Jewish Refugees from Arab Lands

Discussion in 'Middle East' started by HBendor, Dec 3, 2014.

  1. HBendor

    HBendor New Member

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    Jewish Refugees from Arab Lands
    WATCH: Jews lived in the Middle East long before Islam. After 1948, over 800,000 Jews were expelled from Arab states. Today history was made with the first state ceremony to honor these proud Israelis.

    Watch their story in this moving video.
    https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10153702647732316&permPage=1
     
  2. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    most of them were NOT "expelled".

    they faced no expulsion order.
     
  3. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Stop with the propaganda.. Arab Jews left in 1948, 1956, 1967 and 1973... They would still be living all over the Arab world if not for the European Zionists.

    Why do you suppose more Jews were living in diaspora than in Palestine before the time of Christ?
     
  4. klipkap

    klipkap Well-Known Member

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    Jonstar and Margot said it in a nutshell.

    1) I was pleased to see that the OP acknowledged that the exodus of Jews occurred AFTER 1948. The significance of this is of course that the expulsion of ~700 000 Palestinian Arabs and Christians had already taken place. The departure of the Jews was therefore (at worst) a case of “tit-fot-tat”. If you don’t want crap on your own front step, don’t first dump at the doorway of others.

    2) Jonstar was spot on. Where are the expulsion orders? When we look at the summaries in Wiki of the exodus from Arab countries (click) we see that some interesting verbs are used to describe this exodus – verbs that do not include “expelled” as was claimed in the OP. These are, with numbers:

    # Morocco – “left” 18000 in 1948/49 (a minority, contrary to what is claimed in the OP); – “emigrated” 25000 in 1956 (Israeli invasion of Egypt); “emigrated” 70 000 in 1967 (Israeli invasion of Egypt)

    # Algeria – “Emigration” peaked during the Algerian War of 1954-1962 (i.e. long after 1948 as claimed in the OP)

    # Tunisia – “As in Morocco and Algeria, Tunisian Jews did not face expulsion or asset confiscation or any similar government persecution”. Following Tunisia's independence from France in 1956 (also the year in which Israel attacked Egypt), a number of anti-Jewish policies led to emigration. In 1967 (the year in which Israel attacked both Syria and Egypt), Jewish emigration both to Israel and France accelerated.

    # Libya – Immigration to Israel began in 1949, following the establishment of a Jewish Agency for Israel office in Tripoli

    # Egypt – Around 20,000 Jews left Egypt during 1948-49 following the events of the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. A further 5,000 left between 1952–56, in the wake of the Egyptian Revolution of 1952 and later the false flag Lavon Affair (by Israel). The Israeli invasion as part of the Suez Crisis caused a significant upsurge in emigration, with 14,000 Jews leaving in less than six months between November 1956 and March 1957, and 19,000 further emigrating over the next decade.

    # Lebanon - However, negative attitudes toward Jews increased after 1948, and, by 1967 (the year in which Israel attacked Syria and Egypt), most Lebanese Jews had emigrated

    Etc.; etc; etc.

    Note the total lack of the verb “expelled” or “expulsion”, contrary to that claimed in the OP. Also note that the greatest wave of emigration occurred in 1956 and 1967 the years of the major Israeli attacks on Arab countries, contrary to what was maintained in the OP. Just so understandable.

    Well done, Jonstar and Margot. Keep busting those MYTHs.
     
  5. HBendor

    HBendor New Member

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    You stop with the name droppings and the Arab fantasies, i.e. Hitler disliked Arabs and would not shake hands with Haj Amin al Husseini, you make that up as you go along... There is not anything positive you have posted anywhere... it is always Arab hear says that were mentally manufactured.

    Now as far as Jewish refugees are concerned, their story is genuine... does not matter when they were <allowed> to leave, but when a family man cannot find employment, anywhere because that was a government decree not to employ Jews, when you cannot send your kids to school, when you cannot put food on the table to feed your family, when you are dispossessed and forced to be a dhimmi in your own country of birth, this is an invitation to leave, you are no more welcome and your life and the life of your family is in danger for the authorities will not come to your rescue at any time knowing you are a Jew. Then you are forced to leave and this equates to deportation.

    About the Jews living in the Diaspora, many reasons is the answer. BTW did I ever ask you why 50 million Muslim live in Europe today?... Well this is your answer.
     
