Here is the smoking gun evidence in the hush money trial

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Patricio Da Silva, Apr 23, 2024.

  1. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    There appears to be a point of contention about the fact that the 12 checks of $35k each went to Cohen to total $420,000. So, how could that be? Or so the argument goes-- because, we know how much of a tightwad Trump is, right? He never ever would pay more than twice as much to a lawyer than was needed, as he only owed Cohen (assuming he did owe him) only $130K, right? Trump's not going to pay back $420k, for a $130k debt, right? So it doesn't make sense, therefore, this whole claim is bunk.

    Right?

    Wrong.

    Rachel Maddow in the clip below, reads from the court Transcript. Turns out that Weisselberg wrote all of this down, even on side notes on bank statements, the nature of the conspiracy. So, this is 'smoking gun' evidence. (Note that the court transcript Maddow is reading was taken from the Prosecutor's opening argument, which occurred on today [Monday 4/22] ).



    And if you can't watch the 10 minute clip from her one hour show, below is a transcript from the video:

    MADDOW:
    I was at the courthouse today in Manhattan. I was in the courtroom for opening statements for this first criminal trial of a former president.

    [...truncated irrelevant court room description...]

    [Maddow reads from the court transcript (non transcript items in brackets) ]

    Prosecutor Matthew Colangelo: "In January, 2017, before the defendant moved to Washington to begin his presidency, Michael Cohen met with Alan Weisel Burke of the Trump Organization to talk about how Michael Cohen was going to be reimbursed for the payoff to Stormy Daniels. Weisselberg you will remember is one of Trump Org's Chief Financial Officers. He was the one of the defendant's longest-serving and most trusted employees.

    Neither Trump nor the Trump Organization could just write a check to Michael Cohen for $130,000.00 with a memo line that said, "Reimbursement for star payoff"; They had to disguise the nature of the repayment. So they agreed to cook the books and make it look like the repayment was actually income, payments for services rendered instead of a reimbursement. Allen Weisselberg asked Mr. Cohen to bring a copy of a bank statement showing the $130,000.00 payment Michael Cohen had made to keep Stormy Daniels quiet before the election. Weisselberg and Cohen agreed to a total repayment amount of $420,000.00.

    Here's how they got to that number. This is good. They started with $130,000.00 that Trump road Michael Cohen for the Stormy Daniels payoff. Then, they added $50,000.00 for a separate reimbursement Cohen was claiming, which had to do with tech services he paid for during the campaign. That adds up to $180(k). Then they agreed to double that amount to $360,000 to account for taxes. Now, of course, if Trump was just reimbursing Michael Cohen, there was no need to gross it up for taxes. They doubled it because their plan was to call it income instead of a reimbursement.

    If Michael Cohen was getting money they were calling income, he would have to pay taxes on it. Cohen was close to a 50% tax bracket, so to make them whole on the $180,000 the defendant told him, they had to double the amount to $360(k). Then, he added another $60,000 as a year-end bonus and all that comes out to a total of $420,000. And Allen Weisselberg wrote all of that down! Whereupon I annoyed the people sitting near me because I snorted out loud. 'Whoo,He wrote it all down?" If you were a fan of 'The Wire,' this is the scene where Stringer Bell turns to the young man and says are you taking notes on it on a criminal conspiracy? Using a lot of swear words. Yes, yes, He was taking notes on a criminal conspiracy. Prosecutor Matthew Colangelo: "Allen Weisselberg wrote all of that down. (Maddow takes a deep breath, "I can't believe this is real!")

    The bank statement I told you about that he asked Michael Cohen to bring to their meeting, the bank statement from the Essential Consultants account, which showed the $130,000 wire Cohen had made to keep (Keith) Davidson (Nat Enquirer exec) to keep Stormy Daniels quiet, you will see in this trial Allen Weisselberg's handwriting down the side of that bank statement laying out every one of the steps that I just described, showing how they converted the $130,000 payoff amount to the 420 grand Cohen was going to get paid back as he grossed up way to disguise it not as reimbursement but as income and they took notes about it every step of the way and the prosecution has the notes.

