Macron says ‘nothing ruled out,’ including using Western troops, to stop Russia winning Ukraine war

Wow....for a moment I thought that was the Rolling Stones concert tour ?

 

The Russian army won't leave unless it's beaten back, or they get concessions. It's literally the spilled milk principle. They're not just going to say 'Okay, I guess you can pal around us AND we have to pay for the damages?'

Yeah, that's not happening. A middle ground will happen, in which both sides will grumble. My proposal is fair and balanced.

 

It sounds like you're of the opinion that we have an obligation to police the world and protect everyone from foreign invasion.

How do you feel about increasing our taxes?

 

So explain why NATO borders have regularly expanded eastward since the fall of the USSR.

https://geopoliticaleconomy.com/2022/02/01/dick-cheney-us-goal-break-up-russia/

"Former US Vice President Dick Cheney, a lead architect of the Iraq War, not only wanted to dismantle the Soviet Union; he also wanted to break up Russia itself, to prevent it from rising again as a significant political power..."

"Former US Defense Secretary Robert Gates wrote that, 'When the Soviet Union was collapsing in late 1991, Dick wanted to see the dismantlement not only of the Soviet Union and the Russian empire but of Russia itself, so it could never again be a threat.'"

 

lol I suppose I was wrong on finding a quote. Thanks for showing me something I was not aware of and I stand corrected. NATO again is an alliance of democratic countries. An alliance is not bad and serves not as a threat but as insurance. Also if Russia wasn’t hostile to its neighbors NATO wouldn’t expand as easily.

 

The army who are invading foreign land , who are killing indiscriminately, who are raping young girls , who are kidnaping young boys, you can’t even condemn them.

But here you are lecturing how West should withdraw and create buffer zone, make concession and all that. And you want us to take you seriously.

 

Wars aren't won or lost on morality. If the Ukraine with Western weapons could beat back their oppressors, they would have. Obviously, as you can plainly see, they cannot. But the oppressors also cannot obtain their objectives and will want to have an exit strategy themselves, hence a middle ground.

Whatever war crimes were committed will be prosecuted(and for any chance at that, it won't be the symbolism of Putin. But rather, the Russian military itself.). I imagine Germany 1918 after versallies.

 

I usually disagree with Dick Cheney. His aggressive foreign policy is too much for me. But he was 100% right about Russian.

 

Take Two. , no condemnation for the army who are killing, rapping , kidnaping.

 

Some of us are able to look at it objectively without platitudes. I'm neither a Ukrainian nor a Russian, so I don't care about Russian barbarism. Feels bad obviously, but nothing I can do about it.

 

Thank you for speaking the truth.

You don’t care Russian barbarism. You just want West to bow down and accept Russian barbarism.

and you expect rest of us to take you seriously?

 

Can you try reading what's there and not commenting on what isn't there? The only thing you faithfully cited is "You don't care about Russian barbarism"

Yes, because as I said "I'm neither a Ukrainian nor a Russian" so I(and the rest of the US, including the government) has zero stakes in this. Nada, zilch, none.

I don't have to condemn it, because I'm not responsible for it. It'd be like me condemning Nazism when I'm not a German or a Nazi.

(now watch you accuse me of being a neo-nazi now)

 

You are neither Ukrainian or Russian , so you can’t condemn barbarism?

How about being a human and say “ I condemn atrocity by another human”. Or is that too much to ask?

This is so , so interesting to see , how manty post you are going back and forth just to avoid condemning the violent act by Russian army.

 

"Doesn't tell you anything"??....I guess ignorance is bliss on your part..who knows.

Massive fortifications??....like what?....dragons teeth, "Berlin Wall"?.....there's mines, we all know that....also the strip of land from the contact point to the Azov is something like 65 kms...protected by Pantsirs,S400s, other conventional batteries, AAs,& SAM'S....F16s & Gripens will love those for target practice.

Yesterday UAF pushed out orcs from Orlivka(Donetsk area), and retook Krasnohorivka I'm told....also Donetsk area.....which isn't very far from Donetsk city.....which I figured would be further.

And just hearing that Pantsirs have been hit on RF territory

Belgorod being hit by drones....big bangers.

And Crimea getting hit again...with big bangers.

Konigsberg now is in the middle of a NATO lake?....BSF has no safe port....bummer.....

 

What's the point? I "condemn" the barbaric acts, do you feel happy now? Why do people, particularly in politics attach this weird obsession with "condemnation". As though you won some morale prize for saying. At this point, the word "condemn" is like the fist raise.

 

"The interventionists will meet a tragic end," Putin said as a reference to French President Emmanuel Macron's statement that there was "no agreement" on the possibility of sending Western ground forces to Ukraine, but that "nothing should be ruled out."

"We also have weapons that can attack targets on enemy territory," Putin added. "There is a real threat of the use of nuclear weapons and a conflict that will lead to the destruction of civilization. Can't they see that?"

Most NATO allies, including the United States, Germany, Poland and Britain, have ruled out sending ground troops to Ukraine.

https://twitter.com/sxdoc/status/1763242139335487806

Macron must have the guts to risk a nuclear war with Russia, if France decides to go it alone and sends ground troops to Ukraine. Paris would be reduced to ashes in the worst case scenario.

 

That's funny....I recall Dwarfstan threatening to reduce everyone and anyone to ashes when HIMARS, Patriots, Abrams, Storm Shadows, SCALPS, Leopards were sent to Ukraine ....another one of those "red lines"?

 

Still you can’t condemn the barbaric act by Russia.

But here, post after post you telling West to bow to Putin and give him what he wants.

I am sorry . that will not happen. NATO will not bow to Putin or any Russian aggression.

 

France has Nuke too. Just like Paris, Moscow would be reduced to ashes in the worst case scenario as well.

May be someone should tell that to Putin. There are more Nuke pointed to Moscow then Russian Nuke pointed to EU or USA.

 

That's ****ing stupid. Negotiation and diplomacy is not 'bowing'. Why are people like you so hungry for death and suffering when it could so easily be avoided? Oh, here comes your "yeah, it could be avoided if Putin surrenders" or some other useless BS.

Who started it, who is barbaric, and all that other useless nonsense is irrelevant. We are where we are. We can end it with a minimum of human life lost, or we can keep the meatgrinder going. The longer we go, the worse it is going to get for Ukraine. NATO is not coming, and support is dwindling.

 

Putin doesn’t have to surrender. All he has to do leave Ukraine and all the killing and suffering ends.

 

He will still perceive a threat from NATO, especially as they continue expanding. You know as well as I do that that will be a non-starter for him. The more NATO expands, the more he feels threatened, and the more precarious the global situation becomes.

 

Sweden has already saddled up....2 B1Bs landed in Stockholm yesterday....transition has already started....Konigsberg sits in the middle of a NATO lake....they must feel the heat....LOL.

 

That’s Putin’s problem if he is threatened. USA and NATO members don’t create their defense strategy based on what the f*** Putin feeling is.

 

The killings started in 2014 and went on for 8 years before Russia stepped in.