Do you support eugenics?

T4 was 71 years ago, bro.

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its brought up in page 3

then becomes a major focus of the discussion

 

You are attacking strawmen and asserting false dichotomies.

First, I am not advocating for the elimination of any racial groups. In fact, I am not advocating that we eliminate anyone, only that we not subsidize the least productive members of society to have kids--this seems like common sense.

Additionally, it is not necessary to declare everyone who isn't a friend an enemy. Do you go about your personal life declaring everyone who isn't your buddy an enemy?

Are you as rational as you have told yourself you are?

 

Eugenics is just the name of another system that tyrants think they can control.

The same egotism that allows man to pretend to control the laws that govern his own nature allows him to believe that he can outsmart nature itself. It's just a delusion. And nature does what it will regardless.

Man is a product of evolution, which by definition is a series of trillions upon trillions of individual choices. No small group of elite choosers can produce better outcomes than the billions of choices made by all of humanity every instant.

The only outcomes possible through limited choice(s) are negative outcomes.

 

Man as proven over hundreds of years that he can manipulate genes to his benefit. Man doesn't control the laws of genetics but he can work within them. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that stupid people tend to have stupid kids just like tall people tend to have tall kids.

 

And yet the engineering of mankind requires the control of more variables than man can manipulate. The principle of selection bias ensures that all the best choices cannot be selected by a small group of choosers.

 

Exactly. For example, would you eugenically get rid of sickle cell anemia? I wouldn't. Why? Well, people with sickle cell do have pretty miserable lives. However, people who are carriers of sickle cell (they don't express sickle cell anemia, but can pass on to their kids) are pretty much immune to malaria. Sickle cell anemia has probably saved a lot of people.

 

Agreed, and this is precisely why I wouldn't advocate targeting specific genes. The only thing I am suggesting is that we not subsidize people who can't take care of themselves.

I am bipolar, and it is a debilitating and miserable thing to have, but I understand that trying to eradicate it would likely reduce the number of creative people in the world, since the two are very closely related (over 40% of writers have mood disorders, for instance). That being said, if I can't take care of myself, why do you think it is okay to subsidize me having children? Should I be allowed to have a bunch of kids who will have both a genetic and environmental predisposition toward having problems later in life?

What we are proposing is a reduction in the number of people who have issues taking care of themselves and adapting to the modern world, for whatever reason. At the very least, this would weed out people who transmit bad cultural norms. It is a more humane approach than the conservative one, which is to just let people starve to death if they can't adapt while doing nothing to prevent the proliferation of such people in the first place.

 

. . . . So the kids can grow up in abject poverty, thus continuing the cycle of non-productivity?

 

Read the thread, or at least my posts, before you respond.

I already addressed this at least twice.

You take care of the people who are already here, but STOP letting them proliferate.

You do not have to do one to the exclusion of the other.

 

Eugenics and racism go hand in hand.

as we can see from this thread.

 

Possibly because I'm a Cracker.Yeah-that's probably it.
I have no doubt they would have euthanized me.
Good thing I wasn't there.

 

Also the arrogance of man.

 

Nope, it's completely rational to be concerned with actual peoples with lower IQ scores, and higher rates of criminality taking over your nation.

But, it's not rational to neglect the facts, and go after Polish who have high IQ scores, and low rates of criminality.

That's a major difference.

One is concerned based on fact, while one is based on slandering.

That's totally different.

I'd also be concerned if people started blaming Chinese as dumb, criminal, or for the Holocaust, as that's not true either.

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I actually used to think you were Black.

 

You actually thought wrong.

 

sorry buddy, but bigotry against Poles makes just as much sense as bigotry against Jews, Irish, blacks, Muslims, Hispanics, Gypsies, Gays etc.

someday, you'll understand.

 

I haven't even bashed Gypsies here yet, nor have I really bashed Gays here, and I only took a stab at the Irish for the IRA, but the IRA is FACTUAL.

As for Jews, I think Eastern Europeans, and Muslims have the right to be concerned, considering what was done to them.

As for the rest of them, I think the threats of their IQ scores, and criminality speaks for themselves.

Even though I haven't bashed Gypsies, yes, here it comes, they do fit in this category too.

As for Polish?
They have a long history of honorable bravery, and have low murder rates, and high PISA scores, and IQ scores, literacy rates, lack of Holocaust collaborators.

So, absolutely those who bash Polish, are generally bashing based not on fact, but on slander / libel.

 

Ashkenazi Jews have VERY high IQs.

so by your logic, you should love Jews.

but you don't.




like I said, if its ok to hate Jews, blacks, Muslims, Irish, Germans, Hispanics.....then its ok to hate POLES

 

I don't care for Jews, because they killed Polish, and their anti-Polish hatred, which is downright ungrateful considering what Poland did to help them for 800 years, or so.

I also don't care for Jews, because of their Liberal positions, and worse, how they've played a role in promoting Liberalism into the mainstream.

 

and many people have lots of "good" reasons to hate POLES

 

Most of what I've heard against Polish, is downright slander / libel.

Poland's #3 in Europe in PISA scores, and #2 in Europe in Software developers, yet we hear Polish are dumb.

Poland's #1 in Europe in Righteous Among the Nations,who saved Jews from the Holocaust, Poland was the first to fight the Nazis, and Poland was #2 in Holocaust deaths, behind Jews, yet we hear Poland did the Holocaust.

Poland's murder rate is among the lowest in Europe, and Polish criminal rates are about average in the U.K, and Poland didn't take part in criminal Colonialism, yet we hear Polish are criminal.

Poland's alcoholism / alcohol consumption, is among the lowest in Northern Europe, and yet we hear Polish are a bunch of alcoholics.

I could keep on going, on, and on.

 

sounds like denial of the truth.

the people in Britain, Russia, Germany, Ukraine, who hate Poles, must have a good reason for hating Poles.

i mean, NO ONE hates people for 100% irrational or illogical reasons, right?

all bigotry is based on some truth, right?

 

Tolerance, and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society - Aristotle.

With that said, Humanity was overwhelmingly intolerant through out most of it's existence.

Humanity survived anyways, so how do you figure Humanity won't survive without tolerance?

Actually, I agree with Aristotle, that tolerance, and apathy are found in dying societies, because they begin to tolerate things which will destroy them from within.

 

so what about all the nations that tolerate Polish immigrants?

 

Russians, and Ukrainians today aren't very anti-Polish.

While Germans are more anti-Polish, and Brits are ridiculously anti-Polish, they really have no reason to be.

Polish helped saved Germans from Islamic Ottoman Turks, with Polish Jan III Sobieski, and the Polish Winged Hussars, in the Battle of Vienna.

Polish helped saved Britain, from Nazi Germany, in the Battle of Britain, when the best squadron was the Polish Koskiuszko 303 Squadron.

But, then again look at the history of Germany, and Britain, they've obviously been among the least civil people in the history of Humanity.

What Germany did in 2 World wars, and Britain did in the British Empire is downright disgraceful.

 

sure they do.

bigotry is always based on some truth