Religious Morals Are Meaningless.....

The idea that someone can be considered moral by choosing between these two options, being a good person, or buring forever in a pit of fire for an eternity of pain and torment, is pretty stupid. What is the meaning of being a good person if you are punished for NOT being a good person?

Morals are supposed to be about being good for it's own sake, not being rewarded or punished for it.

 

If you say so, then it must be true. So you go ahead and be "good" for it's own sake.

 

I try to......It's my personal opinion that if a person is only good because they fear (*)(*)(*)(*)ation, than that person is not truly moral.....They are just a coward who chooses the way that keeps them safe.

I try to live a moral life because I feel that is the way I should live.....I personally do not care if I am rewarded for it or not.

 

Did you ever get caught with your hand in the cookie jar? Did you ever tell your mom or dad that you didn't do the act that they were questioning you about when you knew full well that you did? Be honest now.

 

So are you saying there shouldn't be any divine justice?

 

I never said I do not act in an immoral way at times, I said I TRY to act in a moral way, because I feel it's the right way to live. Human nature is to be drawn to the easier path. You are moral only when you choose the path of morality for it's own reward.
The overall failure of all religion is that people choose morality because they fear punishment, not because they want to be moral.

 

the problem with 'trying to live a moral life' is that it entirely depends on the persons morality.
By their own standards, Hitler and Stalin lived completely moral lives.

and that is why people prefer that we all get our morals from a religion that at least attempts to set everyone at the same standard. simply put, the world is a better place because of religions trying to make everyone have similar morals. people still have different standards obviously, but everyone thinks murder is bad and so on.

 

Trying is not 'doing'. So subsequently you are equally guilty as anyone else that you are attempting to blame in regard to their morality. So, on those occasions when you do act in an immoral manner, how do you justify those acts? What sort of rationalization do you attempt to attach to that immoral behavior? Is there any particular immoral act that you have occasioned that was also against mans law? So your moral values are based on how you 'feel' about a particular conduct? What do you suppose would happen in society if everyone could justify there conduct as being 'good' if that condition of 'goodness' was based on 'how they feel'? Rapists could not be prosecuted because they were justified by saying 'I feel that my conduct was right'; A murderer could make the same claim: A thief could make the same claim. Get the picture.

Well of course it is. Any action always seeks the path of least resistance.

Now there is the pot calling the kettle black. Your reward for moral conduct (when you can manage it) is the good feeling you receive.

The same is said with regard to secular law. People tend to not break the law because they would rather not suffer the consequence. Others, will break the law, because their action made them feel good. Rewards and punishment on both sides of that fence.

 

Feeling good about being moral is what I mean by morality being it's own reward. Christians are moral because they are rewarded with eternal life or punished with (*)(*)(*)(*)ation to hell.

and secular law is not about morals......There are several immoral laws on the books. I would not, for example, say that letting a murderer go because a cop forgot to read him his rights to be the moral choice, but under US law, that is what happens.

 

My point is that you are likewise REWARDED for your so-called good moral conduct, and under those secular laws, you are punished when you are committing acts that are immoral. BTW: Check your grammar. Christians are not "punished with (*) (*) (*) (*)ation to hell" when they are being moral.

Secular laws regarding conduct are based on morals. They are based on what society 'feels' is 'good' moral conduct. Doubt me.... ask your local representative or senator.

 

everything that we do wether you want to believe it or not we doo for our own gain. As you say being good for nothing other than the sake of being good you do this because you feel better about yourself and are happy with yourself for what you did. that is your reward now the reward of eternal life in heaven is just a driving factor that makes people want to be moral even more because of this reward.

Everyones reward maybe different but no matter who you are you do such things for some sort of a reward.

 

Feeling good about doing something good is better than doing it for physical reward. That is what it means when you say something is it's own reward, because it makes you feel good for doing it. That is completely different than doing a good deed simply because you fear being (*)(*)(*)(*)ed to hell if you don't. There is no morality about good deeds done out of fear.

 

Are you now saying that going to Heaven is a physical thing?

Then you admit that doing 'good' makes you 'feel good'. Advocating the new social philosophy of 'if it makes you feel good, then do it'. Advocating to the rapist, "if it makes you feel good then do it"; Advocating to the murderer, "if it makes you feel good, then do it". Interesting philosophy you have.

Is there a particular scripture that you can cite where such a condition is dictated in the Bible?

Then start violating all of the social laws, to insure that you will be 'feeling good' with all of your actions.

 

The Bible tells us that we are not good (Jeremiah 17:9, Genesis 6:5, Psalm 51:5, Psalm 58:3, Ephesians 2:1-5, John 3:19, John 8:34, John 3:19, 1 Corinthians 2:14, Romans 1:18, Proverbs 14:12, 1 Corinthians 1:1.

So Christianity first teaches us that we are not moral. We are innately evil at heart. However, God can change this (John 1:13, Mark 13:20, Ephesians 1:4-5, Revelation 13: for His great will (Romans 9:11-13, Romans 9:16, 1 Corinthians 1 27-29, 2 Timothy 1:9.

Once we know God, we learn His will through His word. We study it at learn morality.

 

It is even worse than that.
There is no moral for religious people, cause they are following the word of a god. Moral considerations has nothing to do with it.
If the word of the god is to kill someone, they will kill him. If the word of the god is to help him, they will help him.
Only people who do not follow a god can have moral, cause they are entitled to choose, this choice makes them moral or unmoral.

 

Hey I like your posting. YOU among all the others have pretty much caught on to what is happening.

1: Christians are not obligated by the man made morals.
2: Man made moral considerations do not in fact have anything to do with "it".
3: Christians will do as they are instructed by God through the Holy Spirit.
4: Only the non-theists have free will (that ability to deny God).
5: The 'free will' choice of non-theists will in fact obligate those non-theists to adhere to a set of man-made morals.

As for the final point... the killing of people.... That day (which no-one knows the exact day and or hour) will come about... the events of that day has even been given a name ... The Battle of Armageddon. Other than that unknown day, God (through the Holy Spirit) does not issue orders for man to kill anyone. You will of course attempt to counter that position that I have stated, by your use of OT events, which events were under the Law of God, but you fail to recognize that the Christians are under the dispensation of Christ... The Christ does not kill.

 

Close all prisons and live with the consequences of this decision in your world. But I don't think this principle of action could be a law for the whole world - although I hate it very much to hear expressions like "guilty" or "not guilty". That's indeed totally stupid and unimportant. We are all sinners - nevertheless some people are dangerous and no one knows how to change this.

http://youtu.be/VxoJLJx-mJw

 

Who's morals are we discussing? yours, mine, or the divine?

 

Only it apply to all religion, not just Christians. It apply to Muslims and Jews as well. It apply also to other religion that dictate the "word of god".

 

If religion provides morals then why are prisons full of religious people?

 

They are of course all atheists at the moment of committing crimes and then convert to a religion*) afterwards


*) Usually the same religion as whomever you'll hear this from adheres to.

 

That's the point. If there is such a thing as religious morality, i.e. behavior that is only moral because a divine being says so, then there is no such a thing as your morals or mine. There's only fear, respect, reverence, anticipation, observance, [insert any other sentiment] of a supernatural scheme of retribution.

 

It's a pity that science can explain where morals come from and even explain why they change.

 

Where comes moral from?

http://youtu.be/XDdlHmzIdn8

 

Can you give me a name and adress of a Christian who is in prison? I will ask him.

http://youtu.be/WyOJ-A5iv5I