What are Progressive Values?

The first thing you should do it try to separate fantasy from reality. What is the crime picture in YOUR area? You can look it up on www.spotcrime.com and see how many crimes are going on near you.

If you do not believe crime and police reports---and believe they are mostly "fearmongering" then go the nearest bad crime area and walk around by yourself, unarmed after midnight.

If you think ISIS is a hoax, then travel to Turkey and travel South into supposed ISIS territory and see how nice and warm the people there are.

 

The world wide flood from the utmost of moral authority, God.

Sure they can and do.
In the USA, the laws guide moral authority. And the gov't is a representation of the people.

If the gov'ts of the world didn't give moral authority guidance the world would be total chaos.
Laws guide the morals of the people.

Where do you think a society's morals come from?

What doles out punishments for stealing, and killing? Gov'ts do.

 

Evil flourishes - when good men do nothing !

 

I've scrolled through many replies to your opening post, and in the ones I've read, no one has responded to your request for a list of progressive values. Our founding fathers were progressives as opposed to the conservatives, who were loyal to the English royalty. Therefore, many progressive values can be found in the US Declaration of Independence.

• "...all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." Well, we could update "men" to read "people" and get rid of the word "Creator." A modern reading might be that all men and women have equal rights before the law regardless of skin color, gender, or religion.
• "That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,...." In other words, people should have the right to chose their own government.
• Also a progressive belief that dates back to the early 1900s and has only been sporadically practiced in this country is the equality of economic opportunity, meaning that the government should not give economic advantages to one class of people and deny those advantages to others. Progressives believe that our present governmental practice of transferring wealth from the working and middle classes to the very wealthy is unjust.
• Honesty is another progressive value not mentioned in the Declaration and lacking today when so many are willing to accuse public officials of corruption on trumped up (no pun intended) charges for which there is no evidence.

Well, there's the start of a list.

 

Well a "progressive" in 1789 America is not the same thing now here in 2106.

That would mean that a highly conservative person such as George Washington today would have no objection to inheriting dozens of slaves and working them on his farm. He would also be the champion of LGBT issues in direct contradiction to Biblical values that virtually everyone had a better understanding of back then.

But what about "freedom of religion" that was actually practiced by the Founders in their day? Yes there was no practicing Islam, Buddhism or Hinduism in the early colonies---however---there were million of savage Amerindians with their pagan religions (not really that different than Islam) right next to them. So did the Founders allow the pagan Indians to practice their pagan sacrifices in their colonial towns? Did the Founders not try to convert them to Christianity? Even the slightly more liberal Victorian era Americans did not allow the Plains Indians to practice brutal rituals like the Sun Dance, and have young men hung on hooks through their chests.

 

Your criticisms hit home. However, there were some founding fathers who realized that slavery was an abomination. John Adams was one. I would guess that even John Adams probably couldn't stomach an atheist.

You notice that after I quoted each passage from the Declaration of Independence, I attempted to update it to reflect modern values. Most of the founding fathers didn't even see a place in politics for women let alone people who weren't of a white European Christian background.

I know this is off the topic, but it just popped into my head that in Switzerland women didn't gain the right to vote until 1971.

 

Well, I'm the last person you'll find that will attempt to trash my Founding Fathers. They were just sooo awesome!

Anyway, this is one of my favorite games: Sit back like God on his throne and judge all people back in time by modern standards of morals and justice.

So much fun!

So, was George Washington and the other Founders with slaves wrong for having slaves??? Shouldn't they have known better?

If anyone answers "yes" and "yes"---then shouldn't have every other world leader back in 1789 have known better as well? And who gets a pass for having slaves back in history? You can ask the same thing for women voting, democracy and so forth.

 

I guess I am one of those people who would answer yes and yes. There were people in 1789 who knew that holding human beings as slaves was immoral. I have read that the issue of slavery was already a bone of contention when the US Constitution was written, but those who were opposed to slavery were unable to convince the slaveholders that they were doing something wrong. I suspect that Thomas Jefferson knew that slavery was wrong but took advantage of it anyway.

 

So -

Did the mass murderer war criminal Pres. O-BomBer finish
his (sig heil) speech at the Fascist Democrat Convention ???


And did the Fascist TV-Radio mass media fawn over the former first lady and State Dept. mass murderess Hitlerly like good little goose-steppers (sans arm bands and jack boots) ignoring the mass graves and piles of corpses in Syria, Libya and Iraq numbering in the hundreds of thousands during her time serving w/ Pres. O-BomBer ???






Have you skimmed this "Which Path to Persia?" war planning paper by the CFR and Brookings from 2009?

Its absolutely evil and mirrors the U.S. Obama war in Syria exactly. It describes involving Israel, creating pre-texts, sanctions, airstrikes, (allowing "Bibi" to bomb alone) funding/fomenting terror, its ******m outrageous ...and also "Supporting An Insurgency".