    (And then here's the kicker) Matthew Colangelo: "Michael Cohen and Allen Weisselberg met with Trump, who approved the repayment amount of 420 grand on the $130,000 Stormy Daniels payment and a few other expenses. You will see evidence at trial that Trump was a very frugal businessman. He believed in pinching pennies, he believed in watching every dollar, he believed in negotiating every bill. It is all over all of the books he has written. He ran the Trump Organization with total control. You will hear testimony about his relentless focus on the bottom line. When it came time to pay Michael Cohen back for the catch and kill deal, you will see he didn't negotiate the price down, he doubled it and he doubled it so they could disguise it as income. You will hear evidence the Trump Organization was not in the practice of paying people twice what they owed for anything. This might be the only time that ever happened. Trump's willingness to do so here shows just how important it was to him to hide the true nature of Cohen's illegal payment to Ms. Daniels and the overall election conspiracy that they had launched in August, 2015."

    (Prosecutors saying Trump is paying a lot for this and he never pays for anything. That is how important and sensitive this was. Interestingly, moments later, the defense used the same set of facts to make the opposite point to the jury, saying yes, Trump really is so cheap and so unwilling to pay for anything so, this must have been some other thing he was paying for, not the thing they have HANDWRITTEN NOTES FROM HIS CFO ABOUT)


    Now, how Bragg got '34 counts'? -- note that there were 34 entries related to the 12 checks, so I don't know how that is figured, but, that's beside the point. In NY, false business records are a misdemeanor, unless they were to used to cover up a felony, and the felony doesn't have to be a state crime, or within the statute of limitations. That's NY law, as I understand it.

    But, what were those laws that Trump supposedly broke, relating to Stormy Daniels that elevated the misdemeanor false business entries?

    I don't know what is in the charging document, but I queried Copilot, and it reports the following (potential crimes)
    1. Federal Election Campaign Act (FECA): This law governs federal campaign finance regulations. Key provisions include:
      • Contribution Limits: FECA sets limits on how much individuals, corporations, and other entities can contribute to political campaigns.
      • Reporting Requirements: Candidates and committees must disclose contributions and expenditures to the Federal Election Commission (FEC).
      • Prohibition on Corporate Contributions: Corporations are generally prohibited from making direct contributions to federal candidates.
    2. Violation of Contribution Limits: If the $130,000 payment to Stormy Daniels was considered a campaign contribution, it should have been reported as such. Concealing it could be a violation of contribution limits.
    3. False Statements: Making false statements or providing false information to the FEC is also a violation. If Trump’s team knowingly misrepresented the purpose of the payment, it could be considered a false statement.
    4. Conspiracy: If multiple individuals conspired to hide the payment, they could be charged with conspiracy to violate campaign finance laws.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
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  2. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    Since when is a State allowed to charge someone with a violation of a Federal law?
     
  3. popscott

    popscott Well-Known Member Donor

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    Mueller really sucked at his job if he didn't catch this one and at least touch on it...

    ""Neither Trump nor the Trump Organization could just write a check to Michael Cohen for $130,000.00 with a memo line that said, "Reimbursement for star payoff"; They had to disguise the nature of the repayment.""
    Just put "loan payment" on the bottom of the check.....like others we know...

    The question no one asked.... was Cohen having a sexual relationship/affair with Stormy?
     
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  4. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    He may have but he specifically said he had no authority to investigate the president.
     
  5. popscott

    popscott Well-Known Member Donor

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    There is a 187 page report that says you are wrong.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
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  6. StillBlue

    StillBlue Well-Known Member

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    Mueller: ‘If we had had confidence that the President clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so’
     
  7. popscott

    popscott Well-Known Member Donor

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    Nice try..... SC prosecutor Mueller either charges with the evidence from his investigation....or he drops any investigation due to lack of evidence...
     
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  8. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    Apparently you don't know how the Justice system in the US is supposed to work. All that quote does is show Mueller putting his finger on the political scales.
     
