Is anti trans all Christianity?

It is obvious that you have no idea.

You keep claiming that there is not a debate as to whether or not they are a woman, and that is PRECISELY the debate. Obviously, I know your side better than you do.

Your side claims that womanhood is about gender, not sex. They say that therefore a biological male can be a woman.

How can you possibly be this passionate about this issue and you do not know this?

YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

Gender fluidity: What it means and why support matters - Harvard Health

"Some people describe themselves as “gender-fluid.” As an identity, it typically fits under the transgender and nonbinary umbrella, which applies to people whose gender identity doesn’t match the sex assigned to them on their original birth certificate. (Nonbinary means a person’s gender identity doesn’t fit into strict cultural categories of female or male.)"



There I go proving my position with a credible link again. Boy what a fool I am (sarcasm)

YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

 

My side? You’re putting me up against a gigantic strawman of stereotypes and preconceived notions about “my side” instead of talking to me. I am not a follower. I am not going to blindly defend one side and attack another. I have my own beliefs.

I never said I am passionate. I said I am moderate and I have zero problems with trans people. I don’t understand why people have an issue accepting them as they are. So I don’t think you should be surprised if I don’t understand SJW terms or I am not using them the way you think I should.

Logically and biologically there is no debate that trans aren’t biologically the opposite gender. They never will be. They cant surgically alter their chromosomes, dna, or biology. Any sane trans knows it. I talk to trans who know.

They only thing a trans can do is transition and be culturally and socially accepted as the opposite gender.

 

So now you want to argue whether or not you are passionate and whether you represent a side in this debate? I cannot think of a bigger waste of time.

Calling themselves women does not mean they changed their chomosomes or DNA etc, on that we agree. That was not your claim with which I disagreed. You claimed that there is not a debate as to whether or not they are a woman which is a different claim altogether. That claim is 100% wrong. They claim that gender can be changed and that it is distinctly different from biological sex and that a man can become a woman. That IS the debate, which is whether or not they can change their gender to being a woman. This debate is mostly about semantics, and whether they should be able to hijack and twist the word woman to meet their objectives.

If after I pointed out your incorrect nomenclature claiming that nobody is claiming they can change into a woman, you want to amend that to say that there is no debate as to whether they can change their chomosomes or DNA ( their sex), well at that point there is nothing to debate because of course they are not changing their chromosomes or gender.

The confusion here is on your part, not mine. I have been 100% correct on this all along. It looks like you are perhaps coming around to understanding that I am correct now that you are changing it to cannot change DNA.





** It would be nice if you were to reply to post 197 where I pointed out that you were mixing up my words with someone elses again and then drawing wrong conclusions based on your mix up....again. An apology certainly would be in order. I treated you with respect the entire time until you started getting terse and that terseness was likely because you confused someone else's words as being mine.

I will always give you whatever you give me. If you are respectful, I will be respectful. If you are an assh*le, I will be an assh*le in return. I am skilled at both.

 

What a waste of time? The difference between us that I don’t see transgenderism as a political debate or trans people as another political issue. I see them as people. They are people I have already accepted.

Biology isn’t a debate. They aren’t the opposite gender. They are trans. The issue is if you can accept them socially and culturally transitioning to the opposite gender/living as a man or woman.

I have no issue with that. To me it’s not about protecting the definition of woman or man. They are trans women and trans men. Yes, it’s reshaping cultural norms on gender, but biological men and women are going to remain who they are. Transgender women have vastly different life experiences than biological women, and always will. Greater visibility and acceptance of trans is not threatening and isn’t not going to upend everybody’s gender identity in western civilization.

 

Indeed biology isnt a debate, but when you said that nobody is claiming that males can be women, that was not about biology. That is about gender, which is a distinction pushed very hard by the pro-trans movement. You were 100% wrong in your assertion. A central premise of the pro-trans movement is that a biological male can be a woman and vice-versa. You claim that nobody is pushing that notion is 100% bereft of reality.

How you did not already know this is shocking to me.


Post 297? No response?

 

Not everybody agrees. There isn’t uniformity in the group, not even the trans community. You’re a very black and white thinker. You have already criticized me for not accurately representing my side. I can engage in this conversation as independent thinker.

Again, I talk to trans people, so unlike how you talk, I am not making assumptions that they all have kind of uniform trans agenda. I don’t know who the hell the “pro trans movement” is that you seem to speaking for, but I apparently am not part of that group nor am I obligated to buy into what they think or how you represent them.