  6. Channe

    Channe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There are no Jewish "refugees" in/from Arab lands as the Jews are a religion. They are just Arabs of the Jewish faith.
     
  7. HBendor

    HBendor New Member

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    First and foremost Jews are not a race for they come in different colors...
    The Jews Are Not A Race!
    ~By Dr. Alfred M. Lilienthal

    Dr. Alfred M. Lilienthal, historian, journalist and lecturer, is a graduate of
    Cornell University and Columbia Law School. During the Second World War,
    he served with the US Army in the Middle East. He later served with the
    Department of State, and as a consultant to the American delegation at the
    organizing meeting of the United Nations in San Francisco.

    Since 1947, he has been at the forefront in the struggle for a balanced US
    policy in the Middle East. He is the author of several acclaimed books on
    the Middle East, including The Zionist Connection. He now lives in
    Washington, DC.

    On December 18, 1993 Dr. Lilienthal celebrated both his 80th birthday and the
    40th anniversary of his first book, What Price 'Israel'? Dr Lilienthal, who is a
    courageous anti-Zionist Jew, was joined by more than 200 guests who
    traveled from all over the United States to attend. The following excerpt is
    taken from this first book, What Price 'Israel'?

    Today, to trace anyone's descent to ancient Palestine would be a genealogical
    impossibility; and to presume, axiomatically, such a descent for Jews, alone
    among all human groups, is an assumption of purely fictional significance.
    Most everybody in the Western world could stake out some claim of Palestinian
    descent if genealogical records could be established for two-thousand years.
    And there are, indeed, people who, though not by the widest stretch of
    imagination Jewish, proudly make that very claim: some of the oldest of the
    South's aristocratic families play a game of comparing whose lineage goes
    farther back into 'Israel'. No one knows what happened to the Ten Lost Tribes
    of 'Israel', but to speculate on who might be who is a favored Anglo-Saxon
    pastime, and Queen Victoria belonged to an 'Israelite' Society that traced
    the ancestry of its membership back to those lost tribes.

    Twelve tribes started in Canaan about thirty-five centuries ago; and not only
    that ten of them disappeared - more than half of the members of the remaining
    two tribes never returned from their "exile" in Babylon. How then, can anybody
    claim to descend directly from that relatively small community which inhabited
    the Holy Land at the time of Abraham's Covenant with God?

    The Jewish racial myth flows from the fact that the words Hebrew,
    'Israelite', Jew, Judaism, and the Jewish people have been used synonymously
    to suggest a historic continuity. But this is a misuse. These words refer to
    different groups of people with varying ways of life in different periods in
    history. Hebrew is a term correctly applied to the period from the beginning
    of Biblical history to the settling in Canaan. 'Israelite' refers correctly
    to the members of the twelve tribes of 'Israel'. The name Yehudi or Jew is
    used in the Old Testament to designate members of the tribe of Judah,
    descendants of the fourth son of Jacob, as well as to denote citizens of the
    Kingdom of Judah, particularly at the time of Jeremiah and under the Persian
    occupation. Centuries later, the same word came to be applied to anyone, no
    matter of what origin, whose religion was Judaism.

    The descriptive name Judaism was never heard by the Hebrews or 'Israelites';
    it appears only with Christianity. Flavius Josephus was one of the first to
    use the name in his recital of the war with the Romans to connote a totality
    of beliefs, moral commandments, religious practices and ceremonial
    institutions of Galilee which he believed superior to rival Hellenism. When
    the word Judaism was born, there was no longer a Hebrew-'Israelite' state.
    The people who embraced the creed of Judaism were already mixed of many races
    and strains; and this diversification was rapidly growing...

    Perhaps the most significant mass conversion to the Judaic faith occurred in
    Europe, in the 8th century A.D., and that story of the Khazars (Turko-Finnish
    people) is quite pertinent to the establishment of the modern State of
    'Israel'. This partly nomadic people, probably related to the Volga Bulgars,
    first appeared in Trans-Caucasia in the second century. They settled in what
    is now Southern Russia, between the Volga and the Don, and then spread to the
    shores of the Black, Caspian and Azov seas. The Kingdom of Khazaria, ruled by
    a khagan or khakan fell to Attila the Hun in 448, and to the Muslims in 737.
    In between, the Khazars ruled over part of the Bulgarians, conquered the
    Crimea, and stretched their kingdom over the Caucasus farther to the
    northwest to include Kiev, and eastwards to Derbend. Annual tributes were
    levied on the Russian Slavonians of Kiev. The city of Kiev was probably built
    by the Khazars. There were Jews in the city and the surrounding area before
    the Russian Empire was founded by the Varangians whom the Scandinavian
    warriors sometimes called the Russ or Ross (circa 855-863).

