like to pay taxes. With them I buy civilization

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by cassandrabandra, Aug 14, 2011.

  1. cassandrabandra

    cassandrabandra New Member

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    According to what I have read, Oliver Wendell Holmes once said: 'I like to pay taxes. With them I buy civilization.'

    interesting perspective, isn't it.

    does this suggest that people who oppose taxes, or want to keep taxes to a minimum, want less civilization?
     
  2. MAcc2007

    MAcc2007 New Member

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    Terrific logical fallacy, that the more taxes that are paid, the more civilization exists. Nothing to really discuss considering Oliver Wendell Holmes did not say more taxes equals more civilization.
     
  3. maat

    maat Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Just like with the Laffer Curve(too much taxation leads to opposite desire), too much taxation will lead to tyranny.
     
  4. countryboy

    countryboy Well-Known Member

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    Does this suggest that a 100% tax rate is maximum civilization? :roll:

    You probably should have thought this through a little more carefully. ;)

    To answer your question, no, it means nothing of the kind.
     
  5. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    the only way they can collect taxes (secured debt by legislative fiat), is if they set themselves up with a legal interest in the property.

    The sneaky wabbits declared the 10 amendments have nothing to do with you or I, created sovereign states, declared all people to be roman citizens under the sovereign (king) states, passed eminent domain, abolished allodial title falsely claiming it was feudal, then without your permission use it and sell bonds against it for "their" benefit and then they charge (tax) you for the gains (that you only receive a tiny percentage of) in the form of property taxes.

    It is institutionalized robbery indistinguishable from feudalism by any other name, and the government that is entrusted to protect our liberties in fact has spent 200 years destroying them by degree.
     
  6. Dware

    Dware New Member

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    Forced taxes is theft.

    If YOU want to donate all you're money to illegals and crackheads go for it bro..
     
  7. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    you need to brush up on your comprehension skills that is not the meaning of what was said
     
  8. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    all property taxes are forced, you cannot vote them away, the people have no say in it, taxes are determined by legislative fiat, by what they decide to tax you for not for what you actually use, and it nearly doubles the cost for those who rent apartments etc!

    Most of that goes to taxes

    It robs everyone!
     
  9. cassandrabandra

    cassandrabandra New Member

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    I have.

    that you jump to conclusions is your issue, not mine.
     
  10. Subdermal

    Subdermal Banned

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    Try taxing @ 100%, and see how much 'civilization' ensues.

    Your 'interesting perspective'...isn't. What it is...is a logical fallacy. If you do not agree, I would suggest you pay more in taxes, so your civility in these threads is increased.

    :lol:
     
    Stupidsheep and (deleted member) like this.
  11. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    It means we want to keep what is the fruits of our labor.

    when you buy something you own and control it.

    which is his point.

    admission of judicial corruption.
     
  12. cassandrabandra

    cassandrabandra New Member

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    I disagree.

    a civilised society looks after the most disadvantaged members of that society.

    the people who argue against taxes on these forums (remembering that the US already has lower tax rates than civilised nations) show a distinct lack of empathy - and therefore a lack of civilised values.

    100% tax would be incompatible with a society which values the right s of the individual, combined with a safety net to ensure a minimum standard of living.
     
  13. RiseAgainst

    RiseAgainst Banned

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    I don't like to pay taxes. With them I become less free. Even when I've been down and out churches and charitable organizations have done more for me (more efficiently too, I might add) than government ever could have imagined possible.

     
  14. Phoebe Bump

    Phoebe Bump New Member

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    I kinda like civilization. People who oppose taxes on principle appear to like the 3rd World. Tanzania has almost no taxes.
     
  15. Phoebe Bump

    Phoebe Bump New Member

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    I dunno. Compare Mississippi to Switzerland.
     
  16. maat

    maat Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    In other words, 100% taxation would be incompatible with freedom/liberty itself.
     
  17. James Cessna

    James Cessna New Member

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    Unfortunately, cassandrabandra, this is what 60 percent of the taxes we pay each year to the IRS actually buys us!

