Quran Vs Bible

When did I say anything about Jesus? There was enough food to eat during this time -- otherwise slavery would not have saved anyone -- it was just horded by people and used as a method of control.

 

So, you are the one bringing the jews into this, not I.
For nothing in the verse of the chapter says this only refers to the jews.
Only Paul tried to make some distinction, in contradiction to Jesus.

- - - Updated - - -

Where has Jesus said that?

 

Of course there was food available because Joseph had BOUGHT it all up, (spent his money), while these others, THEY invested in their ownership of farms and other things.


You think that he ought have done this so he could give it all away for zero, because he was crazy person...?

Gen 47:14 And Joseph gathered up all the money that was found in the land of Egypt, and in the land of Canaan, for the corn which they bought: and Joseph brought the money into Pharaoh's house.

 

He could have . . . you know . . . allowed them to voluntarily work for a voluntary amount of payment (whether in coinage or food). He could have traded his property for their labor rather than owning his laborers as his personal property.

But if you are going to wrongfully insist that the only options were charity or slavery, then yes, charity would have been a morally superior response. Or have you forgotten that, in addition to Jesus being "the Truth", God is also agape?

Agape (/ˈæɡəpiː/[1] or /ˈæɡəpɪ/;[2] Classical Greek: ἀγάπη, agápē; Modern Greek: αγάπη IPA: [aˈɣapi]), which means "love: esp. brotherly love, charity; the love of God for man and of man for God."

 

?
You mean he could have had them pit their terms into writing, which were as they had offered to exchange for food unless Joseph decided to let them starve to death with their families???

Here was what these people wanted:

19 Wherefore shall we die before thine eyes, both we and our land? buy us and our land for bread, and we and our land will be servants unto Pharaoh: and give us seed, that we may live, and not die, that the land be not desolate.

20 And Joseph bought all the land of Egypt for Pharaoh; for the Egyptians sold every man his field, because the famine prevailed over them: so the land became Pharaoh's.

 

He could have done the moral thing and offered to trade goods for services. Owning them as property was totally unnecessary and, if you remember the rest of the story, ends up being a bad deal for everyone involved.

And, again, if the only options were charity or slavery, charity would have been the more moral option, especially if God is charity. You place a lot of credence in "Jesus is truth" and "God is reality", so I wonder why you do not except the equally plain claim in the Bible that God is charity.

 

I don't know why you people, in a discussion of the difference between the "Quran Vs Bible" are going on endlessly about slavery in the bible. In the world we all live in, in the present, it is only Islam that is used to justify slavery TODAY, while Christianity has been at the forefront for the last 300 years, of eliminating the practice.

In the 90s in Egypt, Professor Nasr Abu Zayd was branded an Apostate and divorced by the courts from his wife against their wishes for daring to question the permissibility of owning slave girls.

 

I thought we were talking about Quran vs Bible? Did that change? Did slavery suddenly disappear from from the Bible?

And, has been pointed out several times, you are wrong. Christians are practicing slavery today in Uganda and the CAR.

Right. And in 2015, Christians are capturing slaves in Uganda and CAR. But let me guess. Now you want to steer away from what's actually happening and go back to what is justified in the respective books. Which is what you just chastised us for discussing.

 

Yes, they are going on endlessly about only slavery in the bible

No, weve seen the same few verses from the bible quoted again and again and again here, without a single verse on slavery quoted from the Quran or hadiths. Muhammad owned slaves. Jesus never did.

Lets see even one example of them using Christianity to justify slavery. And while the Lords resistance Army certainly isn't seen as an authority on Christianity, the highest religious courts in Egypt are seen as the pinnacle of expertise in Islam.

 

Because no one is debating the fact that the Quran can be used to justify slavery. We all agree about that. That just leaves the "vs Bible" part.

That's because no one is challenging the fact that the Quran can be used to justify slavery. And because people have consistently and falsely dismissed the verses from the Bible as only "recognizing" slavery. Once people are able to treat the Bible with the same criticism that they treat the Quran, we can finally put this behind us.

