians for the decades of harm which this poor decision by the UN, which even though it was non binding gave those who created Israel a backdrop onto which to claim a right and as Ben White says, which does not acknowledge the truth of what was done to other people to achieve Israel or even when it does, even worse denies the inhumanity explicit in this. If people ever want to end this turmoil they need to start to get honest and make amends for the harm they have done.
     
  5. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    18,965
    Likes Received:
    3,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    I think I may have made a mistake there when I say Ben white is a Jew. I had considered he was simply because it was from such sites that I was directed to him. However after I wrote that I thought, is white a Jewish Name??? So more information on him https://benwhite.org.uk/about/
     
  6. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2013
    Messages:
    73,644
    Likes Received:
    13,766
    Trophy Points:
    113
    As a Jewish Israeli opposed to the state’s policies of occupation and discrimination, I know what it’s like to be smeared with claims I am a ‘traitor’ or ’self-hating Jew’. The accusation of antisemitism is also used to attack those who, like Ben, are opposed to injustice and inequality. We appreciate his work, and his focus on obtaining an inclusive, just solution for all people in this land. Dr. Anat Matar

    I have known Ben White for a few years now. His commitment to see justice done to the Palestinian people is remarkable in many ways. It gives hope to Arab people (like myself) who have been so disillusioned by western politics in the Middle-East often characterised by double standards. His sharp criticisms of Israel’s policies are motivated not by hostility towards the Jewish people but by an unbiased and courageous struggle to uphold human rights at a great personal cost. His articles and books are all well documented and reflect a profound and personal allegiance to the Messiah who was sent to ‘proclaim good news to the poor, freedom for the prisoners and to set the oppressed free’ (Luke 4:18). Chawkat Moucarry, World Vision International, writing in a personal capacity


    I am an Israeli Jewish citizen. I have been active in the campaign against my government’s apartheid policies for many years. I am also the descendant of Holocaust survivors from Europe. My activism is based, to a large extent, on the universal lessons which should be drawn from this dark episode of history. I have been following Ben White’s work, and have been in touch with him for quite some time. When apologists for Israel’s shameful, racist and criminal policies attempt to smear Ben as an anti-Semite, I regard their attempt as an action which is aimed at me as well. Such allegations are preposterous and mean. They also amount to cynical abuse of Jewish history. I regard Ben as a friend, a decent man and an excellent activist driven by concern for universal principles of human rights. I am thankful for having people like him abroad, joining hands with Israeli peace and human rights activists. I will continue to stand by him and his important work. Ofer Neiman, West Jerusalem

    My name is Diana Neslen. I am a Jew, originally from South Africa. I have known Ben White for some considerable time and respect him as an ardent campaigner for justice, for equality and against racism wherever he finds it, including in the State of Israel. I might not always agree with Ben’s political views, but will respectfully argue the toss. It is now clear that Israel is unwilling to countenance criticism that holds the state to the democratic ideals it purports to follow and as such will use any means to silence those who presume to challenge it, including false accusations of anti-Semitism. It is not anti-Semitic to challenge Israel’s policies and behaviour, rather it is a sign of hope that perhaps the criticism will enable the country to change its ways. There are people who use the time honoured anti Semitic tropes of ‘Jewish power’ to denigrate Israel, but Ben is certainly not among them. His anti-racist credentials are too deeply embedded for him to descend to that level. Diana Neslen, exec member of Jews for Justice for Palestinians, writing in a personal capacity

    Ben White is a very fine, professional journalist deeply concerned, as all should be, with human rights regardless of fear or favour. John Pilger, film maker, journalist, author

    Ben White is a serious journalist with a deep commitment to human rights and justice for the Palestinians. He is also a well-informed and uncompromising critic of Israeli policies towards the Palestinians. Avi Shlaim

    As a journalist, I have often relied on Ben White’s meticulous journalistic work. His analysis of the Israeli segregation system in his remarkable books about West Bank apartheid and Israel’s internal rights striations are an essential tool for anyone who strives to understand the situation on the ground. As an Israeli, I wish his works penetrated the mainstream here in Israel, and helped challenge and change our status quo, as they have abroad. Lia Tarachansky, Middle East correspondent at The Real News, Director of Seven Deadly Myths

    I have greatly appreciated Ben’s work, and his commitment to finding a just peace for Jews and Palestinians. It is sad that someone with a clear vision of equality and freedom for both peoples has to deal with these kinds of false accusations of antisemitism. Rebecca Vilkomerson, National Director of Jewish Voice for Peace, writing in a personal capacity

    It is my privilege and pleasure to provide this endorsement of Ben White as a principled, anti-racist writer and activist. Over the last few years, Ben has worked closely with me and other Jewish campaigners as part of the broad, multi-ethnic, multi-faith movement for Palestinian freedom, equality and justice. That movement is rooted in an understanding of Zionism as a racist, ethnocentric ideology which must be challenged if there is ever to be a just peace in the Middle East. The movement has opposition to any form of racism, and specifically anti-Jewish racism and Islamophobia, at its heart. In the course of Ben’s work as an intelligent and well-informed champion of human rights for the Palestinian people, he has been effective in defending the movement against unwarranted charges of “anti-semitism”, which is no doubt why he is under attack from Israel’s apologists. Ben White has actively worked to protect the solidarity movement from infiltration by a few individuals whose ideas conflict with its anti-racist principles. Any suggestion that he shares such ideas are totally without foundation and possibly actionable. Naomi Wimborne-Idrissi, Secretary, Jews for Boycotting Israeli Goods (J-BIG)
     
  7. MVictorP

    MVictorP Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2014
    Messages:
    7,663
    Likes Received:
    1,827
    Trophy Points:
    113
    From the link:

    Incredible. I have been saying that for years.

    Of course all comparisons between the Zionists in Israel and the Nazis in Germany is void past 1940, as the "final solution" was being discussed, but I wouldn't bet against the possibility that Israel might come to a similar "solution" if push got to shove. Israel has about the same concerns the Nazis had regarding human rights.
     
  8. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    18,965
    Likes Received:
    3,421
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    It does look like it is moving in that direction.

    http://www.jpost.com/National-News/53-percent-of-Israelis-say-Arabs-should-be-encouraged-to-leave
     

Share This Page