Part 30 of Post Your Tough Questions Regarding Christianity>>>MOD ALERT<<<

Well, one fact that I have studied extensively is that humans - in all cultures - make up stories. They are really quite good at it. It has been a pass-time for eons.
Humans many times base these stories on facts - things they see around themselves and things that will be relatable to their listeners. These stories tend to be geocentric (confined to certain geographic areas) and comprised of the local culture.

It is why the religious stories are normally confined to a local cultural bias. A God would not be limited by boundaries of oceans or mountains, yet we see in any religious text or story, that the narration is limited. We don't see a story of Jesus related to what was happening in India or to which Dynasty was in power in China.

Gods wouldn't be limited to such a narrow viewpoint.

Human story-tellers would.

One simple question I would ask. Do humans make up religions?
Even if you believe in one of them, it's impossible not to answer this question with a "yes". It's what humans do. It's what humans have done for eons.

Some are just better at it than others.

 

all the hindu gods are real, and so is odin and zeus. also, harry potter style warlocks are real, and aliens have taken over the bodies of all the worlds monarchs. let us know how you get on with your investigations. and don't forget to treat them all as potentialky as real as your own pet superstition!

 

It appears I'm actually making some head way

 

This one is a ripe unit indeed. Evidently accustomed to self-appointed superiority, and apparently from a culture or family in which veneration of faith is automatic. Makes for some pretty ugly stuff.

 

What? You post a video to support your claim and you haven't even watched it?
Tells everyone all that's needed when trying to debate with you.

If you didn't want to talk about it, why post it?

 

I did watch it. Just didn't catch anything about DNA. ** shrugs ** It happens.

 

Got it. Thanks.

 

I went and watched it again right at the moment you specified. If you had watched the entire video (which you did not), you'd know that an atheist said the DNA part. I know this because I remember the phone call conversation they had later in the video in which a caller was explaining to the atheist certain pieces of evidence that archaeologist found. Both atheists in the video were denying the evidence. The creator of the video would then cut to a documentary and prove the evidence. Then he'd go back to the conversation the atheists were having and then they'd say something else wasn't true, and then the video creator would cut and show evidence to the contrary. Anyway, that blurb you heard about DNA was actually one of the atheists arguing that parts in the bible cannot be proven. He then went on to say how scientists can prove that the crimes Jeffrey Dahmer committed could be proven through DNA evidence.

Of course, this further proves that you don't want to know the truth and that you will willfully ignore evidence presented to you. There's honestly no logical point of proving anything since you won't believe in any of it.

 

I seem to remember you telling him he was not at your level?

You're very much like the one who likes your post. You think with your 21st century mind, forgetting what was meant 2-3000 years ago. I reminded someone recently the when Martha said, in answer to Jesus question, 'your are the Messiah' she was talking about the Jewish Messiah. This was the only Messiah she knew as a good Jew. The thought of a man being sacrificed would have appalled her. Yet how many times have I heard people assume to the contrary. That she recognised Jesus as the Christian Messiah. Not even the disciples did at this time.

While talking to 2 JW's last night the subject of the 'scriptures' came up. 2 writers in the epistles give the advice to study the scriptures. I asked them what scriptures were referred to. The woman waved her Bible at me - 'these'.
Wow. In neither case was that possible. When the writers penned those words not even the first gospel had been written, and the Bible was 300 years in the future.

21st century minds to understand scriptures 2-3 millenia old. It's laughable. It's interesting that many scholars are beginning to think that way. Perhaps we should try to understand the Tanakh as it was written 2500 years ago in a culture and time different to ours.

Judaism is based on an Eastern way of thinking. Christianity on a Western way of thinking.
Judaism has a Yin and Yang base. Good and Evil complementing each other held together by variations in the middle. God created Good and Evil according to the Tanakh therefore Yin and Yang come into play. HaSatan is an emissary of god, testing mens faith. Not to condemn them. They do that themselves.
Christianity uses the Western Good v Evil - with Satan an enemy of God. The 2 do not balance themselves out. I suggest this was more acceptable to western ears. And I not getting into a discussion on this on this thread.

 

No. I said he's not at the level of being able to challenge me mentally. This is based from all the times I've replied to his mocking. The rest of what you're saying hinges on this one premise, so there's no need for me to reply to it.

 

Archeological evidence proves that some of the places and people of the Bible existed... but this does nothing to prove the fantastical claims of the resurrection or other miracles. Its like arguing that because the Bible mentions Jerusalem, and Jerusalem exists, thus God must exist.

Which is placing words in my mouth. I see the evidence... but none of it proves that God exists. I always find it interesting that some try so hard to prove that which cannot be proven... that being that God exists.

 

Fair enough. Can you post the timestamp of the vid where the above is explained?

 

Actually it is you who is confused. I'm not the one saying we humans evolved from apes, in fact I don't believe in the theory of evolution....it is nonsense in my opinion.

Basically...you suck at this because you directed your comments to the wrong person.