You are shifting goal posts again. Now it isn't about what the Bible or the Quran says, but about who is "seen as an authority" or each religion. This is supposed to be about the Quran vs the Bible. When people talk about what the Bible says, you try to shift the subject to the actions of modern Christians and Muslims. When people talk about the actions of modern Christians and Muslims, you try changing it back to what the books say. I only bring up modern Christians because, in trying to make this about modern Christianity vs modern Islam instead of the Quran vs the Bible, you continually ignore the atrocities of modern Christians. The LRA has stated several times that their mission is to uphold the 10 Commandments -- something which, although you disagree with, a healthy chunk of Christianity still think of as an example of those laws that should still apply.

 

??? It refers to the "law". Like Jesus said, he hasn't come to make the law disappear. It is still followed by the Jews while the Christians enjoy shellfish and wear blended fabrics without any need to be concerned about those laws. For "only in Christ are they taken away". If there was any doubt, the Council of Jerusalem in 50 AD settled the matter for those who cant seem to understand the plain meaning of-

Ephesians 2
15 by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations.

Hebrews 8
13 By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

Romans 10
4 Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.(*)

Romans 7
6But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

2 Corinthians 3
13We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to keep the Israelites from gazing at it while the radiance was fading away. 14But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away.

Galatians 3 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."

23Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. 24So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. 25Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law

 

No the goal is the same no matter how hard you try to change it. "Christianity" is the doctrine of the bible. ISIS, the religious courts of Egypt USE the doctrine of the quran to justify slavery. The highest authority as to the meaning of the words of the Koran. In contrast to the LRA who doesn't use Christianity, the doctrine of the bible to justify slavery.

 

Revealing, that other than my comments in 77 pages of comment, yours here is the first post to state that fact.

 

I’m not the one changing it. You are the one switching back and forth between the Bible/Quran and modern Christians/Muslims when it suits your argument.

First of all, you are assuming sola scriptura, which most Christians reject. Most Christians (ie Catholics) accept religious authority outside of the Bible, and most liberal Christian thinkers acknowledge the faults of the Bible and favor inner experiences with their God. Second of all, if that were really true, then why do you ONLY want to focus on modern Christians and ignore most of Christian history, including the sola scriptura Protestant founders who supported the scriptural basis for slavery.

Third, don’t you find it the least bit odd that Catholics began opposing slavery before the Protestant reformation even existed? I thought you were crediting the Protestants with all of this. It is quite telling that Catholics and Quakers, two groups who look OUTSIDE the Bible for inspiration, were the ones who pioneered abolitionism among Christians.

And the majority of Muslims seem to disagree.

The LRA sees Biblical law as their guiding light. They execute homosexuals and witches in the name of the Bible. What makes you think that slavery – which, despite your desperate attempts to rewrite it, explicitly condones slavery in both testaments – is any exception?

I remind you again: this is supposed to be about the Bible and the Quran. The Bible explicitly states that God invented the institution of slavery (apart from the Mosaic law), endorses the view that slaves are the rightful property of their masters, commands slaves to obey their masters as they would obey Christ and states (in your favorite series of verses to ignore) that all authority comes from God. Hiding behind modern religious conventions doesn’t help those facts.

I’ve repeatedly acknowledged that the Quran advocates terrible things. The fact that you have somehow missed that is the only thing “revealing”. If I thought there was anyone around who would have disagreed with the fact that the Quran can be used to advocate slavery, I would have discussed it. It is no use discussing what everyone is going to agree on. The problem is that the Bible advocates slavery just as clearly, and people are pretending that imperative commands are little more than “recognition”. Complaining about the fact that I didn't bring it up before you is no more reasonable them me complaining about the fact that you didn't bring up Biblical slavery before me. Hell, over 70 pages in and I still can't get you to acknowledge the existence of the 13th chapter of Romans. Which, by the way, says that extremist Muslim governments have been established by God. If you are going to blame an Egyptian court for their rule on slavery, you had better be ready to deal with the fact that the Bible calls these people God's servants.

 

Obvious I'm not wrong because I'm mealy copying and pasting straight from the sourse. With this in mind by calling me wrong you're also calling the bible wrong.

I will take my time dissecting it efficiency.



Let's look at its objectively. A group fanatics who is known throughout history for being violent and oppressive. They killed for fun, they killed people for following a diffrent god. and you could get tortured and then killed for making discoveries that contradicts churches doctrine. This group with such a history tries to tell you that that their religion teaches piece while ignoring the facts (wich I will get into later) To add to this mess, we have people like you with not enough of knowledge who choose to fallow a mere apostles over your own god.

