Gun Control needs to be instituted

No one asked you to do that. Half those shot were criminals being shot by their would-be victims. Americans are doing just fine.

 

? What a weird response. The OP has all the data and links necessary to prove it. I have no idea what your mind is thinking. What you need to do to debate is address the OP and try to disprove the data that was supplied through statistics, links to researched articles and data. You will not get a response from me again until you do that. I am not here to answer misinformed or misguided posts.

 

You have already admitted that you were wrong but I guess just acknowledging that twice is too much.

 

I have the highest admiration and respect for our routinely overtasked, overworked, and completely underappreciated police officers. Nevertheless, call "911" with your emergency and see how soon you'll actually have police response. Unless it's some kind of "shots-fired" situation with a "crime in progress" you'll be lucky (VERY lucky) if you see an officer sooner than an hour. And unless your need is something close to 'life-threatening', you may not get any response until the next day!

We Americans blow WAY too much tax money on "services" for segments of our population that contribute little or nothing but their unending, constantly recurring problems and "issues", and, WAY too little on those officers of the THIN BLUE LINE who keep this whole chaotic, troublesome mess we call a 'society' from going completely straight to hell!

 

They are useless unless they are at hand when you need them.
Most people would just need one handgun if they could carry it discreetly in a pocket or holster.

Given the example of Ukraine it might be smart or even progressive to make sure that at least 10% of the general public has quick access to RPGs.

 

I give up. You only see and hear what you want. It is a waste of time debating with you. Bye

 

I am tired of people giving me reasons why guns are needed. The reality is that those same reasons can be applied to every person in every nation in the world. I continue to ask for explanations as to why we ar we #1 in the developed nations to have more guns (by at least 4 to 1) and more gun related deaths than anywhere else. Why is this happening to us and not to other countries to the high degree we see here?

 

I appreciate the frustration. This “nest of 2A fundamentalists” is much like trying to debate a Christian fundamentalist. Ideology comes before reason. I’ve even committed blasphemy by stating 2A needs repealed. You can list all the harm guns are doing to the US until you’re blue in the face and give workable gun control ideas, but that does not matter because gun control inconveniences them and they have an exaggerated sense of danger. They don’t really care about the rest of society.

 

I suggest that the answer to your questions can more likely be found by examining WHO and WHAT we are as a rather unusually-assembled country with the third-largest population in the world -- 334,000,000+ (est. Jan. 2023). The first thing that hits you is that, ethnically, we are FAR more 'diverse' than either China or India (the only two countries with greater population). The next thing that hits you is that although China and India have societies based in the accomplishments and developments of civilizations that are thousands of years old, we in 'the States' have only existed as a nation for 246 years!

Our uniqueness lies in the reality that we Americans are the descendants of both the 'best' and the 'worst' that the world has brought forth in ~10,000 years of human civilization. Friction necessarily arises from our lack of uniformity in everything from cultural and intellectual background, to genetics -- and yet, we cling together in our strange national 'association' with the constitutional, bedrock-assumption that ALL CITIZENS ARE EQUAL BEFORE THE LAW! But... it is both naive and dangerous to assume that because all citizens should (and must) be treated equally-before-the-law, that all citizens are, in fact, truly 'equal' in all other respects!

Distillation: Our various societal components are so turbulent, unequal, disputatious, and frequently ungovernable that we need far more stringent, rigorous enforcement of laws that protect our safety and security... and because we simply lack the resources to make this happen, we ordinary citizens must (MUST) be able to protect ourselves with the same weaponry that criminals use to BREAK our laws and threaten our lives....

 

Goalpost shift. Strange, as I wasn't writing about the above.
Should you wish to continue addressing what I wrote, I'll be here

 

Every day in the US, ~1100 guns are used to commit a violent crime.
How many are not?

The unnecessary and ineffective restrictions you seek are not 'workable"

 

A 'gun' is nothing but a tool. A person who commits crimes with a 'gun', however, is a CRIMINAL.

The solution to the 'gun' problem is to put the CRIMINAL in prison, and keep the CRIMINAL in prison for a very long time, with no possibility of an 'early-out', parole, or anything other than a long, hard, thoroughly miserable prison sentence. If we would do that, we would see 'gun' crime go down dramatically!

But, instead, real punishment (PUNISHMENT) for 'gun' crimes in this country is a joke! Typically, sentences are WAY too short, and, less than half the sentence is actually served in a prison anyway. SO... what the hell do we expect from a CRIMINAL "justice system" like that?!

 

I agree and especially here on this board. I have been on 4 different political boards and I find your comment to be excruciatingly true here. Like you said earlier regarding "a nest", well on this board, it is the primary nest.

I guess both of us (you and I) have an OCD condition.

