I have little interest in conspiracy theories, and the theists who use them are often dismissed in my mind. The arguments that lean on a vast conspiracy involving denial are simply astounding in the lack of logic, but maybe I will receive a response detailing the mechanism of which someone can logically state this? I have heard countless times on this forum that atheists deny god because they are afraid of gods laws. We all know gods laws are very strict, if you question god, refuse to tithe, or simply pursue the people you most attracted to, amongst a multitude of other victimless crimes, you will suffer for all eternity in hell. So lets say the atheist denies god because they are afraid of god (this obviously isn't the case, as any person with just an iota of reasoning capability should realize this, however, lets assume for a moment it is so). How would such denial help a person? If an atheist truly is afraid of burning for all eternity for victimless crimes, how would denying a god and pursuing this life style help the atheist? Is it just me, or does the conspiracy posted by theists deny common sense?
Why would such a person, so utterly unconcerned with Hell or God, spend all their free time railing against God and Hell? Spend so much time ignoring 99.9% of our faith to say it is based in fear of Hell? Well, anyone with an iota of reasoning knows why, and such behavior is sure as hell NOT the result of logic. Its a failure to apply their standards to their own positions.
It doesn't matter if the logic makes sense to we who don't believe. The logic is required for the more dogmatic believers to justify why we deserve the fate their religion claims is in store for us.
Yep, consequences of choice - for some reason ONLY atheists fear it. Must mean our faith and God are false.
It is harder to be honest than it is to accept someone elses concept of god to their face. Basically because the person will feel like his credibility has been denied. God ain't being denied by anyone because that diety has too many faces yet never shows up to represent truth
With how much the threat of hell is thrown around, at least in much of the US, this the kind of thinking thrown at many atheists. As for why, probably because of the effects or perceived effects the concepts of God and Hell have on our society. It did not take much reasoning or logic to deduce those answers.
The OP assumes that there is only two kinds of people: devout believers and strident atheists. There are people in the middle who believe in God, but do all they can to avoid thinking about him. They ignore God's commandments, knowing in the back of their head they will one day be called to account for their sins. I would put members of the Mafia in that category, or drug runners in Mexico, or men in France who have a mistress on the side.
I do not see how the OP assumes only two types of people. The OP just addresses an argument one type of person uses against another type of person, nothing denying other types, they just do not seem relevant to that specific discussion.
Thank you for predictably avoiding the issue. Would you like to explain your position further? Or simply ignore the obvious and rant a bit more?
I am not referring to that, I am referring to the same tired argument I have heard time and time again. The assertion that atheists deny god to escape his punishment, which is simply ridiculous and leaves all logic and reasoning on the door step. If a person honestly believed is a judgmental and merciless supernatural being, then denying it would do what? (*)(*)(*)(*) it off making the situation worse. Its an argument whose existence has no explanation other than theists trying to feel good about themselves by rationalizing the atheists position in a way they can understand in the same way that they repeat the notion of atheism being some sort of religion. Why a secret fear of eternal punishment is more comprehensible than the rejection of violence and bigotry is beyond me.
It doesn't say anything about whether God is false. But this argument makes the Christians who espouse it seem either stupid or arrogant to atheists. It doesn't take a whole lot of effort to figure out why: If someone doesn't believe in God, imagines how ridiculous it sounds when you say, "You really do believe in God, but you're afraid." That's not a profound philosophical thought. That's a schoolyard insult. But it's required belief if you think that belief in God is a conscious choice (which is not a required belief in Christianity, but one many Christians are attached emotionally to). Think of how ridiculous it would be if I told you "You don't really believe in God. You're just afraid that there isn't one and you won't go anywhere when you die." I have heard some militant atheists say this... and it's just as dumb no matter who says it.
Well said. As for the last bit, where they serious? I have made the argument (tongue and cheek) that those who believe in god on faith and no evidence will be destined to hell, and those who reject the notion based on evidence will be rewarded. Basically just an illustration of why one particular belief based on faith is pointless, its just as valid as the others.
There are a lot of atheists (well insofar as there are a lot of atheists) who seem to seriously think religion is the result of being less intelligent or being consciously dishonest with themselves. A lot of people just like to think they're special because of what they think or what group they belong to. It just goes to show that being an atheist doesn't make one immune to the flaws of being human.
I would agree; I do not believe the mere acceptance of religion is an indication of lack of intelligence. I know many intelligent people who are religious, however they can certainly be ignorant. Anti-gay rhetoric, belief that the world is 6,000 years old, etc. etc. Atheism is far from a sign of perfection, atheists harbor the same faults as everyone else in the world.
Hmm. No. Atheists who say this are pointing to what they think is a psychological point. They say God does not exist, and that the Christian is just deluding themselves into believing IT (God is genderless) does so they do not have to face death, which they are vastly afraid of (psychological studies show most people in America at least fear even talking about the subject of death). So I don't think your equivalency between Christians saying Atheists don't believe because they are afraid and Atheists saying Christians don't believe because they fear death really holds. For the Atheist though, I think it is a bit of a dodge to say to a Christian, you just believe because you are scared of death (even though I think it is probably true for many). It doesn't address the factual question of whether God exists or not. Now if there was some kind of knockdown argument against God that any rational person would assent to, and the Christian still affirmed that God was real, then the Atheist claim about psychology may hold more weight.
One of the main reasons religion continues to exist, is because people are too lazy to look at the evidence science has produced. Here is an example: How many times have you heard, if Evolution is true, then why doesn't it explain where life comes from. If they understood Evolution, then they wouldnt ask a silly question like that, as Evolution only deals with how life evolves AFTER it forms. If you take a good long look at the evidence for a natural creation for the Universe, for life and for life evolving, then the fear of going to hell for disbelieving' goes away, since the only logical conclusion is that there no god, no hell, no heaven. Just the wondrous Universe that we are part of.
