Acceptable number of Gazans for Israel to have killed in year after Oct.7th?

I get tired of the actions against Gazans being condemned as "genocide" by Israel.

So what number killed from Oct. 7th 2023 to Oct. 7th, 2024 would you find "acceptable""

Note I said "acceptable" Not good or moral

I can accept anything less than 50,000

 

Civil war battles had close to 40000 killed on both sides in a week long battle. Those wasn't called genocide.

 

Innocent civilians? As few as possible. They failed. Hitting a refugee camp, killing dozens in an effort to kill one significant terrorist - totally unacceptable. Under 1000 would be reasonable given the choice of invading gaza, they have precision munitions available. They don't need to collapse a building to kill one sniper. They didn't need to preemptively bomb whole neighborhoods.

Hamas operatives? Those who resist during the course of a criminal investigation. Retaliatory destruction of Gaza was the wrong move to begin with, but it's clearly gone far out of proportion to the damage done to Israel. But it's long been their pattern. Like boy throws rock, Israel orders air strike... to use some truthful hyperbole.

 

The eye for an eye answer: No more than were killed by Hamas. Yet my moralistic answer would be zero. My issue with Israel is that if we say killing Israeli citizens is evil, then it must also be evil to kill Palestinian civilians as well. To support one while denouncing the other is evil in and of itself.

 

Why?

 

Sorry. I am not sure what you wish me to expound upon. Can you be more specific in your question? Are you referring to my last statement in my previous post? I just want to clarify so I can give you a better response.

 

referring to this

if we say killing Israeli citizens is evil, then it must also be evil to kill Palestinian civilians as well.

 

I guess OP didn't get the memo on the new rules of war.
If you are Muslim group, its a free-for-all and no getting called out for it.
If you are a Jewish group, keep your weapons locked up and beg them for some hostages to be returned.
Everyone got it?
GOOD!

 

Because we are all the most highs children.

 

The question is what is an acceptable level of damage to Hamas. That is the purpose of this war and the Palestinians are just stuck in the fighting. They were there when Hamas launched all their attacks as well so their involvement is the same. Hamas is not a foreign military, it is Palestinians, Gazans, so how do we determine the guilt or innocence of the population?

 

As to the why; it is hypocritical to stand against one while supporting the other. I have come to believe that one of the easiest symptoms of evil to see is hypocrisy. Those that are good do all they can to walk their talk. The evil use hypocritical double standards.

It is our nature to subscribe to the thought of “if you hit me, I will hit back so hard that you will regret ever hitting me in the first place.” The thought is that a harsh response will make re-offense less likely. While this has utility in some cases it does not apply to all cases.

I argue that the violence between the two sides simply fans the flames of future conflict. If the desired ends is another century of conflict then both sides are doing a bang up job at it. To think that hitting the Palestinians brutally hard will reduce the likelihood of future attacks upon Israel would be silly. It may reduce it for a while, yet as time passes, unresolved resentments on both sides ensure that the horror of today will be revisited by future generations.

It is a hamster wheel of insanity that neither side seem able to exit from. It’s how evil works.

 

Not if you hit them so hard that all or at least most of them die

 

Basically they believe one can kill another for a mere slander

Where are these pro Israelis when that black schoolgirl battered the white girl for slander?

 

Funny how not a single poster seems to actually know anything, let alone account for, actual numbers with historical context.


Civilian to combatant death rate in war: up to 10 to 1 ratio.

Specific example: 1st battle of Fallujah US VS Iraq insurgency : 3 to 1 dead civilians for every combatant killed.

IDFs numbers: 1.5 to 1 civilian to combatant killed.


Israel’s numbers in a dense urban conflict in which virtually zero of the entire civilian population has evacuated and have still managed to maintain an incredible civilian to combatant ratio is, frankly put, AMAZING.

those accusing it of genocide or spouting whatever arbitrary number they feel like spouting based on nothing whatsoever other than their own bias and emotions are not worthy of consideration.

 

Unless Hamas releases the hostages and surrenders Israel will have to destroy Hamas with military force.
Israeli virtue signaling is really not very useful at this point. It has become a bad habit. War is hell.

 

How did you arrive at the number of 50,000 dead Palestinians?

Under international law Israel is the occupying power of the Gaza Strip and the Palestinian Territories. That means Israel has a duty and obligation to protect the civilians under its occupation.

https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/five-israeli-talking-points-gaza-debunked/

"It cannot simultaneously occupy the territory, thus usurping the self-governing powers that would otherwise belong to Palestinians, and declare war upon them.

"These contradictory policies (occupying a land and then declaring war on it) make the Palestinian population doubly vulnerable."

Legally Israel has no right kill any number of Palestinians who are resisting an illegal military occupation.

 

Hi! I am pro Israel. (You also said you were pro Israel) Please link the incident you are referring to.

 

It is NOT illegal military occupation. Israel won it fair and square.

 

Since 1949 the "civilized" world has passed international laws prohibiting states from acquiring territory by means of military conquest.

https://operationalsupport.un.org/e...y-tantamount-to-settler-colonialism-un-expert

"Israel’s illegal occupation of Palestinian territory, tantamount to ‘settler-colonialism’: UN expert"

Settler-colonialism has been the driving doctrine of the Zionist project in Palestine for over 100 years.

Collective punishment, ethnic cleansing, and, now, genocide are the means of turning Greater Israel into a Jewish majority state in spite of the fact Jews have been a minority (at best) in historic Palestine for most of that century.

 

The UN doesn't have the last word on this issue..

 

Yes they do Dayton .. that is the purpose of the UN friend .. to have the last word something a self professed expert in US History should be well aware of .. One would think ?!

So when the UN Say === Israeli annexation of land in Occupied Territories is illegal under international law .. that is the last word speaking.

The Palestinians have as much of a right to self defense against the illegal occupiers and annexation as Ukraine has against the Russian Annexation .. should we not be arming the Palestinians same way we do Ukraine ? .. or .. does it not work that way for brown folks

 

The UN has no controlling legal authority.


Israel is an ally of the U.S. that saved the lives of hundreds (at least) of American pilots during the Vietnam War

What have the Palestinians ever done for the U.S.?
Answer nothing

 

Making "moral" judgements about the number and manner of deaths is a useless exercise.

Either Israel or HAMAS will prevail, this is a war for survival to the bitter end.

It is not a war Israel asked for but hopefully one they will win.

 

It would not matter. Forcefully evict all Palestinians from Gaza and all it will do is inflame the Arab world thus ensuring a continuation of the bloodshed in the future. Israel acts against its own best interest with its heavy handed tactics.

 

Hamas is a legitimate target. Civilians are not. Killing civilians to save civilians is hypocritical and evil. Civilians will always die in urban warfare. It is unavoidable, yet it is also possible to minimize civilian casualties. I know Israel defenders will say they warn before attacks in civilian areas. Would be a great argument if it actually worked. But it does not seem to.

I abandoned my support for Israel once it became clear that Israel was killing more civilians than Hamas did and didn’t seem too bothered by it.