 

VPC has no credibility. They were created for the purpose of banning private firearms ownership by a guy who was fired by the Brady Bunch for admitting that the Brady Bunch had the same goals. Everything they purvey is propaganda based on lies and mistruths.

 

If you all saw that as an end-not a means, people might be less intolerant of your suggestions. But what we see from those such as you-are calls for massive punishments for those who don't meet your demands of securing firearms, rather than most of your ire directed at criminals who steal guns.

 

You seem to be full of condemnation and rationalizations about 'gun' crime... but, tell us, what would you do (DO) to eliminate or seriously reduce 'gun' crime? Just ban all gun ownership by law-abiding citizens...?!

. "Yeah, man, that's cool with me!"

 

Does your view also mean that our nation has less ability to use the mind and rationalize. After all, we do not have any additional "crime" statistics than in any other nation in the world. We have the highest amount of deaths-by-guns in the entire world. As such, it means that our people do not realize that the problem is guns and not the diversity of our society.

 

To begin with, I would ban the use of high velocity weapons. There is absolutely no need for them to be available to anyone. If a person is to get robbed, raped, or attacked, it will usually be by one or a few people and the use of a pistol should be enough.

Secondly, I would definitely institute background checks for anyone looking to buy a gun. Anyone that has any history of violent behavior should not be allowed to buy a gun.

Reducing the amount of gun deaths should be a primary concern. We evidently cannot stop them from happening but we can definitely reduce the number.

By the way, I used to be a policeman when young and I have used a gun for defense and been shot at as well. I am 77 years old and I have not had a gun for over 40 years and there has not been one single instance in that period of time where I needed to have a gun to defend myself. In addition, none of my family members has ever had a reason to carry a gun either. I am talking about at least 20 other people that are part of my family.

 

I agree with everything you wrote above. All one would have to do is look at career criminals' history for proof of the above. We aren't tough enough.
As you wrote, it is a joke. Building more prisons would be a positive step in keeping violent career criminals locked up longer. Nothing wrong with a three strike law like CA.'s- the three strikes law means that after three qualifying convictions, you can face a mandatory sentence of 25 years to life. Like you, I agree we are too easy. Ironically, the same people shouting ban guns, infringing on the rights of legal gun owners are all for society being more lenient toward criminals.

We need to declare war on gangs and cartels in our urban cities. You don't have to go far to realize our increasing gun violent stats are coming by majority from this ilk.

I also think the new bail laws designed to keep jails and prison populations down, disguised as fairer and more equitable to minorities, is an insult to humanity. Growing levels of crime are going up as a result. We reap what we sow.

We don't need more gun control laws but we do need to overhaul an entire justice system who isn't enforcing the gun laws already on the books. Think if we actually enforced all the gun laws already in place. If that means hiring more people who are supposed to be doing thorough gun checks, do it. Find out why this is happening, correct it, and violent crimes from guns will likely fall.

Look to almost any state and at the federal level especially, and one will find that gun and ammo reforms have been added in the last decade, the last few years, the last year. How many more laws do we need? Tell us what more do we need short of infringing on the rights of gun owners? Suggestions have been made by responsible law abiding gun owners and those like me sympathetic with their cause. We have improved and expanded background checks before gun ownership, we suggest training and arming teachers, some suggest raising the age for gun ownership.

These are the gun control laws passed in 2022 | CNN States have added their own input, gun control laws. What MORE should be done?

Lastly, criminals don't obey gun laws. When people start realizing this, they will approach how to effectively deal with this element of society more efficiently.

Just some of my thoughts this morning. Hope everyone is having a wonderful day.

 

the dishonest facades gun banners purvey concerning crime control, are getting thrashed all over the net. Many people are seeing gun banning schemes for what they are and not the "crime control" solutions their authors claim

 

Amen! They don't care about curbing gun violence as much as they care about controlling who they perceive as the unwashed masses AKA the law-abiding gun owner. They want our guns, though many won't admit it, that's their real goal. Even the O/P, Lucky1knows finally admits it. He agrees with another poster who sees the law-abiding gun owner as little more than a 2nd amendment fundamentalist nest, a like idealist echo chamber without reason, a group who cares nothing for society.

 

Trix, I gotta say we've known each other IRL and on forums (fora?) for a long time and this is one of the best, most logical and well stated posts on gun control I can remember. Well done.

This post is the ultimate "common sense gun control" ideas I've seen. Well done.

 

You're not really interested in the tangible solutions suggested to bring those crime stats down. You wear the crime stats like a dang badge of honor because your real goal is to remove the guns from law-abiding citizens.

 

Just like 99.99% of all those who support unnecessary and ineffective restrictions on the exercise of the right to keep and bear arms by the law abiding.