Einstein's error (like most other non-believers

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Mitt Ryan, Nov 19, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I want to explain briefly why evil must exist in this world because one of the reasons why people hold back into believing in the existence of God is because of the evil that goes on. To do this I want to use Albert Einstein who was known to be a non-believer in God to convey my point.

    Albert Einstein was a German-born theoretical physicist who developed the theory of general relativity, effecting a revolution in physics. For this achievement, Einstein is often regarded as the father of modern physics and one of the most prolific intellects in human history.
    So, what was the reason Albert Einstein rejected the existence of a personal God? Einstein recognized the remarkable design and order of the cosmos, but could not reconcile those characteristics with the evil and suffering he found in human existence. How could an all-powerful God allow the suffering that exists on earth?

    Einstein's error ( like most other non-believers)

    Einstein's failure to understand the motives of God are the result of his incorrect assumption that God intended this universe as His ultimate perfect creation. Einstein could not get past the moral problems that are present in our universe.

    He assumed, as most atheists do, that a personal God would only create a universe which is both good morally and perfect physically. However, according to Christianity, the purpose of the universe is not to be morally or physically perfect, but to provide a place where spiritual creatures can choose to love or reject God - to live with Him forever in a new, perfect universe, or reject Him and live apart from Him for all eternity.

    It would not be possible to make this choice in a universe in which all moral choices are restricted to only good ones. Einstein didn't seem to understand that one could not choose between good and bad if bad did not exist. It's amazing that such a brilliant man could not understand such a simple logical principle.

    Conclusion

    No, Albert Einstein was not a Christian or even a theist (one who believes in a personal God), probably because he failed to understand why evil existed. These days, those who fail to understand the purpose of evil not only reject the concept of a personal God, but also reject the concept of God's existence altogether.

    If you are an agnostic or atheist, my goal for you would be to recognize what Albert Einstein understood about the universe - that its amazing design demands the existence of a creator God. Then, go beyond Einstein's faulty understanding of the purpose of the universe and consider the Christian explanation for the purpose of human life and why evil must exist in this
    world.
     
  2. Beast Mode

    Beast Mode New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,106
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    1. What's a spiritual creature?
    2. What's a non spiritual creature?
    3. What do you mean by 'forever' and eternity?
    4. What do you mean by a perfect universe, one that isn't so amazingly designed?
    5. What's the difference if you live with or apart from 'Him', 'forever'?
    6. Why is choosing necessary?
    7. Can you even prove that we have the ability to freely choose?
     
  3. Vicariously I

    Vicariously I Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2012
    Messages:
    2,737
    Likes Received:
    42
    Trophy Points:
    48
    The inner workings of the simple mind.

    You have achieved a complete misunderstanding of Albert Einstein’s findings and beliefs with such precision I have to say I'm impressed.

    When you are talking about a historical figure it would behoove you to post actual references to support your opinions regardless of how amusing they are.
     
  4. Vicariously I

    Vicariously I Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2012
    Messages:
    2,737
    Likes Received:
    42
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Wow that took me all of 10 seconds to find the link where you plagiarized some apologetics.

    http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/einstein.html
     
  5. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    So what?...lol

    What's the matter can't you handle the truth?...lol

    I'm just passing on what I wholeheartedly agree with.
     
  6. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Human beings...didn't you know that?...lol
     
  7. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Just that...forever!
     
  8. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    God's Kingdom of Heaven...paradise if you will.
     
  9. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    151,230
    Likes Received:
    63,413
    Trophy Points:
    113
    so what your saying is Einstein was in error because he thought god was perfect when in reality he is flawed, God was really a (as many believer believe) jealous, vengeful, mean spirited old man in the sky the judges people based on if they believed in him before there was any proof "him" even existed

    .
     
  10. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    To live with Him will be great joy and bliss, while living apart from Him will be great agony and despair.
     
