Illegal Immigrants... What should be done?

So, this is all about you huh?

I say get a better job. Go back to school if you must.

Sorry about your luck pal, but that doesn't validate your argument.

The US needs to expedite the immigration process to allow much easier movement into the US.

The people who are already here need to come out of the dark and start paying taxes.

We need to just stop talking about deporting everyone. That is never going to happen.

This country was founded by migrants and will continue to accept more as long as we exist.

 

Yes...but all those British and Germans who came here in the 1600s, 1700s, and early 1800s had green cards, dagnabbit!!!!!!!

 

US Border patrol agents recover nearly 400 human remains from the desert each year.

US immigration policy is immoral.

 

Well, if RTL got her way...the number would be much higher.

BTW, as an ardant opponent of abortion....I wonder how she'd feel about Border Patrol guys shooting women who were crossing the border without documentation....who were pregnant?!?!?!?

 

I don't know, ....as long as they aren't Americans I guess it wouldn't matter. Maybe RTL will let us know.

 

Well, it sounds like we need to enforce these labor laws more and prosecute more employers of illegals.

 

essentially yeah....

but for real its unavoidable. if a terrorist has innocent kids in a car and explosives and is driving towards the army base, its unavoidable. you have to open fire.

same situation here. theyres really nothing else that can be done

the mother shouldnt be putting her innocent child in that situation anyways

 

Leftists insist on imposing illegals on us. There really is no hope. Time to realize that the United States has become our enemy.

 

I'm happy to engage you in this discussion, but first you have to answer my original question: does a nation have a right to control its borders?

 

For one thing, no one can actually know how many 'illegal immigrants' there are, in the US. Saying something like 'millions and millions' has no true substance to it, and even 'special reports', or some other data, will, at best, be guesswork, at some level. Of course there can be total blind guesses, and there can that which are based on at least some sort of foundation, but no one can know. If they knew, they would have to know where they are, and if they knew where they are, they would be visited by your appropriate dept, I would imagine.

Even that said, if there are 'millions', even if you knew all of their addresses, the logistics of actually visiting each, and following it all up, would be so large, that it would chew up your system, somewhere down the line.

And the costs would be massive, and, at the end of it, it would probably not work.

Another reason why this would never be properly addressed? See the big rich guys, that look down on you, and have no real loyalty to the US? They do not give a crap how many illegals flock in to the US. Why would they? It is somewhat unlikely that any of them are going to rock up in the mansion on their street, therefore, they do not care. And it is only when they care about something, that things would change, you see. Not how it needs to be, but that is how you have it, until you change it.

Another reason would be that you can bet your backside, that a lot of those rich guys I spoke of, they probably make good use of cheap labour, somewhere down the line, and no need to bother about all those other pesky employment laws, that are there to protect workers. I assure you, even were you able to deport all illegals, there would be some seriously not happy v rich men, in the US. Which is why they won't even try, but from time to time, a little noise is made, just to convince you they are taking it all seriously.

On top of that, and going by what others say, your borders do not appear v secure.

I have not looked at where and how that could be improved, I appreciate it a big task. It again comes down to 'But what would be in it for the rich to do so'. At the moment, the answer is 'Not a lot'. Again, they do not really give a crap if your borders are like Swiss cheese.

Don't forget too, that there are those high up the pyramid of your country, who wanted to encouage mass NON European migration, to the US.

Actual people thought it up, and actual people wrote the legisation, to make it possible. If you feel that the immigration levels have been too fast and loose for the past 30yrs, I say, look to your legislators, and those behind them. Follow the paper trail.

It did not just happen by accident, and I am not sure it happened to benefit Americans. If it was, I fail to see that it has. But not was not the motive behind it, imo.

See, these legislators would sooner non European migration, and why? Because, for one thing, N Americans + Europeans would probably better assimilate in some sense, and they do not want that, as that means more unity, and more chance for the public to reach a consensus. They need you divided and confused, and unable to reach a consensus. Voila! Lots of non European immigration.

 

it was ted kennedy's fault.

 

Can't comment on that.

Other than to say, it is never one man, never. What I mentioned before, all of that takes far more than one man. It is tantamount to social engineering, by way of the measures that I spoke of. Follow the paper trail, and all those enablers and legislators, and above, they will all be well off, so really, what they get from this is none of the down side, that is to say increased crime, or other social issues (like i said, they probably live on a street that is 'exclusive'), but on the upside, they weaken the American working class and middle class, by overwhelming them with SO many different cultures, at one time, that a consensus can never be reached, among the working and middle class, against those that are really taking the (*)(*)(*)(*) out of you all.

It works well for them, because it creates the divisions that they desire, among the mass. There is no left and right issue about this, in the US, you must understand, the old school US conservatives would have been pretty strict on immigration, but the pervasive Neo Cons, quite contrary to the usual Conservative position, they were entirely supportive of it.

 

From the 1940s to 1964, Mexican workers were brought in legally under the Bracero programme based on an agreement with Mexico to import large numbers of Mexican farm labourers but the termination of the programme in the civil rights era resulted in a sharp increase in illegal immigrants from Mexico because the demand for braceros was still there. Moreover, Ted Kennedy's immigration reform called the Hart-Celler Immigration Reform Act of 1965 made it much more difficult for Mexican workers to obtain visas because there was no restriction on Hispanic immigration prior to 1965 and to reduce illegal immigration, the US may have to revert to the pre-1965 arrangement with Mexico by removing a cap on Mexican immigration and issuing tens of thousands of work permits to allow Mexican agricultural workers to return to the fields as legal braceros as long as they are needed by the American growers.

