NYPD chains Transexual to fence for 28 hours

The Netherlands being considered the most tolerant nation in the world doesn't mean for one second that gay people are NEVER discriminated against in Dutch society... Get real. It's only better only by measure of comparison.

Lucky though they may be to live in a nation with full legal equality, in this age of media and communication it's highly likely they've been exposed repeatedly throughout their lives to homophobic views - be that through paying attention to the "kill the gays" bill that's being debated in Uganda, the insane statements eminating from the religious right in America and the actions of the "God hates ***s" church, or the many, many other things in the wider world that treat gays as second class citizens or criminals. And crucially there are of course Dutch people who would like nothing more than for the rights of their fellow citizens to be stripped away; indeed they also have anti-gay politicians and religious figures who enjoy belittling homosexuals. Just the other week a top Dutch Rabbi said gays are sick and "need help". All this stuff can affect the psyche in ways you couldn't possibly imagine.

So your characterisation of Dutch society seemingly being a pure haven of tolerance and presenting no reason for why gays are engaging in self-depreciation is ill-informed and ignorant of the bigger picture. Society by and large hasn't even scraped the surface of true tolerance - even where it is considered to be in its strongest form.

As you've provided no statistics comparing the behaviour of Dutch homosexuals to gay people in other countries, or to Dutch heterosexuals for that matter.. I'm just going to wait untill you do before going any further with this charade.

Answer me this - why would a gay person hate the way they are if they were NEVER exposed to any negativity about their sexuality? Only the outer conditions cause the inner to potentially become self-loathing or lacking in self-esteem.

None of that stuff has any relevance to whether having an attraction to a member of the same sex is a variant of human sexuality, which it blatantly is... That you would think otherwise is laughable.

Additionally there is no reason whatsoever that biological sexual attraction to members of the same sex should cause one to engage in drug use, or um.. cross dressing. Just like there is no reason that being black should cause one to engage in criminal activity. There may be a link, but generalising is just ridiculous and unfair.

Do you have evidence gays are "selfish" or are just going to keep tossing more outlandish, unproven claims out there?

"These people"? Again you reveal your ignorance and penchant for generalising. Many heterosexual women also have reputations for being w****s.. Take prostitutes, swingers parties, lap and pole dancing establishments, Paris Hilton... Does these things mean straight females generally deserve to be characterised in this way?

And I was waiting, just waiting for you to throw AIDS into into. "Dropping like flies", really?! Last I checked HIV medication these days means that people seldom die of AIDS. It's now considered a life-long but manageable condition rather than a death sentence. You're so 1980's retro...

 

We'll see what comes of any court case which might take place.

 

I am glad to see you have absolutely no evidence what so ever to speak of to support your argument.

 

allow me to spell it out for you

the article makes absolutely ZERO mention of facts from "the other side"

it only discusses the accuser.

In fact, the article does not even have witness statements to confirm the accuser's story.

if your takeaway is other than the article is one-sided then clearly your agenda makes you want to believe it all to be true and factual.


feel free to jump to conclusions. You will find that as you depart youth and head into maturity that things are not always as they appear. It is admirable to support your agenda however I suggest not doing it at the expense of facts.

 

Huh. Do you only demonstrate critical thinking abilities when you have agenda?

 

what in the blue moon does that have to do with your jumping to a conclusion because it's apparent that your agenda makes you want to believe the report of the accuser when no details have been provided by the police.

 

Are you for real? You're going to jump off a highway overpass because the Ugandan Taliban said some mean things about you?

If your ego is this fragile, then you really are crazy!

 

Unless you have actually experienced it for yourself, I doubt you could begin to understand its impact. We're not talking about jumping off a bridge, we're talking about the damaging effects it can have on the psyche. If you know that there are people the world over who hate you or would have you killed for who you are, it's never going to be a good thing...

 

No use talking to idiots about compassion and empathy; they either know what it is or not.

 

As a White male heterosexual, I have experienced more than my share of discrimination and intolerance.

 

Yet you fit the bill for someone who, by and large, would receive the least amount of discrimination based on those qualities.

 

Quite the opposite. discrimination towards White male heterosexuals is just that. We just don't let it get to us. If your ego is so fragile that you feel the need to kill yourself over something unpleasant that was said to you, maybe you're not as "normal" as you though.

 

What you're saying is virtually LUDICROUS.

 

NYPD has a history of mistreating trans people

 

I don't believe you would know true discrimination based on you being the least likely to be at the recieving end. You can try humouring me though.

