Woman comes up to you and says "I just found out I'm three weeks pregnant....I'm going to have an abortion".... and you say "Well, do what you want. Stay pregnant or terminate the pregnancy. It's your choice"....are you "pro-abortion" or pro-choice? Now what if someone else says "I'm going to do what I can politically/legally, to see to it that she cannot do that.".....are they not anti-choice?
Whern the lifers try to equate pro-choice with being pro-abortion, it's because they're trying to apply the same outcome-based standard that they use for themselves. They are pro-life, which means there's only one outcome they are happy with and will allow. There is nothing about being pro-choice that means you'd push women into having abortions or otherwise promote them. Choicers don't focus on the outcome, they focus on the mother's ability to choose whichever outcome she wants for herself. The lifers try to attach that same absolutism they subscribe to themselves on to choicers because they think it demonizes them when they equate pro-choice as being pro-abortion. In reality, I think it points to either ignorance or dishonesty. I say ignorance because for some people who may have been exposed to nothing but pro-life views, they may very well not know any better. But for those that do, which is probably most, it's just purposeful dishonesty.
I stick with the given terms because I find it only leads to disrespectful debates and tangents otherwise. It aggravates me to no end when a pro-lifer calls me a pro-abort, or a pro-baby killer, or whatever crap they can think of. I have always tried to maintain at least some standard of respect in my debates with them and I will only ever call them pro-life (or anti-abortion if they request otherwise). All I can ask of them is to show that same respectful behavior towards me by calling me pro-choice, because that is what I am. They don't get to pick my position title for me any more than I get to pick their position title for them. By the way, if someone does call you anti-life/pro-baby killer/pro-death/pro-abortion and you have explicitly told them not to at least once and they continue you can report them for it. Same goes for any lifer here who has been called anti-choice, anti-woman or whatever by the opposition. None of us should have to sit here and tolerate being called any kind of slurs by our opponents. We really need to start treating one another with respect in reference at the very least to the title of our position. To do otherwise is nothing more than taking cheap pot shots or using ad hom attacks in my opinion. To answer this question specifically, no. I do not believe that makes them anti-choice because they may believe in choice for many other things. I think it makes them anti-abortion. But if they want to be called pro-life then we should respect that so long as they respect us in calling us pro-choice.
Ah, but wasn't the Emancipation Proclamation equally "anti-choice?" Why don't we apply your scenario here and you can tell me. Someone comes up to you and says, "I need more help on my farm. I'm going to buy a slave." And you say, "Well, do what you want. Do it yourself or buy a slave. The choice is yours." Are you "pro-slavery" or pro-choice? Now what if someone else says, "I'm going to do what I can politically/legally to see to it that they cannot do that." ......are they not anti-choice? You people love to dance around the fact that there is another human being in the equation whose natural rights are not being considered in order to accuse other people of taking choice away. You see, if one person's rights interfere with the other person's desires, we simply exclude them from counting as people and we've solved the problem, haven't we? Now we're self-righteous and morally correct and everyone else is simply wrong for trying to tell us what to do. I don't know how you people sleep at night. I really don't. The hoops you jump through to justify all the horrible (*)(*)(*)(*) you believe in. It just blows my mind.
Must be easy for you to sleep at night(or day or anytime) with those blinders on that allow you ignore obvious differences in any situation you don't care to understand. To you, there is no difference between a fetus and a born child. You pretend they are one and the same when any thinking(something a fetus is not capable of by the way) person can clearly see they are not. Then you try to apply that purposeful ignorance to the slavery debate where the two people involved only have superficial skin color differences between them. Physiologically, and especially intellectually, they are one and the same and slavery existed entirely to bolster the financial success of the slave owners. There was nothing. at. all. that made a slave less of a person than the slave owner because there were no differences other than social and financial status between them to base that distinction on. You give a slave some money and some nice clothes and obviously their freedom and viola, no difference at all. The slave certainly didn't live inside of the slave owner, didn't get food and oxygen and water and nutrients directly from his body.
Fugazi claims that according to Mc fall vs shimp, no person is under a legal obligation to use their body to sustain the life of another person. He uses that to justify abortion. What's your response to that arguement?
So you don't think of black people as completely human? Because for that analogy to work, that has to be your premise...
I'd simply repeat what I said before..... He knows damn well that what he's saying is reprehensible. He just doesn't give a (*)(*)(*)(*). Because abortion is a nihilistic philosophy to begin with. It's about blatant disregard for human life.
You're pro-death, because no one who believes it's OK for anyone to murder innocent human beings understands what life is. You're welcome. Sure they are, just like laws against any other form of murder are anti-choice. What's the problem?
The same blatant disregard you have for the woman, and I am SOOOOOOOO sorry that the laws of your country keep control freaks like you in check.
Unifer doesn't have a "blatant disregard" for women. However, YOU have a blatant disregard for fetuses. pro choice beliefs are freaky, not pro life beliefs. The women that you accuse Unifer and other pro lifers of having a "blatant disregard for" are immoral women.
Laws reflect where societies draw lines, slavery is not acceptable and in civilized countries neither is torture. Forcing women to keep a goo of self replicating cells inside them is acceptable in all digital age societies.