 

Look...lets just state this a simply as possible so all can understand it:

A very long time ago (more than 6000 yrs) there were animals living on this planet that were mammilian (live birth an generally with hair) that had four limbs and were terrestrial in nature. These creatures lived their lives as we do today, through adversity and natural complication which over more time (over 6000 yrs.) forced them to adapt if they would survive.

Eventually these mammals started to live in trees and changed as needed over many generations to get food and avoid getting eaten. Some of them adapted further and left the trees to get more food they could see on the savannah. Those that stayed in the trees we refer to as apes, those that did not are Humans. There were a great many variations of both, but most died off and what we see today are the survivors.

I hope everyone get's it now.

 

Great! Got any proof? I gave you my proof. Show me yours. It's only fair.

No. Placing words in your mouth is telling you what you said. I didn't tell you what you said. I told you what you didn't want to do. There's a difference.

And I see you're really hung up on proof that God exists. There's no direct proof that he does. However, there's historical proof that Jesus resurrected from the dead. Jesus claimed that God exists. So, knowing that people don't naturally rise from the dead, and Jesus is claiming God exists, then by observing the supernatural event, then what he's saying has to be true.
Source: http://www.peterkreeft.com/topics-more/resurrection-evidence.htm

 

No you don't see because you misunderstood me for I did not say you have to believe he exists, or else he doesn't.
Tell me where did I say that?...I said no such thing! Read what I said again very slowly perhaps you will understand it much clearer if you take your time reading what I said.

 

Only God knows the answer to that.

Only God knows the answer to that. Perhaps it might vary depending on the individual but again only God would know when a person is culpable/accountable.

Since God is omniscient, He knows everything and He will certainly know when to hold someone culpable/accountable.

 

What claim have I made that requires proof?

Indeed I do. If one is going to argue that God exists then this becomes an exercise in futility when there is no direct proof that He exists. (See following quote where you say "There's no direct proof that he does")

I agree... so why did you even bother to respond to my post to another person if we both agree on the above?

A moot point as you already previously stated "There's no direct proof" God exists. Proving Jesus exists does not prove the existence of God. Jesus making claims of the miraculous does not mean the claims are true nor can they be empirically proven.

As for the link it is the same argument that I have heard here for years. For the resurrection to be true one has to believe the account written in the Bible many years after the event was supposed to happen were objective and accurate. You have to believe that the author was objective is his writings. You have to believe that the time in which the tomb was left unobserved by the followers of Jesus, that the body was not moved. You have to believe in the eyewitness testimony of those who claimed to see Jesus after the crucifixion as written in the Bible many years after the event was said to have taken place. You have to believe in many things that cannot be empirically proven. Fantastical claims require fantastical evidence.

 

It is not a fact that we humans belong in the family of apes but rather it's a theory that some believe this to be true. You are confusing theories with facts.

Look here is an example of a fact: All who are living right now will die a physical death someday.

Now here is an example of a theory: Humans belong in the family of apes.

Mitt Ryan

 

Ive asked you politely to stop wrapping my quotes inside of other quotes. Why do you keep doing it?

 

So, how do you expect anyone to prove anything to you when you won't accept any evidence?

 

You mean flimsy, hearsay evidence? Well, I expect that there's a LOT of ways to prove a LOT of things without that.

 

Evidence?

When Orson Wells pulled his little stunt on the radio called, "The War of the Worlds", there were hundreds of calls into local law enforcement by people claiming to have seen martians in the woods and strange lights.

It would be a pretty poor historian who accepted a history as gospel (so to speak) without multiple sources and even then, when it comes to events that involve the supernatural, short of actual visual and audio recordings it would be impossible to call them anything but possible myth.

If you're going to have faith in something - then have faith. But stop trying to back it up with thin to nonexistent "proofs".

 

"Now here is an example of a theory:" Creationism, God, the Resurrection.

 

My proof comes from Almighty God, our Creator! He told us from reading His best selling book of all time the Holy Bible in the very first chapter.

We read in Scripture:

Then God said, &#8220;Let the earth produce every sort of animal, each producing offspring of the same kind&#8212;livestock, small animals that scurry along the ground, and wild animals.&#8221; And that is what happened. 25 God made all sorts of wild animals, livestock, and small animals, each able to produce offspring of the same kind. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, &#8220;Let us make human beings in our image, to be like us. They will reign over the fish in the sea, the birds in the sky, the livestock, all the wild animals on the earth, and the small animals that scurry along the ground.&#8221;

27 So God created human beings in his own image.
In the image of God he created them;
male and female he created them.

28 Then God blessed them and said, &#8220;Be fruitful and multiply. Fill the earth and govern it. Reign over the fish in the sea, the birds in the sky, and all the animals that scurry along the ground.&#8221;

29 Then God said, &#8220;Look! I have given you every seed-bearing plant throughout the earth and all the fruit trees for your food.

30 And I have given every green plant as food for all the wild animals, the birds in the sky, and the small animals that scurry along the ground&#8212;everything that has life.&#8221; And that is what happened.

31 Then God looked over all he had made, and he saw that it was very good!
And evening passed and morning came, marking the sixth day."---Genesis 1:24-31 NLT

Mitt Ryan