People need to recalibrate vaccine expectations

Read above. And who says that the primary endpoint for the vaccines is to prevent infection? They should prevent hospitalizations and deaths, and they are doing so for the overwhelming majority of vaccinated people (obviously not for ALL people because there are immunocompromised people who don't achieve the same benefits; this comes with the territory).

 

I think it can be categorized as "chickens comin' home to roost"....take note the NEW narrative is evolving to "we have to lower our expectations" in regard to the "efficacy" of the rushed into production "vaccines"...now who could have seen THAT coming?

 

I found a more complete link to the emotional report from this Florida ICU doctor:

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/florida...d-suffer-because-they-did-not-take-a-vaccine/

 

Expectations are an issue of public perception. The vaccines themselves have not changed. They continue to prevent hospitalization and death. You should read the link I've just posted (post #53 above). The idea that the vaccines were "rushed" is ridiculous. What was abbreviated were the red tape and the logistics, not the scientific parts. The three phases I, II, and III proceeded as usual. The mRNA technology is in development for the last 10 years. It's just that coincidentally Covid-19 came to be when the technology reached maturity.

Anyway, aren't you right wing? The "rushed" part was sponsored by your guy, no? Hello? Operation Warp Speed? So now you turned against it?

 

You heard wrong.

CDC report shows vaccinated people can spread COVID-19

There are 35,000 symptomatic breakthrough cases each week, the presentation shows.

Up to 15 percent of deaths in May were among vaccinated people, the presentation shows. That contrasts with previous public CDC data showing deaths occur in a tiny number of vaccinated people, just 0.0005 percent.

https://www.rollcall.com/2021/07/30/cdc-report-shows-vaccinated-people-can-spread-covid-19/

 

I am not sure where you were but where I was it was presented the way you claim it should be. Can you provide an example from any scientist or government official who said you couldn't catch or pass on the virus if you got the vaccine? By the way I agree with your post I just am not aware of anyone saying what you are challenging? If you can show me they misrepresented tha vaccine I will defer to you.

As far as I know all the misinformation about came from anti vaxxers paricularly Trump supporters and conspirary peddlers.

 

Yeah, it works well at infecting vaccinated people, of which some will likely die, up to 15% of them.

 

Oh, the vaccine infects people. Ok, that's a new one.

 

True. The very 95% and 94% efficacy posted respectively by Pfizer and Moderna still supposed 5% and 6% for whom there was no efficacy to prevent infection, of course. One in twenty, which was made worse by more aggressive subsequent variants. There was also significant scientific commentary that the lower numbers posted by J&J included phase III studies from Brazil and South Africa where new variants were predominant, while the Moderna and Pfizer numbers were from a time when the ancestral Wuhan variant was predominant. So, yes, scientists knew perfectly well what was happening, but my point is, it didn't necessarily filter down very well to the lay public.

So, this is not coming from science. Science never pretended these vaccines were 100% protective. But yes, there was a bit of political over-optimism. It can be easily demonstrated: the very CDC position that vaccinated people could drop the masks entirely including in indoor gatherings, indicated an over-confidence that was unwarranted given how Delta was spreading in Europe and predictably would get here. The message was that pandemic concerns were effectively over for the vaccinated, which was not exactly the case. I consider that CDC position, a mistake. And it's not Monday Morning Quarterbacking, since at the time I was already worried about the advancing Delta variant and posted several times saying that we should remain cautious for longer. But that's not what the CDC did, and there was a feeling of a victory tour, which was premature.

Yes, most of the misinformation comes from anti-vaxxers, but it's not like the CDC was completely innocent and didn't make mistakes. At the time when the CDC issued the mistaken recommendation to ditch masks completely for the vaccinated, there was a lot of pressure, with pundits saying that if the CDC insisted with masks for the vaccinated, it gave the impression that vaccines were useless and diminished the message that everybody should get vaccinated. I could probably successfully find a few quotes, but I don't even think it's necessary; the CDC recommendation itself should be enough to prove my point, no?

Isn't the fact that the CDC subsequently brought back the recommendation for masking even for the vaccinated, a sufficient "oops" moment?

 

It's ineffectiveness allows them to become infected.

There are 35,000 symptomatic breakthrough cases each week, the presentation shows.

Up to 15 percent of deaths in May were among vaccinated people, the presentation shows. That contrasts with previous public CDC data showing deaths occur in a tiny number of vaccinated people, just 0.0005 percent.

https://www.rollcall.com/2021/07/30/cdc-report-shows-vaccinated-people-can-spread-covid-19/

 

Got your point now. Thanks for clarification.

 

Nonsense. Provide the information that claims which vaccine has infected someone with Covid 19 because its patently false. Please educate yourself and stop spreading absolutely false information.

