Wow, you are correct ! I apologize most sincerely, I thought WJV was the OP, not you...... Gadzooks what an error ! Sorry about that Maccabee !
DoctorWho Winfrey........... YOU GET A GUN, AND YOU GET A GUN, AND YOU GET A GUN, AND YOU GET A GUN..
Why do so many Americans think that people questioning law is such a bad thing? Many countries don't understand why Americans love guns and why you seem intent on shooting each other in vast numbers each year so why not question it? Aren't we simply exorcising this freedom thing you guys keep banging on about. From what i can gather, America is a rather brutal place but each to their own. In America, owning a gun seems to be a sign of freedom and protection, where i live its the sign of being a bit weak and a coward but that's just different cultures and history. Just because people question your way of life, it doesn't mean we want to change it - in many cases it will be due to fascination/interest in places that are different. The thing about home invaders (thats a funny name by the way)...the thing about home invaders is that in America i guess there is a bigger chance that the home invader is going to be armed where as where i live, the chances of a thief being armed is so tiny that it negates the need to be armed. Like i said, it does seem as American is a fr more brutal place to live so i can see why gun ownership is so popular.
You've made a couple of posts here and I have to chime in to respond. In the first place, the same God that inspired the founding of our nation is the same God mentioned in the King James (or equivalent) Bible in the UK or any other country. That Bible clearly mandates that Christians be armed and that they know when and under what circumstances to use force. "35 And he (Jesus) said unto them (his disciples), When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. 36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luke 22 :35 and 36 In II Timothy 3 : 16 we read: "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:..." We don't get to take a knife, as you do, and carve away what we don't like. We have to be guided by events like the David v Goliath or maybe the account in Judges 13 where Sampson rose up against the Philistines and slew thirty men. In another account of Sampson, he took the jawbone of an azz (silly censors) and killed a thousand men. In John 2 : 15 the actions of Jesus are unmistakable: "And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;..." Jesus labeled the bad guys, he beat the beans out of them with a weapon and he kicked them out of the temple. And again, "ALL scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness..." Now, let us get down to some hard core honesty here. The UK likes to "cook the books" when it comes to the crime and murder rate. Too many countries want to make unfair comparisons to make the claim that the U.S. is more violent than other countries. You can't beat the facts though: https://www.americas1stfreedom.org/articles/2015/7/17/how-the-uk-covers-up-murder-stats/ https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/apr/21/rate-england-wales-2015-rises-11 You want to claim that we are a more violent nation, but you want an unfair comparison. The U.S. has ... what 335 million people here compared to your 65 million? You have to have valid information if you want the truth. Your country has around half a million undocumented foreigners roving about without authorization. The U.S. has 11 MILLION undocumented foreigners. Most of them come from south of the border (and the jihadists come in from Muslim countries) and those countries have violence rates far greater than that of the U.S. Your facts are wrong and you are dealing in emotions, not reality. If you came home one day and your wife were being attacked by a gang, if you had a firearm, you'd save her life if you had any conscience. If you would deny yourself the tools to protect your family, you'd be little more than an infidel. Don't fool yourself. Currently the United States thinks it can be the great melting pot and we are inundated by people from every corner of the globe. There is an effort to make our country a dictatorial POLICE STATE where there is no difference between the police and the military. For anyone to think that I would disarm in view of the fact that we have, literally, millions of people coming from countries who are REALLY violent and I could not protect myself, you've got to be kidding. To give up Liberty teeth? Joking again? As I recall, the United States was founded because we did not want to be like you. Didn't we fight a war or something like that to establish the concept of unalienable Rights? Yeah, in this country we have Rights. People get killed in automobiles, but we can own any kind of automobile we want. 435,000 people in the United States die each year from smoking cigarettes (that's almost the undocumented population in your country.) But, the American people are willing to die to protect that "right." People even drink booze and mow down their fellow Americans... but you can still buy booze. Liberty and Freedom come with a price. Sometimes the benefits outweigh the costs. In reality, we're no more violent than you. We just prefer to be responsible for our own destiny. So, the next time you want to misrepresent us, you might find that the facts are a bit different than what you present on this board.
You speak like a young child that has seen very little of life and has scant experience is a person that is intentionally ignoring important factors. America is not particularly brutal, We do not have soccer / football riots as you do after a match goes sideways, your Rugby game is also more violent. Overall, America is no More violent than any other Country, perhaps far less than most. We do have segments of very violent Minorities that most people seem to ignore yet those same people want to disarm those that want Arms in order to defend themselves from those violent Minorities. This is the policy that People in America rebel against, those that respect the Laws should not be punished more than those who do not.
I'll answer this. It is not the law that you are questioning. You are questioning the god given right of self preservation. You are questioning whether we should be able to protect our families if bad intention comes into our homes. We know what tools criminals use to hurt us and we want to have equal or better tools for our defense. The bad guys that are "intent on shooting each other" are by far mostly gang bangers and drug dealers in urban settings. These are the people that are inflating our gun violence statistics. The average legal gun owner is not intent on shooting anyone. They simply acknowledge that evil does exist and they love their families and want the ability to protect them should the need arise.
