"sexual assault" and "rape" for the payout

http://m.espn.go.com/ncf/story?storyId=10009077&src=desktop&wjb

I'm a big FSU fan... and this is a huge developing story within Tallahassee that now has national title implications. If Jameis Winston is charged with a felony, according to FSU policy, he can not play... which would leave the #2 Seminoles using their 3rd string QB in arguably, the biggest game in their history, as they take on a 2 time defending Bama.

There is a lot of things suspect about the timing of this information being leaked, but that's not really what I'm posting this about.



I think back to the Duke Lacrosse team, where a girl accused the entire team of assualt. It cost the coach his job, the team all had to leave the University, noone was allowed to question the woman's motive because "that is blaming the victim".... yet, when the dust settled, she had made the story up and it was shown she had done that sort of thing before (false accusation) She even later was arrested for murder. Stand up gal. and yet, the coach, who wasn't even there, lost his job, and the guys playing careers ended.


Remember Kobe Bryant.... he has an extra-marital affair with a girl in colorado. He says it was consentual, she said it was rape, he pays her off, and magically, the charges are dropped. He then buys his wife a HUGE FAWKING DIAMOND and everything is hunky dory.....

Did he pay her off because she was sorry he raped her? Or was she just looking for an NBA baby, (and child support), and/or a payoff?


Now, back to Jameis Winston. The man was a walking legend in tallahassee even before he threw his first pass in a real game. And he has done nothing but prove all season, he is the fawking man and will have a big payout in the NFL one day. Was this girl gold-digging?

Was it consentual the night of.... then she changed her mind after the fact when she was one night standed? Was it a set-up so she could get a payoff after he struck it big in the NFL? (TMZ broke the story mid month which could have thrown off her timing since Jameis isn't eligible for the NFL until 2015 due to age) And is it all coincidence that when Cam Newton posed a threat to bama, dirt was dug up, when Manziel posed a threat, dirt was dug up, now dirt is conveniently dug up on Jameis

Are we even allowed to ask those questions without being accused of supporting rape and sexual assault?


Personally, I think it's a little bit of it all.....

 

Maybe you should look at the criminal account of what is going on. It sounds like the victim was told to not to file charges by someone in the police or DA's office and that is serious. Let's have the investigation but it sounds like there is DNA, and immediate accusation of rape so we should look into it.

 

I saw that. I'm not sure it just wasn't "fair warning" it's seriously a concern that women need to understand what will happen if they file charges, especially in a football town with it's star player.

I can definately see how that "warning" can be viewed as protection of Jameis from the TPD.... it was a stupid statement by an investigator. The family's lawyer should have addressed that with the girl.... noone else.

but that isn't on Jameis if there is corruption in the TPD.


The investigation is going on now. And I'm all for it. I just scratch my head at the timing. If the family didn't like the TPD investigation, go to the FDLE.... They sat on the info. TMZ dug up this story, not the girl.... but why was she sitting on the story? was she waiting for when he hit the NFL to bring this back up in hopes of a payout that she can't currently get from a guy in college?

 

I'm just asking questions.... I'm not defending rape or assault..... if he's guilty, let it come out, despite it breaking my heart with this team.....

But in order to avoid a Duke Lacrosse fiasco.... hard questions must be asked, about possible motives for waiting, which could suggest a "change your mind after the fact" assault....


DNA links Jameis with the girl..... no question in my mind he had sex, or got a bj, or a handjob, or something where he orgasm'd ..... my only question is, was it consentual at the time or not.

 

Actually it is a crime called obstruction of justice.

Yes because it is a crime.

No but with the DNA evidence if the TPD does not investigate they are protecting him.

Because of football? Really?

?

Because it appears she was threatened.

So you just assume women who are raped by athletes are lying?

 

I agree, and is on the detective that did it...100%. It's still a fair statement that the girl needs to be aware of. I just think it's the job of HER attorney to say it.... not the investigator

agreed, but no matter who stated it, is it a legit concern any girl needs to be aware of? I think it is.

that's fine... even if they are protecting.... that still doesn't mean he raped or assaulted her. DNA proves he had an orgasm. I don't think that was ever in question.




[/quote]Because of football? Really? [/quote

absolutely.... I'm not saying it's right. but the timing is suspect on why it's surfacing only after Jameis is a viable threat to win a title and heisman and beat Bama, the dynasty.

That's why I think it's coming out now.


Second part of timing, why was family of the girl sitting on the info for 10 months? If they don't like the way TPD is doing it.... which there is legit concern over that.... why not go IMMEDIATELY to Fl dept of Law enforcement? It seems they wanted to sit on it until a bigger silence payoff could be achieved after Winston turns pro. It just got dug up too soon for the family.

?