 

I wouldn't dare. I don't want to be responsible for the next gay suicide tragedy.

 

In others words, you've got nothing.

 

No, I am simply looking at the contrast between your arguments here and the arguments demonstrated in the creation vs. evolution debates. Night and day.

It seems the demonstration of critical thinking abilities is only demonstrated when you have an agenda to fulfill.

 

I've got it all right here.

Your position is that the high rate of suicide and drug abuse in homosexual men is due to intolerance and discrimination, and should not be taken as evidence that homosexuality is abnormal.

I replied that Dutch homosexuals also have a high level of self-destructive behaviour, even though that country is very tolerant of homosexuality, and discrimination is non-existent.


In post #26, you came back with some nonsense about Dutch homosexuals being able to read on the internet that Ugandans oppose homosexuality. And just knowing there are people out there who don't like them is very damaging to their psyche, in ways that we can't possibly imagine.

But when I tell you that White Male heterosexuals are universally slandered and discriminated against in the name of political correctness, often in our own countries, and that we do not respond by abusing drugs and killing ourselves, you switch gears and tell us it's all relative.

Conclusion: Your methodology of exagerating your own feelings of persecution, while ridiculing the experiences of others is not only flawed, it is prejudiced and hypocritical.

P.S. If you're losing sleep because of some 3rd world craphole's "kill the gays" proclamation, then you are more hysterical than I thought.

 

very true. the person that posted the message you replied to does not understand that the police question and judge who she was as a person and drove her to a point that many of us do.

 

Not all trans are homo. there are different lvls of transgender. Some transgenders stay at home and put on clothes from time to time some go out shopping and running errands dressed as a women but keep their male parts. the last stage of transgender is having a sex change. These levels and the parts that come with each stage make living life as a transgender very hard with out people giving you lip. Its hard to understand and the person dealing with it never stops thinking about what they are. Its a major difference than a gay person that wears male clothing. They know they are gay end of story. while a transgender person does not know what they are most of the time. they know the feel normal dressed as a woman but fear of the public putting the down push them back...trans are pretty much at the point gays where back in the 70s and 80s...And with the police not respecting us it makes it hard, cause who is going to protect us and our rights. I know this from personal exp. not from stories in the paper. a trans that is not sex changed should not be locked up with others with out their ok. so a cell by themselfs is what is needed. but never chained to a fence with your arm over head for hours on end. that is not only wrong but can cause harm to the person

 

Since you just joined the thread, can you explain the findings of the Dutch study that I mentioned earlier?

You'd be hard pressed to find an example of Dutch police humiliating a person suffering from homosexuality or other perversion. Yet Dutch homosexuals have the same abnormally high rates of drug abuse and suicide as homosexuals in less tolerant nations. Why is that?

 

As to the fact that the dutch police and goverment do not work like most others, instead and problems that come about and hushed and kept in house. where as the media is everywhere here and ready to publish anything they get their hands on good or bad true or false. Things work different around the world but thats not the point this is America people have rights. Rights that are getting walked on. Im not saying we are the only group being wronged but the things we go thru everyday is out of control and with a city whose police have so many complaints and law suits for the same thing somethings going on. the old saying comes to mind where there is smoke there is fire....someone needs to step in and do something. the federal goverment could at anytime right a law that guides the police in a manner that protects trans rights and protects everyone in everyway for cases like this. an insolation cell would have avoid all this. But comparing Dutch to America is not the path to get there. that would be like saying America is just as likely to have terrorist as Israil. its a differnt standard of life all together....

 

Homosexuals are themselves out of control. The parks and streets in our local "gay village" are littered with condoms and used needles, and the drug trade goes on in plain sight. People I know who live in the area have come home to discover homosexuals having sex in their driveway. Of course the police have to respond to complaints, when parents of children have to clean up condoms and syringes, and worry about their children being exposed to perverts having sex in the bushes.

Nonsense. Holland has a free press, and is a destination of choice for gay tourism. I even referred you to a study done on Dutch homosexuals, that makes note of that country's tolerance. If this group was being discriminated against, you should at the very least be able to refer to specific allegations of police misconduct.

Actually that is exactly the point. The fact that Dutch homosexual males have a higher rate of suicide and drug abuse than Dutch heterosexual males, even though discrimination and intolerance are absent, indicates that it is not a factor.


Someone also mentioned the link between homosexuality and childhood sexual abuse. Any comment?