Below is a description of what the CDC in fact stated about how each type of vaccine for Covid 18 works and it was quit clear none of these vaccines can give you COVID-19.

I am calling you out. There is NO CDC report that says Covid 19 viruses cause Covid 19. Put it up on the board. IT DOES NOT EXIST HERE US WHAT EXISTS:

source for below:https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/how-they-work.html

• mRNA vaccines contain material from the virus that causes COVID-19 that gives our cells instructions for how to make a harmless protein that is unique to the virus. After our cells make copies of the protein, they destroy the genetic material from the vaccine. Our bodies recognize that the protein should not be there and build T-lymphocytes and B-lymphocytes that will remember how to fight the virus that causes COVID-19 if we are infected in the future.
• Protein subunit vaccines include harmless pieces (proteins) of the virus that causes COVID-19 instead of the entire germ. Once vaccinated, our bodies recognize that the protein should not be there and build T-lymphocytes and antibodies that will remember how to fight the virus that causes COVID-19 if we are infected in the future.
• Vector vaccines contain a modified version of a different virus than the one that causes COVID-19. Inside the shell of the modified virus, there is material from the virus that causes COVID-19. This is called a “viral vector.” Once the viral vector is inside our cells, the genetic material gives cells instructions to make a protein that is unique to the virus that causes COVID-19. Using these instructions, our cells make copies of the protein. This prompts our bodies to build T-lymphocytes and B-lymphocytes that will remember how to fight that virus if we are infected in the future.

 

Gee, there's someone here with medieval ideas that the vaccine infects people with the full virus? LOL. I'm glad I'm not reading that person so I don't know who said this absurdity.

You did make a mistake here: "There is NO CDC report that says Covid 19 viruses cause Covid 19." - I understand that you meant vaccines, not viruses.

By the way, some people have the slightly less absurd (although still completely false) idea that the vaccines selected the variants. The most aggressive variant, Delta, surface in India and was first spotted on October 5, 2020, while the vaccines were only given to their population starting on January 16. 2021, so short of a time travel machine to visit the past, the vaccines could not have contributed to the emergence of the Delta variant.

 

Yah sorry for the typo yes I meant the Covid 19 shots do not cause the virus and yah its phacking amazing how despite all the info made available people choose to stick their heads up their rear ends and not take the time to educate themselves. Man oh man but then we had the President tell people to inject disinfectant in their veins. Next. Take Drano to clear up a soar throat.

 

As a "doctor", you should know full well that ivermectin is FDA approved for human use, and has been used in humans for decades upon decades and has been proven to be very safe... Instead, you parrot the FDA line of "you are not a horse, you are not a cow"...

Ivermectin is ivermectin is ivermectin. Why don't you prescribe it to your patients? People wouldn't have to resort to "horse dewormer paste" if it would be available OTC like it is in other countries... Why aren't you looking into the fact that ivermectin seems to prevent COVID from replicating? Instead, you are pushing a death jab. Aren't doctors supposed to be healing their patients rather than harming them?

 

Natural immunity is MUCH better.

 

A "doctor" shouldn't be talking like this... This tells me that you are viewing medicine through the lens of religious fundamentalism rather than the lens of science.

"Anti-vaxxer" is simply a buzzword label, with a bad stigma attached to it, that is solely meant to shut down and discredit someone's point of view from the outset. --- Every time this term comes up, I WILL call bullshit on it....

 

Let's not forget the quality of doctors they are turning out these days from the medical schools...

"Woke" Progressives now taking over the workplaces in Hospitals

 

I don't respond to trolls. As I said, I stand by everything I said in post #60, including it's CDC links.

 

You need to be called out for trolling. I stand by every word I said in post #60 including it's CDC links.

 

None of that applies to my post #60, of which you are blatantly misrepresenting. How many times are you going to keep violating forum rules by trolling me?

 

Post #60 provides the words. Are you illiterate? Or is trolling your only purpose?

 

How can I fabricate CDC words when I provide the CDC links, as I did in post #60? And of what obligation am I to provide you anything when all you have to do is read post#60?

 

1-The cite you provided does not say the vaccine causes and spreads Covid 19.
2-The CDC actually states in the quote you provided something totally different and in its actual explanation as to the vaccines that I provided makes it clear the vaccines do NOT spread the virus.
3-You initiated a personal attack on me calling me an adolescent for challenging your falsehood and you passed off your falsehood as "splitting hairs".
4-You then felt I personally attacked you telling you provide the information that proves the vaccine causes Covid 19 or stop.
5-Yoou found the words "put up shut up" a personal attack-this coming from someone who has no problems calling me an adolsecent.
6-I will now be pleased to put you on ignore.

 

Maybe the propagandists and 'scientists' need to recalibrate their propaganda?

Maybe they should start telling the truth for a change?

But I know that won't happen. They have a plandemic to act out.