The Story of Joan of Arc Proves God

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joan_of_Arc

There is no credible way to explain the story of Joan of Arc without admitting the existence of God.

Modern theories that Joan had a psychiatric disorder do not match up with the facts. Contemporaries, including the Dauphin, considered Joan to be healthy and sane. The Dauphin's father was insane so he knew the signs of insanity and did not see them in Joan.

Joan's story is an example of God intervening in human events and changing the outcome. Had God not intervened, the modern nation of France might not exist today.

And let's face it, a French victory over the English required a miracle. France is not known for winning wars. Joan put heart in the French troops, which they had lost after the thumping they got at Agincourt.

Joan was first believed when she predicted the outcome of a battle many miles away. The Dauphin became confident in her when she told him something known only to him and God. Joan's first and third trials proved that she was a woman of virtue and orthodoxy to the Catholic faith.

Joan is considered a martyr and a saint by the Catholic Church. Her witchcraft trial at the hands of churchmen loyal to England was a sham. She died rather than renounce her voices.

Hollywood has tried to portray her as insane but this doesn't match with historical facts. Atheists cannot explain the miraculous predictions of Joan so they pretend she never existed.

 

Proves that you will believe anything.

 

Is that the best you can do?

Your sarcasm isn't going to make Joan of Arc go away.

 

I bet you think the stories from other religions are all bull(*)(*)(*)(*) though. I see right through you.

 

It's all he needs.

"When you talk to God, we call that prayer, When God talks to you, we call that schizophrenia." Dr Tomas Szasz

 

http://www.google.com.au/#hl=en&cp=10&gs_id=t&xhr=t&q=define+gullible&pf=p&sclient=psy-ab&site=&source=hp&rlz=1R2ADRA_enAU417&pbx=1&oq=define+gul&aq=0&aqi=g4&aql=&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=dc62c046efa75dd2&biw=1680&bih=882


http://www.google.com.au/#hl=en&cp=12&gs_id=1s&xhr=t&q=define+narrow+minded&pq=define+gullible&pf=p&sclient=psy-ab&rlz=1R2ADRA_enAU417&source=hp&pbx=1&oq=define+narro&aq=0&aqi=g4&aql=&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=dc62c046efa75dd2&biw=1680&bih=882

 

I think it is likely that Jeanne D'arc heard angels voices. I have to wonder though, were the english so wicked that God wanted a french victory? God has talked to other people. His prophets of Israel and Judah. I don't think any of them led an army. I'll have to think about that.. but he did have judges of Israel that led armies and were successful. Jeanne was more a judge than a prophet it would seem. It is probably that the french prayed for victory and that God may have granted that victory to them. Was she crazy? I don't know but she would not renounce her voices so that leads me to believe that she definitely believed that she heard them. Interesting approach.

 

And her reward was that the church burned her alive...........

 

God did get involved in Israel's battles and worked miracles on their behalf. There's one story where God told Moses he had to keep up his arms. While Moses kept up his arms, the battle favored the Israeli's. When Moses lowered his arms, the battle favored the enemy. Moses' arms got tired so he had to have Aaron and another guy hold up his arms.

 

What battle was that?

 

Joan was tried by churchmen loyal to England. These men betrayed the Church with their corrupt and dishonest behavior in unjustly condemning Joan. They put loyalty to king above fidelity to God.

A later trial run by honest churchmen found Joan innocent.

 

In Rouen?????

 

Battle with Amalek

 

Rouen was the second trial of three. According to Wikipedia, Joan of Arc is the best documented person in the Middle Ages because of the transcripts of these trials.

 

Nah, it just proves that the English were wimps

 

“Of the love or hatred God has for the English, I know nothing, but I do know that they will all be thrown out of France, except those who die here.”

 

At the time, the King was gods choice to rule on earth, without the Pope's blessing (literally), a person coulod not be King anywhere in Christianity. That is why we separate church and state here in the US. Joan was probably a virtuous woman and the trial had political motives, not surprising when it concerns the Catholic church and monarchies of that time. Not sure how this could prove the unprovable, but I'm not here to convert you to athiesm. As for the French winning the battle, even a blind pig roots up an acorn every now and then. Not to worry, the French went on to have a losing record until Napoleon. Understand also, we cannot look at France and England as we do today, at that time, the royal families were intertwined.

 

The English were not wimps. The crushed the French at Agincourt against overwhelming odds and after that the demorialized French would not even meet them at battle.

It took direct intervention of God to turn things around. Had God not intervened there might not be a France. We might have a very big England that includes part of France.

 

If only it were true, I wouldn't be here talking to silly Americans!

 

France is protected by God.

There can be no other explanation for how a country that loses every war is still a country.

 

I believe Joan of Arc existed. I also believe she was an incredibly brave young woman. I don't know whether she heard voices in her head or God, or whatever. She heard something, that much is known.

 

After Mary gave birth to that bum of a son of her, she fled to France to avoid shame! God saw what a terrible destiny he inflicted upon that poor woman, and decided to bless her newly elected place!

 

France has had more than its fair share of saints and miracles. It's too bad so many French have turned away from the faith of their fathers.

 

I love the story of Joan of Arc, however I don't see it proving the existence of God.

Someone claiming they saw/heard/touched God has never been proof of God's existence. I could claim that I talked to God but it hardly proves He exists.

I also don't see how you think that a French victory over the English required a miracle. If people don't think that they can win, then they won't. However, is people are told they cannot lose, then they will keep trying until they win. That is what Joan of Arc did, she gave a defeated people hope and courage. She was an amazing woman and it gripes me when people try to take away her achievements by saying that she couldn't have done it without some omnipotent being intervening.

As for the predictions. Memory bias can explain most if not all of them. Us humans are very good at adjusting our memories to suit the situation. An off hand remark of who Joan thought was going to win the battle blossoms into a prophecy worthy of the Oracle of Delphi when filtered through people's memories and retelling of the story.

And what about what Joan of Arc told the Dauphin? We don't know what she said so it proves nothing. Maybe Joan was blackmailing him with some embarrassing information, offering sexual favors or just begged him to support her. Even if the Dauphin did tell what God told her to say, it doesn't mean he wouldn't lie.

If you believe that that God did communicate to Joan of Arc and that through her, France became the country that it is today, I say great. You have the right to believe anything you want. However, if you expect others to take this as proof, you are mistaken.

 

That's what a long term acquaintance with phoney saints and miracles does to you.

Perhaps, in times, after being exposed to many US saints such as "W" ... and their miracles such as "Mission Accomplished" .. you will understand.