In religious text, God is the most credible sourse. But here we have people who are not just ignoring him but activly going against hist teachings. Not only that they preach their False beliefs. I'm an atheis so it don't apply to me because I can't serve something that's not there. But you christians. If you would actually fallow your own doctrine then perhaps you would have long killed each other off.

All the wile I'm sold this fake idea of a merciful,loving and caring God while I'm reading about him suggesting to killing children because they argued with their parents. Jesus says that the punishment for adultary is eternal torment in hell and that if you look at a gouging your own eyes out for feeling lust. I'm not it. And if you were in the situation then NOTHING ADDS UP.

Iooks like all Christians are the same. They see what they want and they ignore what they want

Anyhow we have this group wich has been synonymous with rape, torture, and murder. All in the name of their god try to tell me that they're piecefull... I say on what planet?and by who's definition?

Christians are depraved people and with a zeal that could only be described as religious, They hunted down killed humdreds of thousands of people if not millions since it's conception.Don't work though. Just for you I'll dedicate some of my times to educate you about your own religion


Their inability to take responsibility for what their belief cost is sickening. Brushing it off while saying somethings about their religion teaching piece not hate after saying something vague and untrue about not being bound to the old testament law. When people point out contradictions that you have developed.

The "OLD" law as I've said many times before is nothing but the rule that without exception everyone who is not chosen by God will go to hell.Now the rule is reversed. Now the rule is that anyone who didn't chose god will go to hell without exception.

It doesn't mean anything else

This is proved when Jesus himself said

“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. (NIV, Matthew 5:17–1"

Everything has not been accomplished yet.Unless it the tribulations already.


But wait there's more!

"It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." (Luke 16:17 NAB)


"All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness..." (2 Timothy 3:16 NAB)

////////////////////////////////////////
This one below, It's ment for everyone who still try to say they don't have to follow the old law after this.
/////////////////////////////////////////

"Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God." (2 Peter 20-21 NAB)
----------------------------------------------------------------

“You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder,a e and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ 22 But I tell you that anyone who is angryf with a brother or sisterb,c will be subject to judgment.g Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’d is answerable to the court.h And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell"

Here you see Jesus criticizes the Jews for not killing their disobedient children according to Old Testament law. Mark.7:9-13 "Whoever curses father or mother shall die" (Mark 7:10 NAB)

Wait a minute. Maybe he was in a bad mood when he said this and shouldn't be taken to heart

Jesus is criticized by the Pharisees for not washing his hands before eating. He defends himself by attacking them for not killing disobedient children according to the commandment: “He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.” (Matthew 15:4-7)



Yeh, what a nice guy jesus is. We should all fallow his example. You know, If I'm ever in that situation like that I would ask myself "what would jesus do?".

Kill a child for talking back to his parents apparently.

Jesus has a punishment even worse than his father concerning adultery: God said the act of adultery was punishable by death. Jesus says looking with lust is the same thing and you should gouge your eyes out, better apart,then the whole. The punishment under jesus is eternity in hell (Matthew 5:27)

This is starting to sound too much like Muhammad. O-o

"Did not Moses give you the law"(John 7:19) and "For the law was given by moses... (John 1:17)"....the scripture cannot be broken"-Jesus, John 10:35


Law Contradictions of the Bible:

Shall we obey the law? Romans 13:1-7 says quite clearly that Christians are to submit to the law and regard it as the institution of God. 1 Peter 2:13-14 “Submit your self to every ordinance of man ... to the king, as supreme; Or unto governors.” Matthew 22:21 “Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar’s.” Also see Titus 3:1. Matthew 23:2-3 & Ecclesiastes 8:2 This leads one to assume that Christians must and should obey the law, yet look at these verses which contradicts what I just sited. Acts 5:29 “We ought to obey God rather then men.” Exodus 1:17-20 shows God punishing the midwives for following their rulers instead of God. Also see Daniel 3:16-18, 6:7-10, Acts 4:26 & 27, Mark 12:38-40, Luke 23:11, 24 & 33-35 which all say the law should be ignored. Now we know why Christians get away with their selective morality so often.


