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USA not 1/1000th of the way through the Pandemic.

Discussion in 'Coronavirus Pandemic Discussions' started by Kurmugeon, Mar 31, 2020.

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  1. Shonyman32

    Shonyman32 Well-Known Member

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    The fact is it is happening not having a % or number doesnt mean it's not happening. I provide proof quit your spinning.
     
    Shonyman32, Apr 18, 2020
    #226
  2. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    Influenza Like Illnesses (ILI) are still very high in Louisiana, South Carolina, New Jersey, Rhode Island, Maryland, New York, Connecticut, and Massachusetts, but while the hospitalizations are still high, the deaths are down now. In March, yup kinda high.
     
    jay runner, Apr 18, 2020
    #227
  3. Shonyman32

    Shonyman32 Well-Known Member

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    Thank you.
     
    Shonyman32, Apr 19, 2020
    #228
  4. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Wrong! The link does not say non Covid deaths, it says they were not tested. Why are you deliberately posting fake news? Perhaps you can explain why the excess total number of deaths in New York is more than double the usual total number of deaths in New York for the same period compared to previous years?
     
    truth and justice, Apr 19, 2020
    #229
  5. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    If they were not tested you can't confirm that they were COVID deaths. The symptoms are pretty similar to the annual flu. If you refuse to test for COVID-19 then declare the death as COVID-19, that's fraud.
     
    Lil Mike, Apr 19, 2020
    #230
  6. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    You specifically stated that they were not = fake news from you.

    But anyway, you ignored my straight forward question regarding doubling of total deaths in New York which does not depend at all on the causes of death
     
    truth and justice, Apr 19, 2020
    #231
  7. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Science doesn't work that way. I don't have to prove the non Covid-19 positive tests really were coronavirus. You need to prove they were. If they were not tested, there is no basis for saying they were Coronavirus deaths.

    No scientific reason anyway.

    As to your question, so what? Death rates for a given month year after year are not the same and there is no reason they should be. Are you saying that you think that any "excess" death is corona?
     
    Lil Mike, Apr 19, 2020
    #232
  8. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Science doesn't work that way.? No one stated that they were coronavirus victims! You were the one who posted fake news about that science that actually did state that they were not tested yet you stated that they were not coronavirus victims = fake news from you

    So what? I never said they should be the same! More fake news from you.

    "That comes out to a projected total of 5155.2 deaths expected for New York City from March 11-April 13, 2020. The reality was 18,551 deaths"
    https://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/how-many-people-have-died-in-nyc-during-the-covid-pandemic

    More than 3 times the usual number of deaths in New York yet Lil Mike thinks that has little to do with the virus
     
    truth and justice, Apr 19, 2020
    #233
  9. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    Science is grinding damn near slower than the law and justice. We want results, good results, and we want them now.
     
    jay runner, Apr 19, 2020
    #234
  10. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    "No one stated that they were coronavirus victims!"


    Uh, they were listed as coronavirus deaths, in spite of no positive COVID-19 tests.
     
    Lil Mike, Apr 19, 2020
    #235
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  11. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    You stated that they were not victims of the virus!
    "As of April 14th, New York City added 3700 non COVID deaths to the COVID totals."

    And you're still ignoring the important point

    "That comes out to a projected total of 5155.2 deaths expected for New York City from March 11-April 13, 2020. The reality was 18,551 deaths"
    https://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/how-many-people-have-died-in-nyc-during-the-covid-pandemic

    More than 3 times the usual number of deaths in New York
     
    truth and justice, Apr 19, 2020
    #236
  12. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    If there is no positive COVID test, it's not a COVID death.
     
    Lil Mike, Apr 19, 2020
    #237
  13. Lee S

    Lee S Moderator Staff Member Past Donor

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    I would be willing to bet a months paycheck that the death rate from coronavirus will be closer to 4.5 individuals than it will be to 4.5 million. The original estimate for the deaths caused by coronavirus in Oregon was 485,000 individuals. It was downgraded to 22,000. It was downgraded again to 500. Finally our latest expected death toll in Oregon is expected to be 171 or roughly one third less deadly than the common flu.