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  9. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    The 34 felony counts are all state crimes. If the counts were nothing but the false entries in the books, they would have remained as misdemeanors, but since the deception was designed to cover up a felony (campaign finance violations, and other possible violations committed at the federal level, ) NY state law has it that those misdemeanors are elevated to felonies. Trump is not being charged with federal crimes. He is being charged with state crimes that have been elevated to felonies. NY law allows for this.

    Bragg explained this when he announced the charges on TV, did you not watch it?

     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
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  10. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    No, Mueller is explaining that the report cannot be construed as exonerating Trump. There is nothing political in his explanation.
     
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  11. Hey Now

    Hey Now Well-Known Member

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    That's a drop the mic moment, right there....
     
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  12. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Mueller did not investigate Trump. He found Trump committed crimes as he investigated others.

    On a side note, it's not that Mueller was great at his job. His investigation was thorough, but his actions after he submitted it were not as assertive as they should have been.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
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  13. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    Except of course that there is no case involving campaign finance violations before any federal court in which Trump is involved. There isn't even one planned. And our Justice system is supposed to be on based on innocent until proven guilty. How can Trump be guilty of a "deception designed to cover up a felony" when no felony is or has or will be charged?
     
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  14. popscott

    popscott Well-Known Member Donor

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    Prosecutors don’t exonerate or even make that claim… Judges and juries do…prosecutors either indict or dismiss with lack of evidence.
     
  15. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    Then why didn't the report recommend charges? And don't give me that line about DOJ policy in regards to not charging a sitting President. That does not and never has applied to recommending charges to Congress. Nor did it prevent him from stating along the lines of "I believe Trump violated XXX laws and here's why..." in the report. Even laymen know that. All that it applies to is not charging a sitting President.
     
  16. popscott

    popscott Well-Known Member Donor

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    A White House official gave the opening statement that used to work in the federal DOJ… in a state case.. nothing to see here …… move along.
     
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  17. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    That's right. Ten jurors need to be convinced that he falsified business records to hide a campaign violation to be proven guilty. This is why there are ten jurors and six alternates.

    It's like when you're indicted for stealing money. If the prosecution proves to the jury that this was done to buy drugs, for example, you get a tougher sentence than if the defense proves it was to feed your hungry family. Even if you're NOT being tried for buying illegal drugs, this makes the prison sentence harsher. Even if there is no trial planned for the secondary crime. But they DO have to prove that it was done to commit another crime to get the longer sentence.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
  18. Golem

    Golem Well-Known Member Donor

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    Because Trump was not being investigated and because he was not authorized by Trump's DoJ to recommend charges.

    That's an old story you should have known by now.
     
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  19. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    And it still is based on innocent until proven guilty given that the prosecutors will have to prove those federal crimes in court in order to elevate the misdemeanors to felonies.

    Did you not read the OP? it establishes proof.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
  20. Kal'Stang

    Kal'Stang Well-Known Member

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    Something that they have no jurisdiction to do. That has to be done in a FEDERAL court. Not a State court.
     
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  21. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    I am , as many democrats are, of the opinion that Mueller should have disregarded the OLC memo, and have come right out and sent Vol II's findings to the DOJ to empanel a grand jury. He made that decision unilaterally.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
  22. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    They have no jurisdiction to charge federal crimes in a state trial, but the DA does have the right to make that determination about those crimes because New York state law requires it. If what you are saying were true surely defense council would be raising the issue and they are not. And no, a federal court won't do it because of the statute of limitations being surpassed, noting that, by NY law, those limitations do not constrain the DA in state court in the determination of elevating a misdemeanor to a felony.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2024
  23. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    There doesn't have to be. You not understanding how the law works doesn't change how the law works.
     
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  24. Wild Bill Kelsoe

    Wild Bill Kelsoe Well-Known Member

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    Because the rules are different when it comes to Trump.

    This has more to do with sucking Trump's coffers dry and keeping him off the campaign trail.
     
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  25. Wild Bill Kelsoe

    Wild Bill Kelsoe Well-Known Member

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    Explain how it works, in this case.
     
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