Why press 2 for Spanish is bad...

I have ranted elsewhere about how it irritates me how we are being bigoted in accommodating those Spanish-speakers who don't want to learn English, because if you are Lithuanian, or any other language group, you are on your own. Spanish is being treated with bias in favor of it.
I subscribe to the "Melting pot" which is what made America the envy of the world.
I wish in this thread to point out another fact - that allowing Hispanics to not learn English doesn't do them any good.

I'll make my point (I hope) with a true story.

Years ago, as a manager of others, I had to attend classes in discrimination. I was listening to the HR person saying that you "cannot discriminate in hiring due to age, race, religion, country of origin or inability to speak English" - I shouted out, "WHAT? Repeat that list" - and they said "You cannot discriminate in hiring if someone doesn't speak English". I said, "I can tell you right now that I will not hire anyone that does not speak English."
HR - "Then you are bigoted and discriminating"
Me - "No, I'm applying common sense. How is that supposed to work? I bring in someone who does not speak English for an interview - I ask them a question - they won't know what I'm asking. If they speak, I won't know what they are saying. On what basis could I hire them? How would I know if they are qualified? If I did hire them, how would that work? I'd tell them to do something, and they wouldn't know what I was saying. I'd have to be a fool to hire under those conditions."
HR - "You still can't discriminate because someone doesn't speak English."
Me - "Well, when HR hires someone who doesn't speak English, THEN I will listen to you - and if you do, let me know how that works out."

Anyone (Hispanic included) who doesn't learn English is limiting their job prospects. Not all who won't hire them are bigots, some are just practical and using common sense.

 

It grinds my gears (badly) when long term residents refuse to learn the language of their host country. It's a supreme middle finger, and tells us EXACTLY how they feel about us. My personal belief is that three years is long enough. In this country, that's the minimum period for citizenship.

 

On the other hand, it is very legal to refuse to hire someone who doesn't speak Spanish. Businesses in the SW US do it every day.

 

The "melting pot" idea of assimilation was abandoned decades ago by the left in favor of multiculturalism and pluralism. Expecting non-white minorities to assimilate into the dominant white majority's culture and language is "racist". If anything, we whites should be as accommodating as possible and learn their language. After all, they "enrich" us.

 

I have not abandoned the Melting Pot.
It made sense to me then, and still makes sense to me now.
They do enrich us, under the proper conditions.
I do not see this as "White" vs "Non-white". I was speaking about language.

 

Should those who don't know Spanish and move to Mexico be expected to learn Spanish?
What other nations beside America should be melting pots with each speaking in their own language like in Uganda---the most diverse nation in the world?

 

You should see it that way, because that is what it boils down to. The left isn't about to go up to a bunch of brown minorities and pressure them into speaking a language that was developed by, and spoken by, mostly white people. That doesn't help the left-wing agenda at all.

 

Was the reasoning for the above company policy, or federal (or state) law?

I have no problem if it's company policy. That's their right. I do have problem if it's federal law.

 

I think there are situations where it's appropriate. Someone can have a working ability to speak a language but still struggle when discussing something technical or unfamiliar, especially by phone. I suspect a lot of organisations that offer the option gain more from avoided confusion, delays and errors than what it costs.

Obviously Spanish is the option where you are based on raw numbers. That's just a question of practicality, not bias.

I very much doubt it's a true story (or at least an accurately told one). If it is true, he HR person was simply wrong so either way the story is irrelevant (or even intentionally misleading).

 

I agree 100% , I think I will send a letter to President Trump asking him his opinion on this . He is the only President I remember with common sense and listens to his voters .

 

They told me that "It's against the law" - I didn't ask whose law.

 

If you can get by without speaking the local language then why should you or I care? If English is required to do a job, hire someone who speaks English. If Spanish or Lithuanian is needed, hire that fluent person, its really quite simple. As for the melting pot concept, first generation immigrants did retain original languages in the home and in certain barrios throughout our history. The idea that a Chinese railroad worker would not be hired because he did not speak English is absurd. Did anyone in Chicago not hire Polish immigrants because they did not speak English? I came here as a kid speaking only Spanish. I quickly learned English as a defensive mechanism not because I had some inner goal to assimilate. I simply did it to survive. The biggest mistake in my early life was to abandon Spanish due to shame, bigotry and racism directed at me and my mother. I regret it to this day since my Spanish now is rudimentary and I could have been fully bilingual if I was brave enough to withstand the torment of living in Florida in 1961. We all should learn another language, period.

 

Now THAT was hilarious!!!

 

You call yourself "HonestJoe" - and accuse me of lying? Forum rules prevent me from expressing my opinion of you.
I could ask why you reached that conclusion, but frankly, I could care less.

 

This is America speak what ever you want or dont speak at all for all I care. If adding "press 2 for Spanish" helps your company make money or your city provide for their voters then go for it.

 

Well, take heed. We were well on our way to "Press 2 for English."

 

People that cant speak english in the US should have to push 6374529375464534231

 

I just thought of a funny story to add to this...
Manhattan in a tall building.
I was a smoker back then, and had to go outside to smoke.
There were two Ukrainians who liked to smoke, and I'd frequently see them in the elevator as we all went out to smoke, and we'd become friends.
One day the two were talking to each other in Ukrainian, and I said "Hey! This is America, dammit! Speak Spanish like everybody else!".
I don't think they got my satire, but everyone I tell that story to gets it.

 

I actually misread the intro line and thought you were repeating someone else's story (which you hoped was true). Obviously a first hand report is more reliable, which just returns us to the fact that the HR person was wrong.

 

"To err is human, to forgive, divine".

 

You could have said to him "no comprende mi amigo" or "zen zen wakarimasen" and that would have ended the class on a prematurely high note.

I would have asked him to explain the thinking behind the idea that not understanding what somebody is saying amounts to bigotry. If that is bigotry, then what does he call "a failure to communicate".

 

What was hilarious . ?

 

The reality is the older you get, the harder it is to learn a new language.

In my line of work, I see a lot of Latinos make the effort to speak English with me, but it takes so much time and creates such awkward communications, that I just begin speaking in Spanish to them, and everything flows much better from there.

And also keep in mind, that it is not just Latinos, but every culture has the same issues.

 

It's not culture, but rather biology. Once you hit puberty, there's a hypothetical black box in your brain called a language acquisition device that switches off.

 

Like all good questions...yes and no.

First, you're right. Not learning English is a big brake on success in most any area. For kids I'd like to see a year or 2 of intense English immersion before mainstreaming them. This might delay graduation but would, I think, give the kids a much needed boost toward successful education. Something similar for adults but it would, of course, be voluntary and, possibly last several years.

But...

Some 15% or so of the population speak Spanish as their first tongue. If I'm a business guy I want that business and will take action to get it. If that means adding a Spanish option to my call system, I'm good with that.

Additionally...

Even for those who speak English, they may feel more comfortable in Spanish. I speak Spanish well enough to get around in Mexico as long as the conversation doesn't get too fast. Would I want to, say, order a $500 TV on the phone in Spanish? No, not at all.

Your concern is legitimate but as long as there are immigrants there will be people more comfortable speaking their native tongue and as long as there is money to be made from these people business guys will be there to meet their needs.