 

yep not so sure about the legal process that takes 10 years

 

would they get hear faster if we arrest deport or kill more people?

 

and again i didn’t have to do anything just being born here is a (*)(*)(*)(*) you to those pore folk on a decades long waiting list

 

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/washington/2006-05-15-legal-immigrants-cover_x.htm

 

Let me first say that I think immigration policy is to economic liberals as gun control is to the left. It's an issue that laissez-faire people should agree with me on because in principle you can support lenient immigration law with the same exact reasoning they do other policies. I'll elaborate below...

I suggest reading back to yourself what you type.

Amnesty isn't "letting people get away with crimes", it's abolishing the crime. There's a difference.

There's nothing wrong with wanting to come to the United States - it's the land of opportunity. Last I checked up until the early 20th century you had full and open immigration. Did the country explode? No, it was a golden age in America. Why? Because people move to the United States as price signals tell them that their work is more needed there.

People whine about how the migration of jobs overseas, yet immigration policy actively removes supply mechanisms from the US.

Furthermore, the crime is created by its illegality. This is the hallmark of bad legislation. Look at marijuana prohibition, same deal - the cause of ~100% of the problems associated with it is the fact that it's illegal. Pointing to its negative consequences as motive for continuing prohibition is thus completely stupid. Same deal with immigration, if they were bought under the system and given an identity under which they pay tax like the rest of us there would be no problem.

Seems reasonable. Bring them into the tax system and make them pay for the services that they're gonna use anyway.

Amen 100% on the first part.

It's not inviting them to leave so much as telling them to leave and forcing them to if they don't comply. A better solution would be inviting anyone who wants to join the United States to get a work visa under which you pay full tax. You finish the visa then you get full citizenship. If you go around our backs and try to sneak in then you are deported and that's it, you're never coming back again. Not for a holiday, not to work, nothing. The Libertarian Party ran on a platform similar to this, and it seemed to me to be a good compromise (if flawed on principle).

That's stupid. How is jumping a fence worthy of summary execution?

There is no difference between tax evasion and illegal immigration. You become a citizen and all that changes is that you pay tax. Why kill people on the spot for perhaps having the potential to avoid taxes? That's insane.

Exactly. Plus it's in everyone's interests. The United States gets increased demand as well as a large low+high skilled workforce. The average skills that most citizens have go unaffected. They're not stealing your jobs.

And what's wrong with immigration?

Exactly. What's lacking in the United States are manufacturing and office jobs. Furthermore, the increase in demand would be a gift to the economy.

Putting aside my disagreements with states period, yeah they should be able to control their borders, but that doesn't mean they should continue this failed policy. Most people of my opinion don't dispute the government's ability to patrol borders, it's a legitimate function of government enshrined in the constitution. But like with ridiculous levels of national defense, just because the government can do it doesn't mean it should.

Illegal immigration is an invented problem. I've seen it in my own country, Australia, where both parties go on about the massive evil of immigration via boat. It's practically half of their party platforms, yet only 2% of arrivals are by boat. They single this form of immigration out because they don't like the people it brings in: their opinions and their skills. Immigration laws are totalitarian social policy under the guise of legitimate government function.


Thanks if you managed to get through this post

 

They are breaking the freaking law and they're fully aware of it. THEY started it.

 

Maybe if they would stop trying to cross the border to get shot it wouldn't be that way. It's not like they have to come to the USA and if they really have to they should just get in line like everyone else.

 

So you'd be "cool" with a PREGNANT woman being shot by our Border Patrol.

Sort of cuts into your concern for "babies", doesn't it, RTL?!?!?!?

 

That pregnant woman shouldn't be such an idiot to begin with. Choosing to be an illegal is hardly a sound choice when you're pregnant. The law's the law, it's her fault.

 

Same old weakness, sadly.

Those that want to highlight what they believe is a real issue, and they may have a point, and yet, when it comes down to it, they always make the error of wanting to blame the symptom, rather than the cause. For as long as a society keeps on doing that, all you d is burn out energy seething at the wrong thing.

Maybe people are too stupid to look any further than past the symptom? Maybe people are too lazy to do so? Maybe they are too cowardly, and find it easier to blame the symptom and not the cause? Maybe a mix of all. But the fact is this. Even if you have something of a point, you will never change a thing, UNTIL enough of you have the brains AND the intenstinal fortitude to say who is the cause, and then, address the actual cause.

If this issue does matter to you, and you do want to look past the symptom, then do not forget, somewhat of the same methods that you are being put through, Europe is also being put through, and it is done for the same reasons + purpose that I spoke of prior. The cause here, is the same as the cause in the US. Don't blame the actual immigrants, they are being used as pawns, as well. Man up. Blame the cause.

Just think about this, because what I am saying is true, and it is the same driving force who are using this in Europe AND in the US.


Barbara Lerner Spectre calls for destruction of Christian European ethnic societies

[video=youtube;MFE0qAiofMQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFE0qAiofMQ&feature=player_detailpage[/video]

 

defending our borders against invaders

 

well... if a pregnant woman terrorist is driving a car full of explosives at a school.... of course i would be for killing her to stop her. yes its a tragic loss that the innocent baby has to die because of the mother's stupid actions...

but there really is NO other option