"German Wings" crashed today in Southern France

That is the lesson we draw from this. There is no such thing as an aircraft accident without fault. Accidents are almost always a chain of events where if you took one link away, there wouldn't be dead people. I was a safety guy in two fighter squadrons for ~6 years, and I read all the reports.

You may say, "Well stumpwater, it's pretty easy to sit back and second-guess," but be assured gentle reader that I've never held back any opinions about unsafe behavior or actions. Call me a nervous Nellie or chicken little if you want, but if something can go wrong, it will go wrong.

 

I would guess that the only person of responsibility in this disaster that he told was his GP. Mental illness is not always apparent to even coworkers. His former employer before Lufthansa described him as, "dependable and inconspicuous". Not all mental illness confines people to bed, or have elements of psychosis (although highly likely in this case). Lubitz could have faked his Lufthansa medical assessments.

The tools and techniques behind diagnosing mental illness are utterly limited compared to the advanced medical science and techniques for diagnosing physical ailments. In the case of an airline pilot, I believe the right to privacy in relation to one's medical records should be fundamentally reassessed. This is, as far as I know, a completely unique case. In such a high pressure job, he will not be the first pilot to suffer from a mental illness and he won't be the last. Remember that Lincoln and Churchill suffered from life long conditions of mental illness.

Bottom line, if the onus was solely on Lubitz to inform his employer that he was medically unfit to work, then this needs to be changed immediately.

 

Not necessarily. Presumably only Lubliz himself would have provided his doctor with that information, via a box titled job description on a form.

 

Whadayagonna do? One of the most loathesome phrases is "There aught to be a law." The onus is going to be on Lufthansa ultimately. They and their insurance company will pay out the wazoo for letting a loony sit up front.

I read where this guy had ~600 hours. Jeebus. Not long ago unless you filled a diversity quota, no American airline would look at you unless you had 1500 hours and an ATP. These days you get 200 hours and a Commercial, and they let you sit up front with another jockey trying to figure out what the HAL 9000 is doing. A beginning airline pilot qualifies for food stamps.

I was an airport bum during my teenage years. If any plane turned a prop, I was usually in it. My favorite was one old '46 Luscombe that had valve covers that leaked so bad the oil would travel into the cockpit on the throttle and carb heat cables and drip on your shoes. I grew up and went into the USAF where I got ~1400 hours in fighters. These days I dread flying in an airliner. I don't care how many statistics you show me about Cockpit Resource management, you need a MFWIC (mo fo who's in charge) up front who knows where he's going and how to get there. These days the cockpit crew formulates their particular opinions and seeks to gain a consensus on exactly what the plane is doing. As The Duke would say, "Re GD diculus."

 

That captain [without capital letter] was an idiot.

The flight from Barcelona to Dusseldorf doesn't take a long time, so I don't see why he felt a need for leaving the cockpit just after 20 minuted from the take off. [A part thinking that he wanted to have sex with a hostess ...].

So, on board there was no captain ...

 

There they go, and I must follow because I am their leader.

 

The onus was 100% on Lufthansa to guarantee the mental stability of their cockpit crew. They obviously failed horrifically in this case. I am saying that, to prevent this happening again, that the onus must also be on the man's doctor to provide the airline with his/her finding that the man was utterly incapable of flying the plane. We can claim in hindsight that the doctor should have done this anyway, but we just don't know if the man's doctor was aware he was a pilot.

Then again for all we know these checks were already in place and someone fúcked up on a catastrophic scale.

 

Any Captain Must Always Have Access to any Part of His Vessel.​

Got Over Ride Code Technology ?
Not Airbus.​

Questions ?

[video=youtube;5yaetvTj5DE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yaetvTj5DE[/video] ​

Moi

r > g

No
​

 

Well, that's that then. Maybe if the pilot used over sized capitals he might have been able to shout the door down.

 

What's the point in reinforcing a door if the terrorists can override the code from outside?

 

The door's got a deadbolt.

 

THE CAPTAIN'S OVER RIDE.
Not anyones'.
Euros will never understand, "Command".

[video=youtube;TLYAyuf1I1Q]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLYAyuf1I1Q[/video] ​

Moi
Watch more Star Trek


r > g

No ​

 

I've always thought commercial aircraft should have parachutes under their seats..... they could have popped a door when they saw the jet getting below 12000ft and started jumping out!!! Though it would have been a shock due to the speed and no training, but I'd bet quite a lot would have survived given a quick instructional brief and boot out the door - more then none as it turned out.

 

What does posting youtube vids like "America the beautiful" and "God bless America" to do with this topic??

And what's with these childish, bold, capital letters?
It seems someone is extremely eager to stroke his super patriotic c**k.
Is that the way you discuss things in your neck of the woods?
You must be tweleve years old.
Just sad.

 

Just replying to some people who starte yelling "muslims terorism" & "islam does 99% of terrorism in the world" funny you never questioned why they started yelling that .

 

I dont see any argument here .

Why did Lufthansa "screw up" as they did everything required by law to make sure this was a safe flight?

Seems more like you dont like lufthansa for some irrational reason.

 

I probably have been a lot closer to terrorism then you, not that this matters. I try and use rational arguments .

Not at all, you dont even know my position on it as its irrelevant to the dicussion.

You made up/lied numbers I gave credible sources that showed you are full of BS and for the rest you just whine and whine.

https://www.europol.europa.eu/sites/...esat2010_0.pdf

https://www.europol.europa.eu/sites/...te-sat2011.pdf

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/US/01/06...ization.study/

6% for US, 1% in europe stop being so afraid as a little child.

This is reality.

 

They always pay, no matter who or what is at fault victims in such cases always get an immediate payout .

 

Again its against the law that a doctor would do this. Only in extreem cases can you do this.

Dont forget that any such warning would probably be the end of his career and put the pilot in serieus debt and no job .

Hindsight is easy and any such obligation from foctors willjust result that pilots already under a lot of stress wouldnt even visit doctors anymore out of fear for their job .

 

Sure you have.

Children love to stomp their feet in denial.

I gave you numbers for worldwide terrorism. Children tend to lie and cherry pick that which suits them though.

Don't be skeered. You're safer in Europe and the US. But your pals own the worldwide terrorism market. Adults tends to know that there is more to the world than Europe and the USA.

 

For God's sake, haven't you people ever heard of Flight Physicals? They are required in order to obtain renewals on licenses. The doctors are under contract to the airline and approved by the FAA; they hold no loyalty to the pilots.

Admittedly, I have no clue what is required of German pilots.

 

And as already stated he passed all these tests the initial test before becoming pilot who also focusses on mental stability as the one every x month thats obligated .

http://www.dw.de/germanys-stringent-pilot-aptitude-tests/a-18344148

"For example, the DLR test, which is the test that Lufthansa pilots have to pass, is one of the best known and probably simply one of the best in the world, and is used by various companies, not just Lufthansa. "


Here it was his own doctor .

- - - Updated - - -

Nope you gave a list of some examples. Still waiting for any credible study on worldwide terrorism.

https://www.europol.europa.eu/sites/...esat2010_0.pdf

https://www.europol.europa.eu/sites/...te-sat2011.pdf

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/US/01/06...ization.study/

6% for US, 1% in europe stop being so afraid as a little child.

This is reality.

 

A gave a list of Islamic terrorism all over the world. Don't pout.

 

The doctor who deemed him unfit to work had nothing to do with the airline industry.

 

Wrong on both counts. What's new?