Some say Haley was wrong for not mentioning slavery as the cause of the civil war

Thank you for the information. I'll look into it further.

It would confirm that the overt belligerence was a deliberate policy rather than an aberration.

 

Not if a lot of large families owned one slave.

I don't know how invested family members are in a head of the family's slave. Certainly, everyone was aware of slaves.

Why do white Southerners vote for Republicans? They pass right-to-work laws, discourage unions, discriminate against women...

Please, not mint juleps.

The government wasn't interfering with the guy's life.

They were far more interested in slavery than the constitution.

 

They were likely going to end up in a fight eventually, but your point is well taken.

 

The idea there was a "bald tyranny of an oppressive central government" is too much to accept as their motivation, either the plantation owners or the white farmers and shopkeepers.

I think this and similar analyses...

https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w25700/w25700.pdf

... establishes the economic and social system that better explains why poor and sometimes landless whites fought for the South.

 

Please identify any speech or document from before the Civil War in which a Confederate spokesman specifies the 10th Amendment as a casus belli.

 

It was the entire concept of the rights of individual, sovereign states encapsulated within the 10th Amendment that was at the heart of the Southern grievance. You see that over and over in The Declaration of Causes of Seceding States, like Georgia, South Carolina, Mississippi, Texas, and Virginia: https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states .

The 'spark' or catalyst for the Civil War was slavery, as I've said, but the central, fundamental issue was that Southerners rebelled against the Northern faction's intent to use unconstitutional powers to dictate policies which, in their minds, must be (per the 10th Amendment) "...reserved to the States respectively, or to the people".

But I suspect you'll settle for nothing but tracts from speeches or documents issued by Southern spokesmen that mention the 10th Amendment specifically. What I suggest is much more to the point is that instead of looking for individual 'trees' you look at the 'forest' that envelops them! But, assuming that you won't do that, then please tell me where in the Constitution (prior to the Civil War) slavery is forbidden, or, that states are forbidden to leave the compact called "The United States".

 

You are correct: Nothing but a specific citation of the 10th Amendment would support your claim.
The Articles of Confederation specified "a perpetual Union" which was made "more perfect" in the Constitution. Case closed.

 

One problem there, Jack -- the Articles of Confederation are not contained in the Constitution of the United States!

It is to the Constitution alone that every president, vice-president, and just about everybody in a position of duty, service, or trust throughout government right down to the lowliest E-1 in the military swears (SWEARS) allegiance... every sweet, loving word of it, and its Amendments. There's lots of other lovely rhetoric and stuff that's been written (some of it by the same Founding Fathers who wrote the Constitution), but if it ain't in the Constitution, it ain't 'constitutional'.

Besides, the Articles of Confederation were a failure! Surely you knew that....

Remember this? Link: https://constitutioncenter.org/blog...tablished “the United,each state had one vote.

 

The Articles are cited in Constitutional cases down to the present day.
"The Supreme Court has looked to the Articles of Confederation in more than 150 cases for guidance in determining the meaning of the Constitution."
A Concise Guide to the Articles of Confederation as a Source ...

The George Washington University
https://scholarship.law.gwu.edu › cgi › viewcontent

PDF
by GE Maggs · 2017 · Cited by 41 — Members of the Supreme Court have cited the Articles of Confederation in ten constitutional cases since John Roberts became Chief Justice, including in ...

United States v. Wheeler :: 254 U.S. 281 (1920)

Justia US Supreme Court Center
https://supreme.justia.com › cases › federal


P. 254 U. S. 293. 2. Uniformity of this right was secured by the Articles of Confederation, not by lodging power in Congress to deal ...

 

You're a fine fellow and greatly more considerate and scholarly than some who have posted in this thread. I've said what I have to say, and I rely completely on the Constitution as written and amended.

Perhaps one thing we can agree on is that if the North hadn't been so overbearing and conniving -- and -- if the South hadn't been so reactionary, hot-headed, and foolish, this whole horrible, bloody chapter in American history might never have occurred. Great Britain and France had gotten rid of slavery in their nations and colonies a few years before we did here, and they managed to do it without a war. I hope we learned something useful from that....

 

I appreciate the compliment, but it remains my view that the Civil War happened because some in the South were determined to have a war. Please see The Road to Disunion, William W. Freehling.

 

I'm especially intrigued by the possibilities of the second volume, "The Road to Disunion, Volume II". As soon as I'm finally finished with a lengthy tome I've been reading about the Roman Empire, I'm going to follow your suggestion, and I thank you for it. I see that 'good' copies are available on a 'used' basis at amazon for as little as three bucks!

Link: https://www.amazon.com/Road-Disunio...1&sprefix=The+Road+to+Disunion,aps,287&sr=8-1

 

Yup. Enjoy.
The Road to Disunion: Volume II: Secessionists Triumphant, 1854-1861

 

How about a war between Taiwan and West Taiwan?

 

When they were the same country? How is that equivalent to a war between the Confederate States of America and the United States of America?

 

The Lying Outlaw Slavers of Beijing have never ruled the Free Nation of Taiwan.

 

Yet they are free. Like boys claiming they are girls China claims Tawain is ruled under China. Denying reality doesn't make it so.

 

We've all changed during the last 4 years.



And the civil war most certainly was fought over slavery.

 

She's not a realist and she's not committed to the truth.

Nikki Haley Refuses to Say a Man Cannot Become a Woman During Campaign Event.

I caught right on during the first debate when she went on and on about how she was uniquely qualified because she is a woman. Who thinks like that? Now she can't even say what a woman is, or isn't.


'Claims her heels are "Ammo"'