A biological man can identify and live as a woman. Surgery hormones, etc. can help him achieve that. I can accept him becoming a her, and I will and do, but her life experience and identity is trans and separate from a biological female’s. They are only becoming female on a superficial, cultural and social level. It’s not problematic for me to understand, accepting it, and feel threatened or confused. Non binary people are more difficult for me to understand. I have never worked with one or have known one, but I am willing to be nice, respectful, and make them feel comfortable.

 

Perhaps not everybody agrees, but your statement was "There isn’t any debate about if it makes them a woman or not", and by this you meant that a biological male cannot be a woman and everyone knows this.

With that being your statement that is in question, even if you now say "not everyone agrees", that still does not make correct your claim that "There isnt ANY debate about if it makes them a woman".

Any way you slice this, and try as you may, you are 100%, incontrovertibly wrong. You have made that claim many times in this thread to several different people, and it is WRONG. You are wrong. There is most certainly debate as to whether or not a biological male can be a woman. That is a central point in their argument that a biological male can be a woman.

When you misrepresent the trans side of this issue and stating that they are not claiming that a biological male can be a woman, indeed you ARE engaging as an independent thinker. Unfortunately, you are an independent thinker that does not know what you are talking about, because you are wholly misrepresenting the long-held position of the LGBTQ movement.



Post 297? No reply?

 

Yeah, it would help if people understood gender is the social construct (roles and behavior) and sex is biological (organs, hormones, chromosomes, et al.).

 

Your comments make me laugh. No offense, seriously, I am not trying to be offensive, it’s just obvious that you are a very black and white thinker who speaks in absolutes and in all caps. I don’t think you see complexities and nuances. It’s all black or all white, it’s right or it’s wrong. I am not like that, so it’s hard to just converse with you.

 

You can laugh all you want.

You are still 100%, incontrovertibly incorrect. There is not any nuance involved.

I did not say "It doesn’t make them a woman. It makes them trans. There isn’t any debate about if it makes them a woman or not. "...YOU did.

When you say there isnt any debate, that means there is not ANY debate. Clearly, there is debate, as that is their central premise.

How could you POSSIBLY think there is any nuance involved here? Your statement did not leave room for nuance. It was a binary statement. That binary statement was either right or it was wrong. You didnt say there isnt much debate, or that not all of them think that, you said THERE IS NOT ANY. As it turns out, that statement was wrong. You are trying to claim nuance now just to save some face but this is not a situation that involved nuance.

I understand that you perhaps were trying to convey that it does not change their DNA when you have continually made this claim throughtout this thread, but if that were your position, then you clearly have been stating that point incorrectly. This is not nuance. This is right or wrong. There is no in between in this instance. Your statement left no room for in between.

Sorry. You are wrong. You have zero wiggle room here. I understand that it is hard to converse when you are wrong and the other person will not let you weasel out of that reality, but that is the situation you face. You are wrong, and I am far too savvy to let you try to cloud that undeniable reality.

 

That’s black and white/absolutist thinking. I am capable or respecting opposing views and discussing and exploring different views, but this “you’re wrong and I am right” stuff isn’t having a conversation.

 

You made a black-and-white statement that left no room for nuance whatsoever.

That black-and-white statement was 100%, incontrovertibly wrong. Most things in a political chat are in a gray area where nuance can be debated. This is one of those rare situations where that does not apply.

 

Because the discussion is about children. Caitlyn Jenner cut his wang off, and Republicans have no problem with that, he's a grown man.

Bills Restricting Care for Transgender Teens Skyrocket

Access link to here, to avoid paywall. https://www.realclearpolitics.com/

'Sixteen states have placed broad new restrictions on' genital destruction of 'minors this year, with 16 others having introduced similar bills, in a record-breaking year.'

'These bills, which have been introduced mostly in Republican-controlled states, limit one or both of the main forms of' genital destruction: medications that can delay the onset of puberty or hormones, and surgeries that' slice off perfectly healthy organs.

'This uptick in legislation on' genital destruction 'is part of a larger wave of laws: 19 laws were passed in 2022 and 2021 restricting' men from dominating women's sports.

 

Churches that adopt that style are generally fairly small. How many people were in attendance? If you'll notice, you are unlikely to return, whereas if you had heard a message on the personal growth of the Apostle Peter as he learned greater humility, you might be very interested in going back.

To rephrase the Topic Title: Is all Trans anti-reason?