    The influence of the Khazars extended into what is now Hungary and Roumania.
    Today, the villages of Kozarvar and Kozard in Transylvania bear testimony to
    the penetration of the Khazars who, with the Magyars, then proceeded into
    present-day Hungary. The size and power of the Kingdom of Khazaria is
    indicated by the act that it sent an army of 40,000 soldiers (in 626-627) to
    help Heraclius of the Byzantines to conquer the Persians. The Jewish
    Encyclopedia proudly refers to Khazaria as having had a "well constituted and
    tolerant government, a flourishing trade and a well disciplined army."

    Jews who had been banished from Constantinople by the Byzantine ruler, Leo
    III, found a home amongst these heretofore pagan Khazars and, in competition
    with Mohammedan and Christian missionaries, won them over to the Judaic
    faith. Bulan, the ruler of Khazaria, became converted to Judaism around 740
    A.D. His nobles and, somewhat later, his people followed suit. Some details
    of these events are contained in letters exchanged between Khagan Joseph of
    Khazaria and R. Hasdai Ibn Shaprut of Cordova, doctor and quasi foreign
    minister to Sultan Abd al-Rahman, the Caliph of Spain. This correspondence
    (around 936-950) was first published in 1577 to prove that the Jews still had
    a country of their own - namely, the Kingdom of Khazaria. Judah Halevi knew
    of the letters even in 1140. Their authenticity has since been established
    beyond doubt.

    According to these Hasdai-Joseph letters, Khagan Bulan decided one day:
    "Paganism is useless. It is shameful for us to be
    pagans. Let us adopt one of the heavenly religions, Christianity, Judaism or
    Islam." And Bulan summoned three priests
    representing the three religions and had them dispute their creeds before him.
    But, no priest could convince the others, or the
    sovereign, that his religion was the best. So the ruler spoke to each of them
    separately. He asked the Christian priest: "If you
    were not a Christian or had to give up Christianity, which would you prefer -
    Islam or Judaism?" The priest said: "If I were to
    give up Christianity, I would become a Jew." Bulan then asked the follower of
    Islam the same question, and the Moslem also
    chose Judaism. This is how Bulan came to choose Judaism for himself and the
    people of Khazaria in the seventh century A.D.,
    and thereafter the Khazars (sometimes spelled Chazars and Khozars) lived
    according to Judaic laws.

    Under the rule of Obadiah, Judaism gained further strength in Khazaria.
    Synagogues and schools were built to give instruction in the Bible and the
    Talmud. As Professor Graetz notes in his History of the Jews, "A successor of
    Bulan who bore the Hebrew name of Obadiah was the first to make serious
    efforts to further the Jewish religion. He invited Jewish sages to settle in
    his dominions, rewarded them royally... and introduced a divine service
    modeled on the ancient communities. After Obadiah came a long series of
    Jewish Chagans (Khagans), for according to a fundamental law of the state
    only Jewish rulers were permitted to ascend the throne." Khazar traders
    brought not only silks and carpets of Persia and the Near East but also their
    Judaic faith to the banks of the Vistula and the Volga. But the Kingdom of
    Khazaria was invaded by the Russians, and Itil, its great capital, fell to
    Sweatoslav of Kiev in 969. The Byzantines had become afraid and envious of
    the Khazars and, in a joint expedition with the Russians, conquered the
    Crimean portion of Khazaria in 1016. (Crimea was known as "Chazaria" until
    the 13th century). The Khazarian Jews were scattered throughout what is now
    Russia and Eastern Europe. Some were taken North where they joined the
    established Jewish community of Kiev.

    Others returned to the Caucasus. Many Khazars remarried in the Crimea and in
    Hungary. The Cagh Chafut, or "mountain Jews," in the Caucasus and the
    Hebraile Jews of Georgia are their descendants. These "Ashkenazim Jews" (as
    Jews of Eastern Europe are called), whose numbers were swelled by Jews who
    fled from Germany at the time of the Crusades and during the Black Death,
    have little or no trace of Semitic blood.