  11. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    It's rather obvious your reading comprehension skills are flawed...lol I suggest you take a class in improving your reading comprehension skills...lol
     
  12. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Messages:
    63,174
    Likes Received:
    4,995
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Problem #1 with you entire premise:

    Einstein did not believe in a Creator God.
     
  13. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    It will determine where you spend your eternity at. Not choosing is the same as choosing to be apart from Him.
     
  14. Questerr

    Questerr Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Messages:
    63,174
    Likes Received:
    4,995
    Trophy Points:
    113
    How is it moral to decide someone's fate for all eternity based on the actions of a single lifetime?

    Its the equivalent of having a kid do something bad for one single nanosecond and then torturing them in your basement for the rest of their existence.
     
  15. Junkieturtle

    Junkieturtle Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2012
    Messages:
    16,045
    Likes Received:
    7,575
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Einstein was not a non-believer, he just wasn't a Christian. He was a deist. The premise of the thread starts out on faulty ground.
     
  16. Beast Mode

    Beast Mode New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,106
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    All human beings, or just specific human beings? And what are non spiritual creatures?
     
  17. Beast Mode

    Beast Mode New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,106
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I mean like are you talking about a continuum of time or the absence of time?
     
  18. Beast Mode

    Beast Mode New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,106
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I guess what I mean is if this universe is so amazingly designed already, what sort of improvements could their be in...how do you say it?....paradise?

    In other words, what makes it so much better?
     
  19. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4,750
    Likes Received:
    506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yes, as anyone can see there are already people choosing...there are the believers and non-believers who are expressing their beliefs on these threads.

    Just read their post and you'll be able to clearly recognize what side they are choosing at the moment.
     
  20. Prof_Sarcastic

    Prof_Sarcastic New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    3,118
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
    No, it would be an infinitely longer time than that. And, although the kid has heard your rules, he heard them from some other kid who heard them from some other kid who heard them from some other kid, he didnt hear them from you. In fact the kid had never even seen your face. And other kids are around, telling him that THEIR dad's rules are the ones he has to follow instead.
     
  21. Beast Mode

    Beast Mode New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,106
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    So the universe is so amazingly designed to have evil in it, so that you can pursue the promise of being rewarded (or punished) with a specific grouping of abstract emotions?

    So that leads me to ask, where do emotions come from?
     
  22. Wolverine

    Wolverine New Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2006
    Messages:
    16,105
    Likes Received:
    234
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Your conclusion could have been shorter:

    "In short, our universe with a God is indistinguishable from a universe without a God. Which why believing in God is so logical."
     
  23. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2009
    Messages:
    8,177
    Likes Received:
    1,075
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Ok, what makes you believe this? I can't think of any reference to the problem of evil other than that fabricated chain letter that went around in the beginning of the naughties.

    A fair chunk of scientists who reject gods do so because the more you know about the universe, the less special humans become. I would imagine that to a scientist who discovers the finer workings of the world on quantum and relativistic scales, humanity is unimportant on a physical plane. Would God break his own laws which hold on levels many times larger than the range from atomic to galactic because of some emotional commitment to a specific class of collections of matter? I doubt that a person with Einstein's experience with experimental theory would find that likely, and based on that in combination with his conclusion that the order of the universe requires a god, Spinosa's god seems like the only conclusion. That is consistent with any quotes I can remember (yours and "God does not play dice", which illuminates his view on Gods interference while failing to mention your explanation).
     
  24. Wolverine

    Wolverine New Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2006
    Messages:
    16,105
    Likes Received:
    234
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yet, so people are not Christians and do not live in agony.

    How does that work?
     
  25. Beast Mode

    Beast Mode New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,106
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    So the choice is already made for me? Got it. :blankstare:

    No I actually think this has more to it. Without great agony and despair, eventually great joy and bliss would be indistinguishable from any other emotion. Hence you'd just be a philosophical zombie. One vessel indistinct from any of the other....I presume 10-12 'spiritual creatures' that will be there.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page