As well as a bunch of NeoCons still making war under Obama, NeoCons fund the opposition groups like in Syria, Libya wars, Obama is a "Liberal" and "democratic " in name only!


Notice the CFR connected types all play a role in the war plan ...

"Which Path to Persia?"

"The Brookings Institution itself is a creation of the notorious globalist funding arms including the Carnegie Corporation, the Rockefeller Foundation and the Ford Foundation, all who recently had been involved in the fake "Ground Zero Mosque" controversy. Today, Brookings boasts a full complement of support and funding from America's biggest corporations. Upon the Brookings Institution's board of trustees one will find a collection of corporate leaders from Goldman Sachs, the Carlyle Group, the insurance industry, Pepsi (CFR), Alcoa (CFR), and various CFR affiliated consulting firms like McKinsey & Company."

http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com/2011/02/brookings-which-path-to-persia.html

"NED & Freedom House are run by Warmongering Imperialists "

http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com/2011/11/ned-freedom-house-are-run-by.html


MEANWHILE - FOUNDATION FUNDED PHONY "PROGRESSIVES" DEMOCRACY NOW STILL PROVIDE LEFT COVER FOR OBAMA, HILLARY, BERNIE SANDERS AND THE CIA WHILE THE MASS SYRIA AND LIBYA CASUALTIES MOUNT (THEY PREFER TO TALK ABOUT THE BOGUS GLOBAL WARMING DEBATE, 'SOCIAL ISSUES' - KEYSTONE PIPELINE, AND LGBT, OR HAVE ON U.S. GOVMNT CONNECTED TYPES LIKE JUAN COLE WHITEWASH FOREIGN POLICY OBAMA WAR CRIMES ALTOGETHER LIKE RADIO HOST SAM SEDER HAD JUAN COLE ON, OR THE DIM BULB ABBY MARTIN HAD NOAM CHOMSKY AND RALPH NADER ON TO COVER UP OBAMA AND HILLARYS SUPPORT OF AL NUSRA AND ISIS FOR THE LEFT GATE KEEPERS HERDING THEIR AUDIENCE OF SHEEPLE!






some worthwhile reads:

Pacifica Radio Gatekeepers Sponsored by Ford (CIA) Foundation

http://educate-yourself.org/cn/fordfoundationciaandgatekeepers11oct05.shtml

Meet Professor Juan Cole, Consultant to the CIA

http://www.counterpunch.org/2011/08/30/meet-professor-juan-cole-consultant-to-the-cia/


The Gatekeepers of the So-Called Left

http://www.conspiracyarchive.com/2014/01/20/the-gatekeepers-of-the-so-called-left/


Ford Foundation, The CIA and U.S. Establishment Conspiracy--Conclusion

http://wherechangeobama.blogspot.com/2012/08/ford-foundation-cia-and-us_1971.html

The Left Gatekeepers Phenomenon

http://911review.com/denial/gatekeepers.html

Regulated Resistance: Part 2, by Charles Shaw

http://www.williambowles.info/media/2005/gatekeepers.html

 

I am a Progressive, and I find nothing in your post that I hold as a personal value. In terms of accuracy, you are entirely wrong.

 

I accept Bernie's claim as a progressive. Bernie never shared all his moral values during the primaries, but the ones where he valued a more equitable distribution of wealth through society to rebuild the middle class; his desire to offer college education to more financially challenged citizens through governmental assistance programs; his desire to regard access to healthcare as a social and political "right" rather than a privilege; and his desire to eliminate the financial controls currently practiced by the ultra-wealthy over our entire political system, are all progressive/liberal values shared with Bernie's supporters and most progressives. There are many others not openly mentioned that might or might not be shared by his followers. There's always that element of diversity between and among persons, regardless of the aspect being considered.

 

promoting the general welfare is a progressive value.

 

Yes, your views are typical---but probably a bit narrow. Now, since virtually every nation on the planet had slavery except maybe half of Europe---was every other national leader on planet also wrong for having slaves or not in 1789??

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abolition_of_slavery_timeline

So, were any other leaders besides White Christians wrong for having slaves everywhere else?

Were any of the tribal leaders of Native Americans, Africans, Arabs, Muslims, Asians, Oriental Emperors, Aboriginals, Pacific Islanders and so on wrong for allowing slavery?

 

Although every progressive democrat has very similar views like Sanders (killing unborn babies, destroying the 2nd Amendment, protecting gang murderers, unlimited free stuff, etc.)---it is his lack of comment on actual moral issues: lying, stealing, political corruption, demanding hard work, the importance of the traditional family---that are of course absent.

 

i believe government should promote the general welfare, not engender "hellish conditions of Warfare on Earth" on a perpetual basis.

 

Then you should be wanting radical Islam defeated quickly. I say fight them like we fought the Nazis. Very aggressively.

 

still haven't learned from the past?

we have a Commerce Clause.

