How Can Americans take back their democracy?

Yes, assuming that Americans have a clue what they are is a mistake, I grant you.

 

Not at all! I've been to Australia several times and found it quite interesting, and the majority of the people I encountered were lovely people, quite warm and welcoming, but there's no way I'd ever choose to live there, at least not with the changes that have happened over the past 20 years.

Too much government control and you've allowed your government to steal your liberty in the name of "protecting" you.

 

LOL. An American lecturing an Australian on freedom.

That's like Napoleon lecturing Wellington on how to win at Waterloo.

 

I've been there and lived there and I was perfectly happy to come back to my socialist sh*thole.

Don't get me wrong I really enjoyed my time in the US but we have far better quality of life here.

My gf agrees as well. Shes an American but she has been living in NZ 10 years and has no desire to return to her homeland.

 

While I agree with the OP (unions also shouldn't be allowed to spend their way to legislation). To compare unions capacity to do so to that of corporations is silly. When the Citizens' United thing came about, the press (i.e big business) made it a point to say that Businesses AND the unions could benefit. Total crap. A few larger Chambers of Commerce can outspend the entire AFL-CIO.

Big business has the money to be able to spend literally 1000's of times what Unions could every hope to put into politics.

The idea that it benefits both of them is yet another brainwashing lie.

 

Really? Didn't I read somewhere not that long ago about the Australian government going in and seizing over 3 million firearms back in '96 and '97, and threatening to throw people in prison if they didn't turn them in? Never mind that the crime rate went through the roof right after that, and the fact that the criminals somehow neglected to turn in their guns, but everything's OK so long as law abiding SUBJECTS don't have the means of defending themselves.

What's up with "compulsory voting"? Vote or we'll fine you or throw you in jail? Why would you want a bunch of people, who don't know or care enough about the candidates or the issues to bother to research them kludging up the process??

Australia is the ONLY country in the civilized world with no Bill of Rights.

Hey, I could go on, but like I said, I like Australia.

 

Corporations evidently are citizens, according to the most recent decision allowing them to dump endless quants of money into the electoral process. The SCOTUS just awarded them personhood. (Let me know the next time you see a corporation taking basic training in the armed forces, or that live less than the average American lifespan, or rear a family.)

This democracy has devolved into a corporatocracy. We no longer control our own government. They corporations have achieved their goal pitting American workers against 3rd world workers, destroying the labor movement which gave rise to the middle class, and moving their money to wherever it most benefits them - not us.

We used to make steel. Now we make hamburgers.

It will take a massive collapse for us to get our act together.

 

Limiting shareholders' freedom of speech will not end the corportism, but limiting the ability for government to position corporations in a favorable position compared to their competitors would go a long way.

 

To answer this question I must pose another: what if in the begining of American democracy there were only 2 families: one went working and built a house, other went breeding?

 

Well, as usual, plenty of posts restating the problem but none addressing how to fix it.

Is it insoluble?

 

Correct, Einstein. We are a republic.

Look up the systems to learn the clear and unambiguous differences.

 

No it's not insoluable. Look th American system is very slow and ponderous compared to your little backwards city council sized government.

We can't just have a quick referendum and destroy the government in 10 minutes.

It takes us about 4-6 years to completely turn a government over. We're in that process now. Eventually the pols will get it in thier thick skulls that the American people are watching, and for a little while things will run smooth again, maybe 10 years.. and then we spend the next 4-6 years tossing those bums out and putting in new bums.

America has played this game for 200 years.. we've always had to two parties.. always had liberals vs conservatives.. always had large amounts and hate, anger and vitriol towards eachother.. and still we figured out a way to conquer the world.

Must be doing something right.

 

My tolerance for instructing Americans on their own form of government has pretty much worn out.

But I'll try once again. A republic is a state without a monarch. Some republics are democratically formed; some not.

Being democratically formed means there is some sort of popular electoral process.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic

America is odd in that it is a republic in which governments are notionally elected by popular vote but is actually run by Big Money and Big Religion.

 

OK. If you can't help yourselves, let us try.

Start by doing two simple things (neither of which would need a referendum):

1. Allow real access for 3rd parties to the political process by adopting proportional representation and preferential voting.

2. Drastically limit campaign contributions and advertising by business and union interests; and require full disclosure.

That wasn't hard, was it?

 

There has never been democracy in America.....it's always been a group of rich people (the electoral college)....who vote for THEIR interests...

 

A very good reform.

One may note that Tea Partiers oppose this kind of requirement like the plague,and given the huge amounts of money making a significant part of this movement nothing but corporate shills, it is a good idea for them. If anyone saw where the backing for the astroturf was coming from, it would be quite clear the only freedom they espouse is freedom for corporations to plunder. In every other area, they wish to regulate personal life to a incredibly repressive extent.

 

Agree with everything you've said so far, but how do we the people do this seeing as the CFO (Corporate Federalist Oligarchy) is now firmly entrenched? It seems no matter which candidates we elect now, we get the same result.

The argument between the Hamiltonian Federalists and the Jeffersonian Agrarian Democrats led to the Civil War. And though rightly, slavery was abolished forever, the idea of a Union of Democratic States was replaced with the Federal Republic of the United States, an entity unto itself, and now with the integration of the Corporate NEW WORLD order has become a CFO which cannot be removed by voting.

I had a glimmer of hope when Obama got elected, but now Im worried that even he may be part of the same oligarchy.

 

He probably is. He has to survive in the corporate environment. Despite that, he has done some good things.

 

One very good thing he could do is nuke New Zealand.

 

You can still own a gun, to hunt, or shoot in a club. Just can't go around carrying it, and no automatics. Doesn't bother the majority.

Like i link to people jailed for not voting.....in your own time

We have all the rights we need, you are free to do pretty much whatever you want, no bill needed.

 

What an awsome post.

Did you need long to think it up? Edit it ec. to get it just right?

Please tell me, so insightful and concise, i'm jealous!!

 

Thanks. First, I had a long day. It takes a bad day to get mad. After you get mad, you need to start hating New Zealand. It was natural for me. Then, I tried to think of something as stupid as possible.

 

NO,NO,NO... Fangorn Forest and Treebeard have survived the forces of Mordor, it would be tragic to nuke them now, now that Aragorn is the King of New Zealand.

 

No dude, they have a despotic democracy. The people are forced to vote or go to jail. It's either Aragorn or a dead Stalin, and guess who won.. da King.

 

No compulsory voting here. You must be thinking of Australia.