You speak like a young child that has seen very little of life and has scant experience or a person that is intentionally ignoring important social factors. America is not particularly brutal, We do not have soccer / football riots as you do after a match goes sideways, your Rugby game is also more violent. Overall, America is no More violent than any other Country, perhaps far less than most. We do have segments of very violent Minorities that most people seem to ignore yet those same people want to disarm those that want Arms in order to defend themselves from those violent Minorities. This is the policy that People in America rebel against, those that respect the Laws should not be punished more than those who do not. It is not a so called "Love of Guns" or culture of violence Foreigners keep prattling on about, although the Rap culture seems predicated on Violence against society, Rap culture is not mainstream culture and a small segment of a Minority sub culture.
Your third to last sentence isn't true for the most part. While some are curoius, most are condemning.
Mate, using the bible as a basis for an argument isn't the best idea, especially when i have no religious faith I love the differences between the US and the UK, it what makes life interesting. P.S. The concept of being an immigrant has a lot to do with time. To most of us in the UK, unless you are a native american Indian then you are all immigrants so please try and appreciate the inherent comedy in a nation of immigrants moaning about immigration :0) Don't ask me to be frightend of muslims, i grew up i the 70's and the IRA were far more effective and killed far more of us than those pesky fuzzie wuzzies will ever do. Like i said mate, owning a gun is a good thing in America, In the UK its a sign of a weak man - Vive la difference! :0) You been to the UK much then?
That is a load of Dingoes kidneys and mere Political posturing, the U.K. has plenty of History involving personal Firearms, your narrow view of Firearms is not typical of British history, now that Guns are outlawed for most purposes, such as personal defense. There is a difference that seems to escape you about Guns and their purpose, Guns are not about weakness or strength, it is about equality, one does not worry about friends or neighbors, or even Muslims etc... It is about People that mean to rob you and do you injury, they are not your everyday acquaintance you meet at the pub for an ale or two, these are people you hope never to meet alone unarmed on a secluded area. Perhaps you might understand this issue better from a better perspective.
Is owning a gun in the UK seen as a weakness if a single woman owns one because she has been violently raped and now wants a tool to help prevent future assaults? Is owning a gun in the UK seen as a weakness if a wheel chair bound person feels safer with it due to previous life experiences? Is owning a gun in the UK seen as a weakness if an elderly couple on limited income keeps one in the home that they have lived in for 30 years and now their neighborhood has become drug infested over recent years?
Pray tell how so? Do not steal, do not cheat, do not kill, do not rape, do not lie, honoring your parents, etc. are all teachings within the Bible.
Then this thread isn't for you. This entire thread is about the Bible and self defense. It's illegal immigration that we are concerned about. That's not an argument. Once or twice.
Matthew5:38 [FONT=&]You have heard that it was said, [/FONT][FONT=&]An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.[/FONT]39 [FONT=&]But I say to you, [/FONT][FONT=&]Do not resist the one who is evil. But [/FONT][FONT=&]if anyone [/FONT][FONT=&]slaps you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also.[/FONT]40 [FONT=&]And [/FONT]if anyone would sue you and take your tunic,[FONT=&]let him have your cloak as well.[/FONT]41 [FONT=&]And if anyone [/FONT][FONT=&]forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles.[/FONT]42 [FONT=&]Give to the one who begs from you, and [/FONT][FONT=&]do not refuse the one who would borrow from you. [/FONT]Sounds pretty damn straightforward to me. Pity ammosexuals seem to be such (*)(*)(*)(*)ty Christians... [FONT=&][/FONT]
In short the bible is irrelevant to gun rights, unless that is you can prove the existence of god .. can you?
And once more, why do you keep on with your thinly veiled Bigoted comments against Gay people ? By constantly harping on Homosexuals that own guns, it is getting old.
The Original post was about self defense as it relates to the Bible, and according to the terms of service of this forum, if you do not wish to abide by the actual content or context of the OP you should start another post rather than Derail this one.
Clearly I'm not pro gun control. As you know I am Ute indian and was raised with different beliefs. I have read most of the bible and found it to be a very violent book. The one that gets me the most is the commandment that I not kill. I do believe the bible was and is the bases for a lot of killing that has been done in it's name. It's hard to reconcile the two. In my belief I need no more permission or right then the Bear has to defend it's cub's. My question is, how do you reconcile do not kill? As the commandments do not provide another option, " THOU SHALL NOT KILL"
The Bible's injunction is against Murder, if you look at all the references to killing in Scripture it is wanton killing that is prohibited, even wanton killing of animals, Nimrod was a mighty hunter that opposed G-d, even the blood of those animals killed wantonly would need to be accounted for. The scripture also gives parameters for home invaders and when it was permissible to kill them.