Should we steal? (Exodus 20:15 & Leviticus 19:13) Stealing is absolutely forbidden. Yet, Exodus 3:21-22, 12:35-36 & Luke 19:29-34 all promote stealing.
12) Should we judge? Jesus is quoted in Matthew 7:1-2: “Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged.” Also see Luke 6:37 & 1 Corinthians 5:12. Now take a look at “Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment” (John 7:24). Also note 1 Corinthians 5:12 & 6:2-4.
1 3) Should we covet? Exodus 20:17 says, “Thou shalt not covet . . . anything that is thy neighbor’s,” while 1 Corinthians 12:31 says, “Covet earnestly the best gifts.” So, are we or are we not to covet?
14) Is lying okay? Exodus 20:16. Proverbs 12:22 & Revelations 21:8 all say lying is forbidden. Joshua 2:4-6, Exodus 1:18-20 & 1 Kings 22:21-22 all support lying.
15) Can we kill? Exodus 20:13 says “thou shalt not kill”. Exodus 32:27, Numbers 31, and THOUSANDS of other verses show God commanding us to kill.
16) Can we own slaves? Leviticus 25:45 “Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy … and they shall be your possession… they shall be your bondmen forever.” Genesis 9:25 “And he [Noah] said, Cursed be Canaan; a servant of servants shall he be unto his brethren.” Exodus 21:2 & 7 “If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing… And if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the menservants do.” Joel 3:8 “And I will sell your sons and your daughters into the hand of the children of Judah, and they shall sell them to the Sabeans, to a people far off: for the Lord hath spoken it.” Luke 12:47-48 [Jesus speaking] “And that servant, which knew his lord’s will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes.” Colossians 3:22
“Servants, obey in all things your masters.” So obviously the Biblical God thinks slavery is right, right? Just look at these: Isaiah 58:6 “Undo the heavy burdens... let the oppressed go free, ... break every yoke.” Matthew 23:10 “Neither be ye called Masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.” (Also see Exodus 22:21 & 21:16) Let it be known here that pro-slavery Bible verses were cited by many churches in the South during the Civil War, and were used by some theologians in the Dutch Reformed Church to justify apartheid in South Africa. There are more pro-slavery verses than cited here. I simply do not have the room to post all of them.
17) What about Improvidence? Improvidence is enjoined in Luke 12:3 “Sell that ye have and give alms.” also in Luke 6:30 & 35 “Give to every man that asketh of thee, and of him that taketh away thy goods, ask them not again ... And lend, hoping for nothing again, and your reward shall be great.” Also note Matthew 6:28, 31 & 34. Improvidence is condemned in I Timothy 5:8 “But if any provide not for his own, and especially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel. “ Also see Proverbs 13:22.
1 What does the law say about anger? Ephesians 4:26 says “Be ye angry and sin not not.” Anger is disapproved in E