I think it's a question that needs to be investigated.....

many a lucrative careers have been made by women who get knocked up or "raped" by pro athletes. look at the Kobe Bryant girl...

 

Reading that article from a completely neutral position I see lots of questions but no justification for jumping to any conclusions. I think your bias is causing you to lean unreasonable in a given direction.

 

My concerns were the same for kobe bryant... whom I do not cheer for, (or the Lakers) It was my concern for Duke Lacrosse team as well.


as an FSU fan... I certainly don't wnat him charged because he can't play during a big game. I hope if he is charged, it's because of evidence, and not because an the State's attorney is a Bama fan or something like that.

the simple fact is... women can make a lot of money by having an NFL/MLB/NBA baby.

the simple fact is.... women can also make a lot of "hush" money by having sex with a pro athlete, then accusing him the next day of a crime that can ruin his career.

you'd be amazed at how much one's morals can be tested by the amount of money that's on the table over issues like this with the right person.


I'm not saying Jameis didn't assualt this girl at this point in time. but if people aren't allowed to question possible motives during the investigation, how can we know, beyond a reasonable doubt, that a crime really happened.

 

Young women are often attracted to high status alpha males like Winston. However, just like the other high status alpha males the OP mentioned this wouldn’t be the first time someone like Winston had what is most likely a consensual sexual encounter with a young women, and subsequently the young women accused the young man of rape because perhaps the young man spurred the young women in some way-such as not calling the young women and pursuing a relationship after having sex with her.

…and you can thank feminism for creating an environment where you can’t question a young woman’s accusation, and you can thank feminism for the majority of women who make false accusation not being charged with a crime. For example, Brian Banks was a football star who had a consensual sexual encounter with a young lady and the young lady subsequently accused Brian of kidnapping and rape. Even though there was no DNA, like the Winston case, and it was his word against hers, Brian spent 6 years in prison and the young lady was awarded with 1.5 million dollars.

…However…the young lady contacted Brian via facebook and told him she wanted to meet him. Brian brought a hidden camera to their meeting where the young women said she wanted bygones to be bygones, she wasn’t kidnapped, she wasn’t raped, and the sex was consensual.
Brian was exonerated as a result of the video and advocacy from the justice project, but what happened to the young lady? That’s right. You guessed it. She wasn’t charged with a crime for making the false allegation.

As a result of feminism you can’t even question a young lady who makes an accusation without being accused of, “victim blaming,” As a result of feminism men are convicted of crimes they never committed based on a woman’s word in the absence of any other evidence. As a result of feminism not only were the young ladies accusations unchallenged, but she was awarded 1.5 million dollars. As a result of feminism this women didn’t even get charged with a crime when she admitted she made a false allegation.

The Brian Banks Story:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...accused-rape-signs-Las-Vegas-Locomotives.html

 

Well if she is lying it will catch up to her since filing a false police report is a crime.

 

That doesn't mean your bias isn't influencing your opinions here (and your recollections of your opinions when those cases broke). Anyway, there is can also be a bias in favour of (male) athletes in general - part of the wider celebrity phenomena. They're shining heroes and people want heroes to be perfect or terrible, not some confusion in between. Little of this is conscious thought of course, it's instinctive.

Yes, but it's the strong direction you're leaning, even if you don't realise it.

We (as random spods on the internet) don't need to question anyone's motives unless there is a really good reason for us to do so and a massive media and public debate about ongoing investigations like this are more likely to harm justice than serve it. You're free to asking all the questions in the world here but it isn't going to get any closer to the truth (especially if their asked with a underlying bias and preconceptions).

You also seem to be selective in your questioning. You don't seem interested in questioning the warning from the investigator to the alleged victim or the fact the case was quickly inactivated shortly after. You're also not questioning why the media suddenly picked up on the case or the fact they chose to leak information about the investigation. No less valid questions as the ones you're asking.

 

if my opinions were inconsistent from when it happened to athletes NOT on my team.... you'd have a point.

To me, all that happened to Kobe was, he hooked up with some random woman in Colorado while in rehab. He was an ass for cheating. But she saw an opportunity to extort money from him. He eventually paid her off just so he didn't risk jail and/or his NBA career. Was she really raped? or was she really wanting money.

it seems this girl at FSU had let it die down. Why? was she waiting for Jameis to get drafted before coming out and saying "I was raped" in order to get paid off. We'll never know because someone else, while looking for dirt on Jameis, found this, and brought it out.


of course, he could have actually raped her too.... I hope, if he did, he is locked up for it. But noone seems to think that women can extort the rich and famous or noone seems to think we should be allowed to question if there is a motive like that.

oh I have no question I don't want him off the team as a player..... I wish none of this had happened and he could just win the Heisman and Title for my team....

but, for the same reasons I asked questions about Duke lacrosse situation, the Kobe Bryant situation, even the Ben Rothlessburger situation.... I question THIS situation.


