Gnostic vs. Christianity

Why do Gnostics hold women as equals and Christians do not? The Gospel's of Mary are looked at differently as Mary was not a whore, but the was a Prophet and one of Jesus's closest. (I forget, but it was Peter I believe or Paul) That's funny... Peter - Paul and Mary!

Sorry... I'll get back to the subject. Peter I believe didn't like Mary and believed in the old ways as women are "underneathe" man and thus we are not to follow a woman.

The Gnositcs have women that are equals as we see is not the case within Christianity. Why is that?

 

The basic rule is that you need to provide some sort of link to back up what you say. What sort of evidence do you have that the gnostics treated women as equals? That sounds like historical revisionism to me.

 

I saw it on this TV show over the weekend. That Mary was close, but you are not going to find it on the web since it's saturated with Christian Propaganda and lies...

This is why the early Gnostics were murdered...

 

Have you even tried to find anything to back up what you said?

My guess you haven't even tried.

And now you've made another unsubstantiated claim, that early Gnostics were murdered.

 

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/archives/1979/nov/22/the-suppressed-gnostic-feminism/

Not at all sure that early Gnostics were murdered because they held women in higher esteem than early Christians/Jews. But they evidently did not suppress women the way Christians did (at the time).

 

This passage from the Gospel of Thomas is not part of the Biblical canon.

You can't use non-canonical texts as a source to prove anything about Christianity.

 

can we use charles manson as evidence?

How about ted haggart?

 

the biggest difference of gnostic and cannon text is that one is sharing that each and everyone is capable and the other claims you aint


for example; jesus taught people how to forgive and did not apply to the church leadership

or any cannon!

 

Now that is just ridiculous... Do you know who put The Bible together? Who decided what was "in" The Bibke and was was not?

That Book is written just as all the other Books were. From people who walked with Jesus! Thomas was an apostle just like John and Peter. Mary has a book also, and it's Gospel, but not accepted because of Peter from what I remember.

Why do you accept some writing from some Prophets, but not all? Is it because of their views on women?

 

I am almost certain that they were killed for this. All religions at that time did not hold woman as high as they did, and this threatened all that was sacred to the rest of the world. And they did what they did back then when people threatened what was sacred back then.

They killed them...

 

How about the concept of adam and eve;

baptism is based on it.

ie... women per se decieved man.

And that is genesis which is torah, which adhers to the matriarch system that the women is the blood line of who is jew.

but to read Matt 1, it is josephs lineage from david, claimed to lead to jesus, but joseph did not touch mary as it was 'god' who supposedly did mary.



Now if you really think about it, jesus aint from david because joseph didnt do mary, she was already prego.........and if eve decieved adam and why all mankind is supposed to be baptized at birth to wash away the infants sins, then to go home each nite and slap the wife for being women, should be OK, right?

but god help you, if you live in a jewish family and touch a women because mom will put a guilt trip on you that could crush a mountain.


isnt religion fun?

 

Ah...I see...so because the Nicenes didn't approve of it...it can't be used as proof against the Nicenes...

Nice logic you have there. I assume you like the fact that a bunch of men 1600 years ago decided for you which books were "holy" and which weren't without giving you the chance to check them yourself?

 

Ummm...hate to burst you bubble, but even though Biblical scholars don't know who wrote the books of the Bible, they are certain that the apostles did not write them.

 

The Gnostics weren't rejected and persecuted because of their beliefs about women. They were persecuted for their beliefs in Dualism.

The Nicenes (aka the Catholics) could not abide by the idea of people actually having different beliefs about Jesus so they either killed, force converted, or exiled people who did. Look at what happened to the Arians. The Nicenes/Catholics drove them to Asia or killed them in massive clergy-led riots.

 

The gnostics had not only the women as equals, but sex between couples was a regular part of their church ceremonies. It is a shame that they got clensed away with all the other variants of early christianity. They must have had a much more balanced life than what the catholic church teaches today.

 

Again, no link to prove anything.

 

That is silly. Biblical scholars use non canonical texts all the time to prove things about Christianity.

 

What is interesting is that the early Church did not believe in the Trinity doctrine (and in fact considered it heresy) until almost 300 years after Christ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tertullian

Perhaps the Gnostics had it right ?

It was Constantine that made the Trinity Doctrine .. and decreed monotheism and then set himself up as Pontifex Maxximus .. "Bishop of Bishops".

Constantine's word was then unchallengable .. he was speaking as Gods Bishop on Earth. No one could claim .. he does not speak for my God, because Constantine decreed that there was only one.

Persia had successfullyunited under monotheistic Zoroastrianism centuries earlier and Constantines governed in troubled times and needed to do something.

http://www.religionfacts.com/zoroastrianism/index.htm

 

But never to 'disprove'.

 

Not exactly, but I was under the impression they were written by the Apostle, then "revised" into what we see today. Like they all kept journals...

Is this not true? So, the NT was just "made up"?

 

Not necessarily made up, but Biblical scholars are pretty certain that the Apostles did not write the books attributed to them.

 

From what I saw, they were as it flew in the face of those first Christians.

Can you imagine back in those days a group who said that a woman could be equal to a Pope?

dead...

 

No... because there was no Pope at all then.

 

This came from a TV show, but they said that all The Books were written by those they are named after, then revised and put in copies after they compiled them. Like they took their stories to a publishing company...

 

Uhhh... yes there was....