Ecciesiastes 7:9 “Be not hasty in thy spirit to be angry; for anger resteth in the bosom of fools.” Proverbs 22:24 “Make no friendship with an angry man.” Also see James 1:20.
19) Are we to let our good works be seen? Matthew 5:16 “Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works.” This contradicts verse Matthew 6:1 , “Take heed that you do not your alms before men, to be seen of them.”
20) Should we pray in public? 1 Kings 2:22, 54 & 9:3 shows the Lord is joyed by public prayer and listens intently. Matthew 6:5-6 condemn public prayer and command people keep it a secret.
21) Can we wear long hair? Judges 13:5 & Numbers 6:5 encourages people to grow their hair and insists it is a source of strength. 1 Corinthians 11:14 calls long hair a “shame”.
22) Should we circumcise males? Genesis 17:10 “This is my covenant which ye shall keep between me and you and thy seed after thee: Every man and child among you shall be circumcised. Clearly this demands circumcision, yet Galatians 5:2 says “Behold, I Paul, say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.”
23) Are there certain kinds of foods we should not eat? Deuteronomy 14:2-8 lists several animals that we are NOT to eat because they are “unclean”, “chew the cud” and “divide the hoof”. Yet Genesis 9:3 & 1 Corinthians 10:25 insists there is nothing we can’t eat. Romans 14:14 says: “There is nothing unclean of itself.”
24) Can we take oaths? Numbers 30:2, Genesis 21:23-24, 31, 31:53 & Hebrews 6:13 says that we can take oaths and encourages it. Matthew 5:34 says “swear (make an oath) not at all.”
25) Can we get married? Genesis 2:18, 1:28, Matthew 19:5 & Hebrews 13:4 all insist marriage is honorable. Marriage is disapproved and scorned in 1 Corinthians 7:1 & 7:7-8.
26) Can we commit adultery? Exodus 20: 14 “thou shalt not commit adultery.” Also see Hebrews 13:4. Now look at Numbers 31:18, Hosea 1:2 & 2:1-3 where adultery is advocated by God.
27) Can we drink alcohol? Proverbs 31:6-7, 1 Timothy 5:23 & Psalms 104:15 all encourage drinking and intoxication. Proverbs 20:1 & 23:31-32 discourage drinking and intoxication.
2 Do women have rights? Genesis 3:16 “And thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.” 1 Timothy 2:12 says a woman must not teach, remain silent and must be subjugated to her man. 1 Corinthians 14:34 & 1 Peter 3:6 both say that women have limited rights and are under control of their men. Judges 4:4, 14-15, 5:7, Acts 2:18 & 21:9 all tell of powerful women who were not subjugated by men and were not punished for their authority of men.
29) Should we obey our masters with usurped authority? Colossians 3:22-23 & 1 Peter 2:18 says we should. 1 Corinthians 7:23 “Be not ye the servants of men.” Also see Matthew 4:10 & 23:10 which say we should not submit usurped to our masters.
30) Was the law of the Old Testament destroyed by Christ’s crucification? Luke16:16, Ephesians 2:15 & Romans 7:6 says that the old law is no longer binding. Yet Matthew 5:17-19 and MANY other verses say that the old law is forever binding. If you want to see the many verses that command we follow the old law please consult the upper portion of this page.
31) Should we swear an oath? Numbers 30:2 “If a man vow a vow unto the Lord, or swear an oath…he shall do according to all that proceedeth out of his mouth.” Genesis 21:22-24 & 31 “…swear unto me here by God that thou wilt not deal falsely with me…And Abraham said, I will swear…Wherefore he called that place Beersheba [“Well of the oath”]; because there they sware both of them.” Hebrews 6:13-17 “For when God made promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater, he sware by himself…for men verily swear by the greater: and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife. Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability ofhis counsel, confirmed it by an oath.” See also Genesis 22:15- 19, Genesis 31 :53, & Judges I 1 :30-39. So apparently it is okay to swear an oath, we even do this on the Bible in American courts. Just try and forget these verses: Matthew 5:34-37 “But I say unto you, swear not at all; neither by heaven…nor by the earth…Neither shalt thou swear by thy head…But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil.”
James 5:12 “…swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea; and your nay, nay; lest ye fall into condemnation.”
32) Do we keep the Sabbath? Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy.” Exodus 31:15 “Whosoever doeth any work in the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.” Numbers 15:32-36 “And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the Sabbath day…And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses.” Each of these contradict Isaiah 1:13 “The new moons and Sabbaths, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity.“ John 5:16 “And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the Sabbath day. “Colossians 2:16 “Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holy-day, or of the new moon, or of the Sabbath days.”
33) Should we make graven images? Exodus 20:4 “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven…earth ... water.” Leviticus 26:1 “Ye shall make ye no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone.” Deuteronomy 27:15 “Cursed be the man that maketh any graven or molten image.” Okay, I got it I shouldn’t produce a thing in fear of making a graven image, but wait: Exodus 25:18 “And thou shalt make two cherubims of gold, of beaten work shalt thou make them.” I Kings 7:15-16 & 23-25 “For he [Solomon] cast two pillars of brass…and two chapiters of molten brass…And he made a molten sea…it stood upon twelve oxen ... [and so on]”

 

Rape In The Bible

Rape is one of the most heinous crimes imaginable. Yet few people know that the Bible often condones and even approves of rape. How anyone can get their moral guidance from a book that allows rape escapes me. Perhaps they have been lied to about the Bible and carefully detoured around all the nasty stuff in the Bible.

So grab your Bibles and follow along as I show you all the nasty rapes that your priests and preachers don't want to tell you about. Note that in many places in the Bible there are references to "taking a wife". Don't be fooled into thinking that these were voluntary marriages. This first quote clearly shows that murder and force were used to "take" these wives.