‘PEOPLE WITH FEMALE SEX ORGANS:’ Major Feminine Product Maker’s Latest Attack On Girls And Women. “What is a woman? It looks like the feminine hygiene products maker Always doesn’t even want to use that word anymore, let alone answer that question.”

'the Daily Mail reported that one of the world’s top suppliers of menstrual and other sanitary products released its annual pamphlet used to help young girls learn about their changing bodies. Except this year, the pamphlet didn’t mention women or girls even once. Instead, they were labeled “people with female sex organs.”'

So rather than being "Men" and "Women" we are now 'People" with vaginas or peckers? And that's an advancement, we are reduced to our sex organs?

It's probably about trying to keep their ESG score.

 

Like did Trump do that "born again" thingy and go all anti-trans?

Trump repeatedly celebrated the inclusion of transgender ...

KESQ
https://kesq.com › news › 2023/06/16 › trump-repeate...

14 hours ago — Trump repeatedly celebrated the inclusion of transgender women in his beauty pageant. CNN / YouTube. By CNN Newsource.

Donald Trump Wants Caitlyn Jenner to Judge Miss USA ...

YouTube
https://www.youtube.com › watch



1:01
She would be the first transgender woman to serve as a judge at the high-profile beauty pageant. Jenner is also being asked to judge the ...
YouTube · Inside Edition · Jun 5, 2015

Trump repeatedly celebrated the inclusion of transgender ...

Yahoo
https://www.yahoo.com › entertainment › trump-repea...

16 hours ago — Trump repeatedly celebrated the inclusion of transgender women in his beauty pageant. Andrew Kaczynski. Fri, June 16, 2023 at 3:55 PM CDT · ...

Trump let trans beauty queen compete in Miss Universe ...

Fox News
https://www.foxnews.com › politics › trump-let-trans-...

Apr 24, 2023 — Former President Donald Trump overturned a 2012 decision by his own Miss Universe organization to block transgender model Jenna Talackova ...

Hear Trump's past comments celebrating the inclusion of ...

Local3News.com
https://www.local3news.com › regional-national › hear-tr...

12 hours ago — Donald Trump's past comments reveal he repeatedly celebrated the inclusion of transgender women in his beauty pageant.

 

Transgenderism is not the issue, but the homophobes and religious dogmatists have tried to make it one, and over-reached again as they did with abortion.
The only real issues are that minors should not be allowed to undergo chemical or surgical alterations and trans men should not be allowed to compete in women's sports where their male physique would give them unfair advantage.
Everything else is bullshit, especially the hypocrisy about grooming, when the biggest predatory groomers in society are religious leaders, heterosexual perverts on social media and gun show enthusiasts.

 

i remember back in the 70s when groups like the ny dolls were wearing wild feminine clothing the RW had another hissy fit back then, i being a fan and wearing such clothing was always approached by at least a few woman per outing, women loved it..i suspect the latest RW ourage is just more slanted opinion piled on misinformation as is par for the RW course...i wouldnt doubt an issue like altered brain chemistry coming into play

 

There is no such thing as Libertarian who promotes authoritarian government or theocracy so they can call themselves whatever they want, but they aren't libertarians.

Only 0.6% of US population is trans so this hysterical panic about it is absurd, but stands as a good example how people can be brought to fear anything by heavy dose of political propaganda. Literals all populist talk show hosts talk about it non-stop and their listeners repeat after them, and that includes church pastors. This nation has never been as brainwashed as it is today. Fortunately it will end as quick as Hillarys server investigation which stopped exactly on the election day in 2016. Its almost as if someone pulled the plug out from the radio.

Says a person who self identifies as transsexual.

What does the Bible say? It says that we (Christians) are to NOT judge those outside the church (unbelievers), because they are for God to judge.

Treat them like any other unbeliever. Do you campaign against liars? Adulterers? Addicts? Tax cheats? Fornicators? Gluttons? Of course not, because they are not on the election cycle campaign platform.

Why are you so keen on pointing out sins in others, but not in yourself?

"First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye."

 

That's the key. Having the right to see themselves however they want and do their own thing is one thing. Forcing everyone else to play along, and stomping on their rights is quite another.

If you want to see yourself as a woman and act like one (whatever that means to you), that's more than fine with me. The moment you demand I see you as one that crosses the line.

 

Have you read about the all Muslim city council that banned the pride flag from all city property? Yes very tolerant community. Care to try again?

 

I am sorry but I don’t think I can break down the words more tolerant than Christians any further for you. If you are struggling with four simple words that is beyond my ability or desire to educate you.