 

No, it's accurate. Any "Progressive" who denies it is either delusional or lying.

 

any con that believes that is delusional or lying.

 

The idea that the US Govmnt and politicians is a huge shell company run by the banking isn't new, that is why AIG was bailed out so fast despite massive fraud - as was war cash machine for covert ops BCCI was. Goldman-Sachs and Chase are also run by CIA from the top- down according to college textbook studies and are US Gov operated. Pls read wikipedia Robert Kennedy bio - once RFK realized CIA was running policy above civillian US-Senate or Pres. control he was murdered 1 hour after his campaign vow to stop Vietnam. JFK died after announcing advisers would be pulled out of Vietnam to end it and MLK was killed by CIA after his vow to stop Vietnam. America is run by CIA war pimp media and gangsters !

 

The idea that the US Govmnt and politicians is a huge shell company run by the banking isn't new - add Citibank to the list of CIA US Govmnt controlled as w/ Rahm Emmanuels quote: 'You never let a serious crisis go to waste. And what I mean by that it's an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before.' All the terror events used to bolster Syria, Iraq escalations - Boston Marathon, Brusells, France, by known or CIA created 'ISIS' - US intel always knew their travels, and connections or provides 'visas for al queda' as reported.

 

Lol. Had to edit your comment and steal my words. Well, Progressives definitely love to steal. That's why they love taxing everything so much.

 

Those who couldn't see Sanders obvious self-censorship of war issues, and how it was Bernies intentional smokescreen device from the beginning, lied to themselves, and others - Thom Hartman, Amy Goodman, Ring of Fire, Pacifica Radio, KBOO.fm, Glen Greenwald, Michael Moore,Sam Seder, Mike Malloy, Norm Goldman, MSNBC, Ed Schultz, Maddow, and those same people in media INTENTIONALLY LIED and covered up the U.S instigated 'Arab Spring' illegal regime change wars since 2011 by CFR controlled - State Dept. and CIA (the two enitities work hand in glove) covert ops in Libya, Egypt, Syria, Bahrain, Yemen, Tunisia, and including the balkanization of Pakistan - as reported by Eric Dreitser of the Stop Imperialism podcast.





The Spectacle of Sanders in Philadelphia As Hillary Puppet


"He reduced himself to a caricature of the phony persona he displayed on the stump. Support for Clinton means endorsing imperial wars, democracy for the few alone and tyranny heading toward becoming full-blown while pretending otherwise.

Saying “Hillary Clinton will make an outstanding president, and I am proud to stand with her here tonight” showed everything he claims to stand for is a Big Lie.

It’s pure fantasy, duplicitous doublespeak, the lowest denominator of political dishonesty, stringing along his supporters, betraying them when it most mattered.

His soul was for sale all along. He’s now a footnote in the deplorable history of US politics, hugely corrupted, impossible to fix."


https://alethonews.wordpress.com/20...of-sanders-in-philadelphia-as-hillary-puppet/


_________________________________________________________________


The Sanders Sell-Out and the Clinton Wars to Come

By Gary Leupp


"He may call himself a “socialist,” but he’s no anti-imperialist. He has voted in favor of every “defense spending” bill, supported the NATO assault on Serbia in 1999, supported Israel’s attack on Gaza in 2014, etc.)"

(edit)

He could have asked, “Why the hell did you appoint Dick Cheney aide Victoria Nuland as Under Secretary of State for Eurasia, and support and fund that coup in Ukraine in 2014 in your ambition to expand NATO?”

But no. He didn’t have it in him. And now he wants his youthful erstwhile followers to transfer their support to someone who is not only the embodiment of Wall Street, with all its blood-sucking and all its crookedness, but the personification of U.S. imperialism in an era when its depth of crisis has produced a state of perpetual war."


https://alethonews.wordpress.com/2016/07/13/the-sanders-sell-out-and-the-clinton-wars-to-come/

 

THE ENDLESS WARS bankrupted America and impoverished its people -

Obama bailed out (like Reagan and BCCI) other banks, like Bushs wars, Clinton wants more of the same!

 

I am an atheists, and while I hold the belief that you may or may not worship as you please, I don't accept the premise that there is a god. However, if I were to concede that there was a great flood some 6000 years ago that swept away the enitre world population except for a few that were huddled in a boat, at that time the estimates of the population was between 7 million and 28 million. Government has killed far, far more that that.

No one in the USA represents me. There is no one that I voted for, nor is there anyone who I voted for their opponents. I do not vote, there for I do not give my consent

Government dole out punishment for victimless crimes. Government initiates aggression against individuals. Governments enslaves No way can that can be considered moral.

Morals are an individual trait. Only an individual person can have morals. Middle eastern governments dole out a punishment for stealing by cutting off a hand. Does that make it moral? Let;ss not even begin with dictators, let alone the tyranny of the majority to which you refer.