1) Murder, rape, and pillage at Jabesh-gilead (Judges 21:10-24 NLT)

So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan.

The Israelite assembly sent a peace delegation to the little remnant of Benjamin who were living at the rock of Rimmon. Then the men of Benjamin returned to their homes, and the four hundred women of Jabesh-gilead who were spared were given to them as wives. But there were not enough women for all of them. The people felt sorry for Benjamin because the LORD had left this gap in the tribes of Israel. So the Israelite leaders asked, "How can we find wives for the few who remain, since all the women of the tribe of Benjamin are dead? There must be heirs for the survivors so that an entire tribe of Israel will not be lost forever. But we cannot give them our own daughters in marriage because we have sworn with a solemn oath that anyone who does this will fall under God's curse."

Then they thought of the annual festival of the LORD held in Shiloh, between Lebonah and Bethel, along the east side of the road that goes from Bethel to Shechem. They told the men of Benjamin who still needed wives, "Go and hide in the vineyards. When the women of Shiloh come out for their dances, rush out from the vineyards, and each of you can take one of them home to be your wife! And when their fathers and brothers come to us in protest, we will tell them, 'Please be understanding. Let them have your daughters, for we didn't find enough wives for them when we destroyed Jabesh-gilead. And you are not guilty of breaking the vow since you did not give your daughters in marriage to them.'" So the men of Benjamin did as they were told. They kidnapped the women who took part in the celebration and carried them off to the land of their own inheritance. Then they rebuilt their towns and lived in them. So the assembly of Israel departed by tribes and families, and they returned to their own homes.

Obviously these women were repeatedly raped. These sick bastards killed and raped an entire town and then wanted more virgins, so they hid beside the road to kidnap and rape some more. How can anyone see this as anything but evil?

2) Murder, rape and pillage of the Midianites (Numbers 31:7-18 NLT)

They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men. All five of the Midianite kings – Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba – died in the battle. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. Then the Israelite army captured the Midianite women and children and seized their cattle and flocks and all their wealth as plunder. They burned all the towns and villages where the Midianites had lived. After they had gathered the plunder and captives, both people and animals, they brought them all to Moses and Eleazar the priest, and to the whole community of Israel, which was camped on the plains of Moab beside the Jordan River, across from Jericho.

Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the people went to meet them outside the camp. But Moses was furious with all the military commanders who had returned from the battle. "Why have you let all the women live?" he demanded. "These are the very ones who followed Balaam's advice and caused the people of Israel to rebel against the LORD at Mount Peor. They are the ones who caused the plague to strike the LORD's people. Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.

Clearly Moses and God approves of rape of virgins.

God Assists Rape and Plunder (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile.


I think that I made my point clear that Jesus isn't as good as you're selling him and that you're performing blasphemy by going directly aging gods techings.

 

That's True and untue. You say deathbed like he was actually lying there ready to die when he converted.
I watched a documentary about him few days ago. They straight up said that the Constentite chose Catholic because it had a similar heiarchy to Rome itself. Then a law was made making practicing other Christian denomination illigal and punishable by crucifixion.

 

I can only say 1 more time. You're wrong. And you're claim is you are not even a christian and you're trying to defend them and most of them are wrong.

 

Just a couple of questions pertaining to your post.
1: Do you believe all those things the 'Bible' says to be 'real and true'?
2: The video regarding Obama has been reported as a modified video and is not the truth: so who is telling the truth regarding that video?

 

It doesn't matter what I think. (Im not a believer) It Only matters what you think. Jesus himself outlined your practices.You choose to ignore this and only focus on the good things jesus did.So you choose to discard the words of Jesus and follow few of his understandings words instead to support your misconcluded idia. You chose to do this even though jesus went out of his way and set the record straight.

He told everyone that every word that god and jesus spoke was the truth

Alot of religious people like to ask me What if you're wrong?"

Well I'd like to ask you the same question. "What if you're wrong?"

Then you will be the epitome of all things jesus spoke against. You will be a liar in his eyes because you spread this nonsense.

In the dark ages you would of been a hectic and would be burned like the rest.