    Uncle Sam's Plantation 1939-2011

    [​IMG]

    Democrats have been running our inner-cities for the past 30 to 40 years, and blacks are still complaining about the same problems. More than $7 trillion dollars have been spent on poverty programs since Lyndon Johnson's War on Poverty​ with little, if any, impact on poverty. Diabolically, every election cycle, Democrats blame Republicans for the deplorable conditions in the inner-cities, then incite blacks to cast a protest vote against Republicans.

    In order to break the Democrats' stranglehold on the black vote and free black Americans from the Democrat Party's economic plantation, we must shed the light of truth on the Democrats. We must demonstrate that the Democrat Party policies of socialism and dependency on government handouts offer the pathway to poverty, while Republican Party principles of hard work, personal responsibility, getting a good education and ownership of homes and small businesses offer the pathway to prosperity.
     
  18. Subdermal

    Subdermal Banned

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    Not only does your response here have nothing to do with my statement, it also demands that the method of looking after the needy in our society requires taxation.

    It doesn't. That may come as an absolute shock to you, but - if it did - there would be no need whatsoever for private charity.

    No they don't, and only an addled misrepresentation of the motives and beliefs of the posters you would like to target with such an accusation leads to such a misunderstanding.

    I'm going to assume that you'd include me in these that you claim have no empathy, so I'll answer for that group: your definition of 'empathy' requires paying high levels of taxes so you can feel satisfied that the people have 'empathy'.

    What a disgraceful bastardization of the word. If you continue to believe such trash, you would have no defense against any totalitarian ideology simply co-opting your belief that "taxes = good", in order to gain control.

    So what you're saying is that your original statement that "with taxes, I buy civilization" is entirely too simplistic, and - therefore - meaningless?

    Good. Welcome back to the rational side of the fence.

    Regardless: a "minimum standard of living" is not the perview of Government. It is the responsibility of The People, and We, The People, have taken that responsibility very seriously, which is why it has been widely known that the US has always been the most charitable population on Earth.

    Private giving is what defines 'empathy'. Not taxation.
     
  19. Subdermal

    Subdermal Banned

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    There isn't a soul on this forum who will ever be able to help you if you cannot see the absolute logical trainwreck in your own post here.
     
  20. countryboy

    countryboy Well-Known Member

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    Then you believe 100% taxation would achieve maximum civilization?

    There is no doubt I have issues, ask my wife. :mrgreen:
     
  21. Phoebe Bump

    Phoebe Bump New Member

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    I don't want help. I want you to show me the logical trainwreck of my post instead of just simpering.
     
  22. Kokomojojo

    Kokomojojo Well-Known Member

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    Now I see where this is going.

    She is making a pitch for continued feudalism.

    Parens Patria.

    The father, in the case of the uk the king of state and in this case of the us the state as king takes care of his children (at an incredibly high cost)

    When people in the UK and upper canadia say "civilized" they mean suubject to the king or sovereign government with no unalienable rights.

    Nice sleight of hand
     
  23. webrockk

    webrockk Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Systemically "looking after" (subsidizing) the "disadvantaged" with "safety nets"....

    fosters and expands poverty and dependency...

    by alleviating or altogether removing consequences for personal irresponsibility and recklessness....

    replacing what should be modesty and shame for all too often self imposed individual failings...

    with arrogant demands for more unsustainable entitlements...

    to be provided by a currently... and permanently... retracting, overburdened tax base.
     
  24. Subdermal

    Subdermal Banned

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    I already have, as have others, and - I predicted - you do not understand it. BTW: describing my lampooning of your post as 'simpering' is simply the lashing out of a mind enslaved to emotion, rather than logic.
     
  25. Daybreaker

    Daybreaker Well-Known Member

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    100% taxation is a straw man. Of course that's too much. What remains undefined is what isn't too much.

    I know that some people think that 1% taxation is too much, but I think those people are utopians.
     

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