    That the Khazars are the lineal ancestors of Eastern European Jewry is a
    historical fact. Jewish historians and religious text books acknowledge the
    fact, though the propagandists of Jewish nationalism belittle it as pro-Arab
    propaganda. Somewhat ironically, Volume IV of the Jewish Encyclopedia -
    because this publication spells Khazars with a "C" instead of a "K" - is
    titled "Chazars to Dreyfus": and it was the Dreyfus trial, as interpreted by
    Theodor Herzl, that made the modern Jewish Khazars of Russia forget their
    descent from converts to Judaism and accept anti-Semitism as proof of their
    Palestinian origin.

    For all that anthropologists know, Hitler's ancestry might go back to one of
    the ten Lost Tribes of 'Israel'; while Weizmann may be a descendant of the
    Khazars, the converts to Judaism who were in no anthropological respect
    related to Palestine. The home to which Weizmann, Silver and so many other
    Ashkenazim Zionists have yearned to return has most likely never been theirs.
    "Here's a paradox, a paradox, a most ingenious paradox": in anthropological
    fact, many Christians may have much more Hebrew-'Israelite' blood in their
    veins than most of their Jewish neighbors.

    Race can play funny tricks on people who make that concept the basis for their
    likes and dislikes. Race-obsessed people can find themselves hating people who,
    in fact, may be their own racial kith and kin.
     
  8. Thunderbolt

    Thunderbolt Active Member

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    Most (if not all) of them would have been massacred if the State of Israel had not existed, because nobody else would have admitted them.
    And the bloody pogroms started not after the restoration of Israel in 1948, but years earlier, already during the WW II and were directly instigated by Hitler and by Grand Mufti Haj Amin al-Husseini.

    See http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007277
     
  9. Thunderbolt

    Thunderbolt Active Member

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  10. HBendor

    HBendor New Member

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  11. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    so a religious group can't be refugees?

    lol!!!
     
  12. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    The Nuremberg laws are very clear.. Jews were viciously persecuted by Hitler.. It is also true he considered Italians, Greeks and Arabs to be sub human ..

    I know the truth doesn't matter to you.. In five years you will still be claiming that Arab Jews were "expelled"... All this to justify theft and murder.
     
  13. HBendor

    HBendor New Member

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    How about this to disprove your Arab fantasy... Go there and watch this VIDEO

    Hitler, the Mufti of Jerusalem and Modern Islamo Nazism


    VIDEO(in German with subtitles)

    http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/videos.html
     
  14. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    The Book of Esther (3:8.) describes the Jews as &#8220;a certain people scattered abroad and dispersed among the people in all the provinces of thy [the Persian ernperor&#8217;s] kingdom.&#8221; At the end of the Second Temple period, Josephus Flavius flatly stated: &#8220;The Jewish nation is widely dispersed over all the habitable earth among its inhabitants.&#8221;2 Philo even regarded the dispersal of the Jewish people among the nations of the earth as a blessing, and he compared the Jews&#8217; dispersal to the Greeks&#8217; establishment of colonies.3 The destruction of the Second Temple did not empty the land of its Jewish inhabitants&#8212;many had already been abroad for a very long tìme&#8212;and in any case there is no real historical basis for belief in a wholesale exile at the hands of Rome. &#8230;
     
  15. klipkap

    klipkap Well-Known Member

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    No hijacking. Margot and I are still waiting for you to offer cogent and pertinent replies to Posts #3 and #4.

    You are becoming very transparent with your numerous strawman avoidances of valid rebuttals. You credibility is suffering.
     
  16. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    its not too nutty to assume the Jews were to be given a state after they created a viable community in Palestine
     
  17. klipkap

    klipkap Well-Known Member

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    I watched it.
    No surprises - the man is a thorough professional and I have seen another video of his plus read most of the marker scientific papers.

    So with me having watched your video, could you reciprocate and watch this one?

    [video=youtube;nPRgXAYTQlU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPRgXAYTQlU[/video]
     
  18. klipkap

    klipkap Well-Known Member

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    I'm not so sure that that is a universally applicable criterion. Think - Germans in Argentina; Chinese in Malaysia; Afrikaners in South Africa; Jews in New York State. Nope - I don't buy it as a rule.