Suppose there are prophets among you, or those who have dreams about the future, and they promise you signs or miracles, and the predicted signs or miracles take place. If the prophets then say, 'Come, let us worship the gods of foreign nations,' do not listen to them. The LORD your God is testing you to see if you love him with all your heart and soul. Serve only the LORD your God and fear him alone. Obey his commands, listen to his voice, and cling to him. The false prophets or dreamers who try to lead you astray must be put to death, for they encourage rebellion against the LORD your God, who brought you out of slavery in the land of Egypt. Since they try to keep you from following the LORD your God, you must execute them to remove the evil from among you. (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NLT)

But any prophet who claims to give a message from another god or who falsely claims to speak for me must die.' You may wonder, 'How will we know whether the prophecy is from the LORD or not?' If the prophet predicts something in the LORD's name and it does not happen, the LORD did not give the message. That prophet has spoken on his own and need not be feared. (Deuteronomy 18:20-22 NLT)

You are.

 

That is a rather broad statement. Taking it at face value (literally), it would carry with it the fact that you do not believe in any of the alleged scientific 'facts', theories, findings, or even the laws of physics, chemistry, biology, etc.

Why would it only matter what I think? Don't your thoughts carry any weight when compared to my thoughts or the thoughts of others?

Would you please show me that in scripture? I would sure like to see where I have been personally mentioned in the 'Bible'... especially by the alleged words of 'Jesus'.

So now you advance yourself to the position of mind reader. You know my thoughts and therefore KNOW that I am ignoring things mentioned in the 'Bible'. Where is your PROOF of claim?

What words in the 'Bible' have been authenticated to be the "words of Jesus"? Jesus did not speak English, and I don't speak Greek or Hebrew. BTW: what is "misconcluded idia"?

I choose to do what?

OK... notice your own choice of words. "every word that God and Jesus spoke".... You made no mention of 'every word in writings made by man and alleged to be the word of God or Jesus'.

My wife used to consider the same question. Her response was along this line..."If I am wrong, then when I die, I will die happy, knowing that I did no harm to anyone."

See my comment above your question.

Really? Now you are sitting in judgment that is reserved to Jesus and the Saints? Wow! What specific "nonsense" are you talking about? Can you show PROOF that what you claim to be nonsense is actually nonsense?

The term you are attempting to use is "heretic".. Anyway, your comment is another false conclusion, because you have no means of proving what I would have done in the past nor how others would have reacted to whatever it was that I said or did? You are guessing and making blind speculations.

Perhaps we might deal with the present instead of attempting to put ourselves in an era that has long passed by. What you are suggesting is that I respond to a fairy tale that you have made up. "Suppose..."?

My goodness, you know how to quote scripture. How is that scripture relevant to me.

I am what?

 

No, you try to change the topic to slavery in the bible. Since both the Quran and Bible accept the existence of slavery, the only comparison left is that the doctrine of the quran is used today to justify slavery while the doctrine of the bible is not. The example of Muhammad in the Quran and Haddiths, who owned slaves, is used to justify slavery, while the example of Jesus in the bible, who never owned a slave, is not. The only reason, ISIS is the only governing authority sanctioning slavery is because all the mid east and African nations were pressured by Europe and the US to end the practice. Saudis didn't end government enforced slavery until 1964. Chad, Mauritania, Niger, Mali, and Sudan are the only other countries whose governing authorities allow it to occur as sanctioned by Islamic law. The law of slavery in the Western world was never seen as a part of Christian law. The enslavement of captured NON muslims is an Islamic tradition dating from Muhammad himself through to the present day. Islamic Sharia law defines who can be enslaved. Christianity doesn't dictate laws because the bible doesn't dictate laws to be enforced by the governing authorities. It only dictates the laws of salvation and reward in the afterlife, not this life on earth.

No, I assume a comparison of "Quran Vs Bible" is a comparison of the scriptures written in the quran and bible.

There is no scriptural basis for slavery in the bible. The scripture merely recognizes the then in existence of slavery with its "basis" in Roman Law of the time. IN CONTRAST to the scriptural "Basis" of slavery in the Koran. Muhammad rewrote and established Islamic law of slavery. Which included the prohibition of enslavement of freeborn Muslims and enshrined in Islamic law the enslavement of captured non Muslims. And that's why Christianity has been at the forefront of the elimination of slavery in the world while Islam cant even be critical of the institution. That's why the application of Islamic law by the courts in Egypt led to the ruling of apostasy by the professor who dared questioned the legitimacy of owning slave girls. That's why ISIS, Chad, Mauritania, Niger, Mali, and Sudan continue the practice. BECAUSE its "scriptural basis" is within Islamic law.