Now, if this was happening to the Florida Gaytors, or Bama....I'd still be questioning it... but don't think I wouldn't start a "no means no" chant against him.

I just want the investigation to be allowed to ask those questions.... I'm not sure they are allowed.

The entire TPD thing does (*)(*)(*)(*) me off. They are continuing to leak information and they probably are guilty of coverup. To me, those issues are seperate to themselves (police corruption) and has no bearing on whether or not Jameis raped a girl. Do I have doubt that a tallahassee detective is an FSU football fan..... absolutely not. I don't think players are above the law. But police corruption after the fact, doesn't change if she was raped, or if she was using sex as an opportunity for future exploitations....

I think another agency needs to take this case over. (As a fan, I hope they do that AFTER Jan. 8 though)

 

Crazy thought.... How about getting married before having sex with a woman, and then you don't have this problem? I know, crazy huh?

 

Crazy like other ideals.

 

DNA proves contact or actual sex. It does not prove rape.

All immediate accusations should be investigated yes. But such accusations mean lille if no rape test kit is done by medical professionals. There are some exceptions of couse but generally without such a test it is one persons word against another which should never be enough to convict someone of such a heinous crime.

 

In many cases no it is forbidden to ask such questions. If you do you are a mysoginist or rape defender.

Obviously we need to ask such questions and not allow such accusations to stop us.

It is not merely rich guys targeted for such accusations but average joes and even dirt poor guys. Being a wealthy man merely makes you a juicier target as you point out. Some women have made false charges out of spite or for revenge. As in "how dare he not call me after I put out for him " or " how dare he break up with me " a rape charge really makes some women feel better.

Others file false charges for alibis or to cover their own misdeeds. Such as " no I was not cheating he raped me " or "I caught herpes when he raped me ". In one recent case 3 women who rode in the back of a cab accused the driver of sexually assaulting them ( never mind the physics of how one guy in the front seat can assault 3 women in the back ). He was arrested and charged until the cab company produced a video from the dash camera which proved he never touched or even spoke rude to any of them. But thanks to their false charge they never paid the $13.00 cab fare. And none of the three were ever charged.

No one is defending the disgusting crime of rape least of all me but it is high time we raise awareness of how damaging a false accusation can be and how often it is ignored. Being the victim of such an accusation can be as bad as being a victim of rape.

It is known that not all crimes of rape are reported and therefore it happens more often than we realize. What is not so well known or acknowledged is that far too many false accusations exist and we do not know how many. One reason for this is that they are seldom prosecuted.Somehow a woman can make a false accusation and walk away without facing charges even after she is proven to be a fraud.

 

well, now the issue over Jameis seems to be, he was cheating on his g/f with this #cleatchaser (the tag she would use on twitter). On the night in question, after consentual sex, she got upset that Jameis wouldn't leave his g/f who was coming into town that night. She started hitting him, and so he restrained her. She then went to police that night and filed the report.

http://distinctathlete.com/jameis-winston-will-facing-charges-sources-say/


all sources are sketchy at best with this scenario... but it does show how there are situations that can happen that can ruin a man's life over vindictiveness

 

http://espn.go.com/college-football...ston-not-charged-sexual-assault-investigation


Seems a girl got caught by her b/f after having a gangbang with a the football team, so she claims rape to avoid being dumped or thought of as a slut....


but noooooo, stuff like this never happens.... women would never false report.....


It's women like this, that are the reason why it's so hard for women who DO get raped, to get justice

 

If nobody ever lied, we'd have no miscarriage of justice for anyone.

 

yep.... but why are we still not allowed to ask hard questions about the girl in rape scenarios


people seem to think false claims are very rarely made. This is not a unique situation here..... add to it... money, or power.... and the situation begs for a groupie to have sex with someone famous, then exploit them after the fact

 

#cleatchaser (the tag she would use on twitter).

 

EGGZACTLY.....

she had sex with her b/f, then later, got ho-trained by members of the football team... and was caught by said b/f. She had to think quickly on how to get out of it so she claimed rape.

 

Instead of trying to find fault with either party why not let the proper authorities do the job they are trained and paid for .. far to many arm chair detectives making judgements without all the facts.

 

I remember Duke Lacrosse here on this forum.... if you dared question "maybe the girl is lieing" then you were immediately accused of being sexist and "blaming the victim"

when it turned out the girl was lieing.... people just ignored it like the duke team members were collateral damage... or the coach of the team, lost his job, when he wasn't even involved in the matter....

 

As I said let the people who are trained and paid do their job, until such time the full story becomes available either with a charge or not, everything here is just supposition.