    Likewise, the point in which the coronavirus was supposed to peak in Oregon was in early April, then pushed back to mid-April, then to late April, and right now the supposed peak is mid-May. I personally don't think there will be a peak. I do not believe there will even be 171 deaths in Oregon. The experts have been wrong about almost everything, just like they were wrong about SARs which was supposed to kill hundreds of millions, based on computer modelling yet somehow managed to kill only 1,800 individuals worldwide. I suppose we are simply waiting for the peak and people will start dropping in the hundreds of thousands from SARS any day now. These very same experts predicted massive deaths from H1NI, Asian bird flu, and while we are at it, why don't we add in Y2K, African killer bees, fire ants, and the death of everyone because the earth passed through the tail of Halley's Comet in 1910. It is a good thing we heeded the advice of experts in 1910 and took our anti-comet pills otherwise we wouldn't be here today. Of course, the experts claimed credit that because of their sage advice in social distancing, no, I mean taking anti-comet pills, we somehow made it out alive.

    At some point, we need to realize that the death toll from coronavirus was vastly overestimated and the reason the experts are pushing off the date of the peak is that it probably ever happened. he experts expected a tidal wave and we actually got a ripple.

    I think the takeaways we have are:

    Computer modelling is so flawed a science that it is time to start laughing at it. Well, maybe not laughing in that the economic and social destruction that was caused by a ripple was far too dear.

    Experts are reluctant to admit they were wrong.

    Experts who make dire predictions that are ruinous economically need to be held liable for the damage they caused.

    The media is tremendously irresponsible and out of control. Their reporting of wild conjecture which is stated as fact is reckless and damaging to society.

    It is imperative for every citizen to check the claims of experts, media, and politicians on their own. Get a calculator and look at the death rates of Italy, South Korea, and even China and anyone can see that the death tolls are far less than they are with a normal flu season.

    I am sure there are more lessons in this tremendous debacle, Perhaps posters can come up with others.
     
    Lee S, Apr 19, 2020
    #238
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  14. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    The number of total deaths in the last four weeks is double that of the corresponding four weeks of previous year for Italy, UK, France and Spain and for New York it is triple the expected number of deaths
     
    truth and justice, Apr 19, 2020
    #239
  15. Moolk

    Moolk Well-Known Member

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    Exactly, there are a lot of "assumed" covid 19 deaths being included in these stats.

    Its pretty shady.
     
    Moolk, Apr 19, 2020
    #240
  16. Moolk

    Moolk Well-Known Member

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    There is an uncomfortable reality people have to come to terms with...and that's there is an acceptable number of dead due to reopening the economy, that still justifies reopening our economy.

    If ALL we wanted to do in our world is save lives then there is any number of things we could due to save lives by becoming authoritarian has hell.

    We could save countless lives by requiring people diet and exercise to lessen the amount of deaths due to obesity.

    We could require mandatory checks of houses/work spaces by the govt to ensure there are no guns, pointed knives, or other unsafe practices occurring.

    We could make it illegal to drive for your average civilian and require you utilize a govt funded uber program to drive you wherever you need to go, to lessen the amount of deaths related to driving.

    We could institute heavy drug and alcohol related laws.

    We could institute curfews.

    The list of things we could do to save lives is nearly as endless as there are ways for us to die. But the reality is, we care about more than just saving lives. We care about freedom, we care about our economy, we care about the ability to largely live our lives how we want free of the govt. So while it is always easy to make an argument for the bleeding hearts about saving lives by keeping our economy shut down...there IS an acceptable amount of death we can endure to justify opening our economy so that peoples lives are destroyed by lack of jobs/money. What is that number of acceptable deaths? Idk, I'm not even sure I'm comfortable answering that myself, that's fortunately for me only something our leaders have to decide and have on their mind. But, it exists nonetheless.
     
    Moolk, Apr 19, 2020
    #241
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