How Would A Rape/Incest Exception For Abortion Work?

No, that is just plain false. The reason is that medicine is not cut and dried like that. Life threatening conditions come with percentages - they are not binary. And, solutions come with all sorts of side effects. The result is that the law that prosecutors have to work with DOES NOT address the medical reality. Thus we now have doctors consulting hospital boards, lawyers, prosecutors and even legislators to determine what treatment they can give a woman without losing their medical license and going to prison.

More plainly, there are conditions where modern medicine can give women with certain conditions the best chance of life if they are allowed to abort.

Your 1940's medicine comment is just pathetic. Medicine is NOT somehow magically perfect now.

 

I think you are incorrect. He seems to be referring to cases specifically where the Supreme Court used the Fourteenth Amendment. There are plenty of cases that involved a very questionable stretch of the Fourteenth Amendment and used it in ways that were not foreseen or originally intended.

This could be another discussion, and is not really about abortion.

 

You don't have laws that try to define specific reasons or circumstances where abortion is or is not permitted. Instead, you have something that requires a doctor (or multiple doctors) to formally declare that in their professional opinion, the woman faces so significant physical or phycological harm as to make abortion necessary.

Doctors would based that on a purely clinical assessment. Obviously in the case of rape or abuse and resultant phycological harm, what the patient tell the doctors about the circumstances could be relevant, as could if it had been reported to the authorities and the status of any legal case. Ultimately though, the assessment would be based on an honest understanding of the patient rather than the specifics of the underlying circumstances. You can certainly have different principles at different gestations, less strict for very early medical abortions and some cut off after which only more defined and severe circumstances would permit abortion, but the starting point would be medical opinion rather than legal (or individual moral).

It is worth noting that this is essentially how it works in a number of places, typically where abortion isn't like as divisive or high-profile and issue as it is in the US.

 

I don't totally disagree.

But, remember that he called out contraception, sodomy, same sex marriage, LGBT rights as in the same bucket as his decision on Roe, and states an objective of eliminating that progress made on personal sexual freedom of expression and equality.

That can't just be written off as Thomas having a legal opinion.

He very clearly wants to change our society to more strongly match HIS opinion.

 

Yes, and his opinion is based on his hatred of women, especially Anita Hill..

 

But they are, and have. Democrats, including ms Yellen, testified in congress to exactly that. Do you dispute that she represents the administration and the democratic party in that regard?
Direct quote from Yellen...

"Roe v. Wade and access to reproductive health care, including abortion, helped lead to increased labor force participation," Yellen said. "It enabled many women to finish school that increased their earning potential. It allowed women to plan and balance their families and careers, and research also shows it had a favorable impact on the well-being and earnings of children."

Hmm.. I'm not wrong. This is what Yellen said. Sorry you had to find out this way.. Embarrassing, isn't it...

 

So you are saying the following is wrong? :

"Roe v. Wade and access to reproductive health care, including abortion, helped lead to increased labor force participation," Yellen said. "It enabled many women to finish school that increased their earning potential. It allowed women to plan and balance their families and careers, and research also shows it had a favorable impact on the well-being and earnings of children."

 

Read the important part though. Abortion, according to Yellen, is then a labor productivity issue for her. Its Economic, as she claimed. it isn't a human right, or a medical necessity, but it's an expectation, by folks like her, that abortion be used to ensure that those poor folk who find themselves in that condition an out so they can be productive in the economy. And isn't that really what y'all are about anymore? Productivity on the plantation?

 

LOL!!

OF COURSE abortion allowed for greater participation in our society by women.

The false statements by you have been from a different angle.

You repeatedly suggest that there are nefarious objectives in allowing women the freedom of choice.

Those nefarious objectives are total bunk.

And, if you honestly thought otherwise, you would have posted to me about those nefarious objectives.

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
So you are saying the following is wrong? :

"Roe v. Wade and access to reproductive health care, including abortion, helped lead to increased labor force participation," Yellen said. "It enabled many women to finish school that increased their earning potential. It allowed women to plan and balance their families and careers, and research also shows it had a favorable impact on the well-being and earnings of children."

On "the plantation"? Did you know this is the 21st century? It doesn't look like it.

See, on the plantation the slaves didn't prosper, only the owners did.....so Yellen seems to want what most DECENT people want : Poor people able to climb out of poverty.... to prosper ( YOU SEEM TO BE AGAINST THAT )
If women are no more than livestsock ( which the Republicans advocate) THAT would be more of a plantation complete with slave women..

 

LOL... Of course it's the 21st century. Democrats don't accept that obviously, so they create all of these little dependencies and expectations, like if you're poor, you're suppose to get an abortion so you can join the work force. Janet just slipped an admitted this in public. Kind of like you suggesting that women are livestock. I know, you asserted that you want us to believe that's a belief held by conservatives/republicans. Can you explain all of those minority women candidates then who are being elected as republicans?

As an aside. I doubt Yellen wants anything for folks, she expects things from folks, for sure. And what she wants isn't folks claiming out from poverty, but folks stuck in it so she has enough low wage workers to exploit. And for her, that means prosperity.

 

No, Democrats believe even poor women should have a choice whether to gestate or not.... they don't say they "should"....

NO, wrong again. Democrats do not want to ban abortion which IS treating women like livestock....what Republicans want.

So Yellen favors abortion so there will be MORE workers? What an illogical idea !!

UNANSWERED: So you are saying the following is wrong? :

"Roe v. Wade and access to reproductive health care, including abortion, helped lead to increased labor force participation," Yellen said. "It enabled many women to finish school that increased their earning potential. It allowed women to plan and balance their families and careers, and research also shows it had a favorable impact on the well-being and earnings of children."