Not at all. There is no scriptural basis for slavery in Christianity and an abundance of scriptural basis for condemning the institution.

 

I'm done repeating thing over and over again

I'll give the break down

/////////////////////////////////////////////////
||
||
\/

Jesus says that he has not come to abolish any law but fulfill them. He goes on to say that no word or letter shall be removed until the end of days when Jesus has accomplished everything

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place." (Matthew 5:17 NAB)

He clearly outlines his view on weather or not the old law should be followed.

"Every word of God proves true; he is a shield to those who take refuge in him. Do not add to his words, lest he rebuke you and you be found a liar". (Proverbs 30:5,6)

Warns people against doing what you are doing now.

||
||
\ /

Then the bible goes on to say............

"But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation".(2 Peter 1:20-21)--Simon Peter, a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ,

Here Peter clearly states that no part of scripture is a matter of personal interpretation. Hence it should be taken at face value.

As for mind reading thing thing. As they say, "the proof is in the puding".


Jesus clearly states that old law should be followed and that some of these laws (murder,adultery) Should be harsher. He said this in the sermon on the mount

"heard that it was said to the people long ago, "You shall not murder,and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment", But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, "Raca'd", is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, "You fool!" will be in danger of the fire of hell."

We all know the judgment for murder

Adultery

“You have heard that it was said, "You shall not commit adultery".But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell."

Divorce

“It has been said, "Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce". But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, makes her the victim of adultery, and anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery."

Taking jesus's teachings at face value you get something like this

Be kind to your neighbors ---> pass harsher judgment on people who disobey certain laws.

People who disobey the laws are criminals and can't be considered neighbors.Hence they are subject to judgment and jesus's etching of "treat other like you want to be treated" doesnt apply

What people disobey the law and are subject to judgment?

Blasphemers, Gays, Pagans, Heretics, Murders ,Adulterers,Kids who talk back, etc

Guess the people during the dark ages followed jesus's teachings after all when they killed humdreds of thousands of people.

Also how does

"It doesn't matter what I think. (Im not a believer)"


=


"you do not believe in any of the alleged scientific 'facts', theories, findings, or even the laws of physics, chemistry, biology, etc."

Never mind. If anything, this exemplifies how you go for leaps and bounds to support your misconclusion.

As I said, I'm done repeating myself. If you have questions refer to my other posts. You will find that your questions have already been answered.......multiple times

I guess that some people are literally blind to the truth
◄

 

God is "Charity," if we mean Altruism.

God is telling us that we need to support one another, love each other.
"Reality" is telling us that we must become as the ants and the bees, to an extent.

The Bible tells us that Joseph sent these men away to the cities
Though they had offered up themselves to indenturement, he did not enslave them in this case.

21 And as for the people, he removed them to cities from one end of the borders of Egypt even to the other end thereof.

BUT, then he did an amazing thing which was to make them tax payers to Pharaoh, and give them seed after the famine so they coukd live again:

23 Then Joseph said unto the people, Behold, I have bought you this day and your land for Pharaoh: lo, here is seed for you, and ye shall sow the land.

24 And it shall come to pass in the increase, that ye shall give the fifth part unto Pharaoh, and four parts shall be your own, for seed of the field, and for your food, and for them of your households, and for food for your little ones.

25 And they said, Thou hast saved our lives: let us find grace in the sight of my lord, and we will be Pharaoh's servants.

 

Then you are declaring that you have positive and absolute knowledge that Jesus actually said those things? Would you please provide the PROOF? Do you have clear and positive proof that what the 'Bible' says is true? Do you have clear and positive proof that Paul was actually the person who said those things attributed to him? Do you have clear and positive proof that there was a Paul as mentioned in the 'Bible'?

"how does '"It doesn't matter what I think. (Im not a believer)"


=


"you do not believe in any of the alleged scientific 'facts', theories, findings, or even the laws of physics, chemistry, biology, etc." '

Rather plainly and simply. You stated that you are not a "believer" without demonstrating any restrictions as to how the term "believer" is to be applied. You set the stage. I guess some people do not realize the impact that their chosen words can have.