    Besides, that is NOT what was undertaken in the Palestine Mandate. No Jewish State was promised. The civil rights of the existing groups were guarenteed.

    So, double "no" as to non-nuttiness.
     
  19. klipkap

    klipkap Well-Known Member

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    Still waiting for you to refute the Wiki quotes in Post #4, HB .... that the bulk of those Jews were not expelled but left/emigrated ... for once without a deflectionary strawman, if you can, please. And that most of these happened AFTER the ethnic cleansing of the Palestines practiced by the Zionists. Oh, and also without personal attributes being ascribed to the messenger, please. Yeah, I know, it is a tall order.

    When you have done so successfully, you will be justified in posting "bunk ... Bunk ... BUNK"

    Until then you are legless and bunkless.
     
  20. HBendor

    HBendor New Member

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    I live in a free country and I do not react favorably to mendacious comments by people's responses. But here is a Video that will amaze most of you with its realism.

    WATCH: 800,000 Jews expelled from Arab states after 1948


    https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10153702647732316&permPage=1
     
  21. klipkap

    klipkap Well-Known Member

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    Yet another strawman deflection so as desperately to avoid the facts from Post #4.

    Margot and I are still waiting.
     
  22. stuntman

    stuntman Well-Known Member

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    The Forced Migration Of Jews From Arab Countries And Peace
    By Prof. Ada Aharoni


    Prof. Ada Aharoni even compered the figure of the Jews in 1948 and the new figure in 1972, and she notice that:
    In Marocco 265,00 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 17,000 were left there.
    In Algeria 140,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 500 were left there.
    In Tunisia 105,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 2,000 were left there.
    In Libya 38,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 20 were left there.
    In Egypt 100,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 200 were left there.
    In Iraq 135,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 400 were left there.
    In Syria 30,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 4,350 were left there.
    In Lebanon 5,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 150 were left there.
    In Yamen 55,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 only 1,000 were left there.
    In Aden 8,000 Jews lived in 1948, while in 1972 there werent any Jews left in Aden.

    In 1948, there were 881,000 across Arab countries, whilein 1972 only 25,200 Jews were still living in Arab countries.

    You can see the influance of the changing behaiver of the Arab countries thoward their Jewish communities, in the rescue plan that Israel condacted with the help of the Yemanite communitie in Yeman between 1948-1951. The same thing happend in Lybia as well.
    Another evidence for the foor behavier in the Arab countries, was that alot of Jewish Arabs decided not to come to Israel but to leave to France, England and America, or as prof. Ada Aharoni wrote:
    And let us not forget that there were some Jewish Arabs that came to the Land of Israel in 1881, when a group of 2,000 Yemanite Jews came to the Land of Israel.

    A little bit about Prof. Ada Aharoni:
    Prof Ada Aharoni was borned in 1933 and came from Egyptean Jewish Affluent family. Prof. Ada Aharoni was forced to leave with their perants in 1949 after the Egyptean athurities legislated laws against the Jews betwen 1948-1949. When Prof. Aharoni came to the newly state with her perants, they came without anything, everything they had was left behind.
    Today Prof. Aharoni is a respectfull lecturer in the Technion in Haifa, and she lectures about Sociology - conflict resolution studies, with an emphasis on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and Jews from Arab lands.

    Source: http://www.iflac.com/jac/jac/THE_FORCED_MIGRATION.htm
     
  23. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Most of the Yemeni Jews were converts to Judaism...

    They converted under DHU NUWAS, ZUR'AH YUSUF IBN TUBAN AS'AD ABI KARIB... who was himself a convert.. He burned some 2,000 Christians in Najran who refused conversion.
     
  24. stuntman

    stuntman Well-Known Member

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    And how's that contridacting what I wrote?
     
  25. klipkap

    klipkap Well-Known Member

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    Many thanks for confirming that the Jews elected to leave the Arab countries only after they has "cleansed" future-Israel of 700 000 indigenous Palestinians.
    I appreciate these facts in response to the incessant Zionist claims that the expelling of some 75% of the Palestinians was merely a mutual "tit-for-tat" sequence by the Zionists. As you have so eloquently shown, that was not the case. Also thanks for showing that many Jews elected to go to countries other than Israel.

    Once again, my appreciation.
     

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