See, on the plantation the slaves didn't prosper, only the owners did.....so Yellen seems to want what most DECENT people want : Poor people able to climb out of poverty.... to prosper ( YOU SEEM TO BE AGAINST THAT )
If women are no more than livestsock ( which the Republicans advocate) THAT would be more of a plantation complete with slave women..

 

LOL... Democrats believe that poor women shouldn't have kids. Janet told us that. if democrats wanted poor women to have the choice, they'd be driving birth control instead. democrats don't believe poor folks have the where with all to use birth control, lots of articles to support this, but only abortion can "manage" their inability to control themselves as democrats suggest. You believe this, right?

So, Democrats support abortion. Because to get the most our of the livestock democrats believe they own, they have to work, not be parents. Slavery seems to be the model democrats are using to manage this today by using abortion. Yellen suggests this is the "benefit" of abortion. So, it's the run roh solution to make sure, as Janet suggests, that women don't become mothers and all that which might impact their future success. (Because "success" to janet is labor force participation".)

In Janets world, the plantation owners do prosper. If we believe what democrats tell us, that isn't "decent", it's selfish. I don't think "decent" folks are supposed to be selfish, do you? And yes, poor folks want to improve their lot in life, and suddenly democrats agree? Isn't that ironic... Democrats suddenly believe in "pull up your own boot straps" suddenly, except that it isn't actually self dependence, it's reliance on government/plantation to overcome your own inability to be "responsible" and enter the work force.

 

So Yellen favors abortion so there will be MORE workers? What an illogical idea !!

 

I suppose that's just another one of Yelle's shortcomings, she's shortsighted...

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
So Yellen favors abortion so there will be MORE workers? What an illogical idea !!

LOL, NO, that would be you and your illogical assertions......and if you think she's wrong then what TF are you so concerned about ???

 

Is it any more illogical than illegal immigration?

 

You can cover for one illogical comment by simply posting another illogical comment.

 

Did everyone forget the thread topic ? :

How Would A Rape/Incest Exception For Abortion Work?

 

Y

You are misinformed and acting on emotion without much thought. Any abortion is a homicide! That is just a fact, but there is such a thing as justifiable homicide. My take is that it would be considered such in a rape exception.

The issue with women falsely claiming they were raped is an ongoing issue even if we aren’t talking about abortion. Can’t keep
Liars from lying unfortunately.

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
If abortion is banned because it is "murder" then ANY abortion is MURDER.

The Anti-Choicers canNOT have it both ways.

They want to look like they are such "caring" people by making exceptions for rape and incest but only prove that they are HYPOCRITES..

It is either murder or NOT murder.

The Anti-Choicers canNOT have it both ways.

THEREFORE raped women and the victims of incest MUST endure a lifetime punishment for something that wasn't their fault.....

I am not talking about legal definitions.

I am talking about the hypocrisy when Anti-Choicers suddenly change their minds on rape abortions and deny it's "murder" ...they say it's only "murder" if the woman had consensual sex which has NOTHING to do with what takes place in an abortion.


They want to look like they are such "caring" people by making exceptions for rape and incest but only prove that they are HYPOCRITES..

It is either murder or NOT murder.


HOW TF is an abortion due to rape "justifiable" ? What did THAT fetus do to deserve death ????????????????????????????????

 

No matter how awful the attack was, does she not have a duty to report the rape. Bad people thrive when good people are silent. Just look at the start of the metro movement, one courageous women steps forward and fights for the sexual assault to stop. She was a hero, the ones that stepped forward after her and told of abuses from the same man that happened years ago are not courageous, their silence let the abuse happen for long than it should have. Rape is an awful thing and I get there is trauma to deal with be rapist and molesters relie on the silence of their victims to continue their disgusting abuse of women. Thou she is not actively helping her attacker, her silence is put other women through the same horror she had to endure.

 

Again , you are mistaken.
it is the killing of a child, even if rape was involved. No way around the truth.

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
If abortion is banned because it is "murder" then ANY abortion is MURDER.

The Anti-Choicers canNOT have it both ways.

They want to look like they are such "caring" people by making exceptions for rape and incest but only prove that they are HYPOCRITES..

It is either murder or NOT murder.

The Anti-Choicers canNOT have it both ways.

THEREFORE raped women and the victims of incest MUST endure a lifetime punishment for something that wasn't their fault.....



I am not talking about legal definitions.

I am talking about the hypocrisy when Anti-Choicers suddenly change their minds on rape abortions and deny it's "murder" ...they say it's only "murder" if the woman had consensual sex which has NOTHING to do with what takes place in an abortion.


They want to look like they are such "caring" people by making exceptions for rape and incest but only prove that they are HYPOCRITES..

It is either murder or NOT murder.


HOW TF is an abortion due to rape "justifiable" ? What did THAT fetus do to deserve death ?????????????????????

About what?

LOL, tell that to the Anti-Choice hypocrites who think it's OK to KILL a "child" of rape..

And the truth is that it is NOT a "child", it is a fetus....and some Anti-Choicers don't think it's wrong to "murder" it because the woman was raped....but they think it's "wrong" to "murder" a fetus if the sex was consensual...PROVING they only are interested in punishing women for having sex and care NOTHING for the fetus.

The Anti-Choicers canNOT have it both ways.


BTW I see you HAD to dodge/fail to address all my questions or address anything in my post you quoted

 

No she does not have a 'duty' to do anything but heal her emotional and physical health. For some women reporting and testifying serve as way to switch from victim to survivor, and seeking justice becomes part of their recovery. For others, who are not ready the trauma of reporting and testifying can worsen the post traumatic stress. Blaming women who were raped, for what happens when a rapist decides to attack next is outragious. He alone is responsible for his acts. He can stop, or if he has a compulsion, can come forward and confess and let his jailor do the stopping. Its on him, all on him, and nobody else but him.