Is anti trans all Christianity?

Christian areas also tend to be democratic areas. Which is why the most tolerant places for trans are Christian.

Most of the critic of trans people crime from their asking for special privileges, not being trans.

 

To call something a delusion, it must be clearly factually incorrect and the person believes it despite the evidence. There is no confusion on the facts in gender dysphoria. It’s more about what they want than what they believe. Like imagine somebody wanted to be a dolphin. They realize there’s really nothing we can do to help them with that, but they spend most of their time surfing and scuba diving to live more like a dolphin and relieve the disappointment of never being a dolphin. They have an unfortunate desire, but are not delusional. Yes I have known somebody who would rather have been a dolphin than a person but not with the gender dysphoria level of distress.

“Supposed to be” is a straw man. Believing in fate isn’t a part of gender dysphoria.

They want to be the other gender, and feel better when they take steps to get as close to that as is possible. They are not confused about the facts, they have desires that give them distress.

Someday it will probably be possible to give future trans people what they want. Once we can do brain transplants, then they really will be able to fully become the other gender. Until then, they make do with the limitations of current technology and we leave it between them and their doctors.

 

The change in how transgender people are viewed by the medical community.
https://www.degruyter.com/document/doi/10.1515/nf-2020-0007/html
https://academic.oup.com/jsm/article-abstract/18/6/1122/6956015?login=false
https://read.dukeupress.edu/tsq/article-abstract/9/2/172/312496/Trans-as-Brain-IntersexThe-Trans-Intersex-Nexus-in
https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-030-38909-3_4

 

Where is the evidence this is happening? Do you know where this rumour started? It was with a vile person labelling herself “Libs of TikTok” with help from the Testicle tanner himself Tucker Carlson

https://www.rollingstone.com/cultur...btq-community-cult-tucker-carlson-1234653029/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/09/02/lgbtq-threats-hospitals-libs-of-tiktok/

Do you honestly think that threats to children’s hospitals are OK

 

When I searched the question of why do trnasgenders want to change theiur body, the first thing to pop up is "Gender identity appears to be inherent, based on the experiences of trans people and the research on this very topic. Many trans people have felt since birth, or at least a very young age, that they were born in the wrong body — and for some, but not all, medical procedures are needed to help alleviate those feelings."
Link... Why many transgender people feel they have to change their bodies - Vox

This is precisely what I said is their reason. You now say that this link is incorrect and in reality it is not based on a belief that they are in fact the opposite sex or in your example a dolphin.

Do you have a link to support your claim? I sort of get the impression that some of you change answers with whatever suits you at that moment.

"Supposed to be" is NOT a strawman. It is another way of communicating precisely what my link says which is that they believe were born in the wrong body. Saying they feel they were supposed to be the opposite sex is the same concept.

 

So is this used as a diagnostic criteria? Are there people being excluded because they do not show these changes on MRI and Pet Scan?

If not, then it is difficult to report that as some great advance that points to this being a reality. At that point it would be hard to label that is anything other than a not as of yet accepted theory.

I read your first link, and the following is its conclusion...
"Conclusions
This review sought to provide a brief overview on the current knowledge in neuroimaging studies in transgender persons. Much progress has been made over the past 25 years trying to detect the neurobiological underpinnings of gender dysphoria and identifying the existence of a brain gender. Nonetheless, many findings remain inconsistent. As such, increased collaboration strategies are essential for further research validation."


I guess I am not sure what you are even claiming this to prove? It doesnt appear to me to prove or even suggest much of anything other than they have not been successful in proving anything via neuroimaging.

 

Plus often there is a discovery of issues like a failure or abnormality with the SRY gene


Or CAIS or any of the myriad causes of Disorders of Sexual Development
This is a good read
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/voices/stop-using-phony-science-to-justify-transphobia/

 

The research on neuro imaging is still in its infancy but..

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.3109/09540261.2015.1113163

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/voices/stop-using-phony-science-to-justify-transphobia/

 

The neuro imaging is still in its infancy with only limited studies done but this is pointing to definitive differences in brain development

 

Im sorry that does nothing to substantivley impact this discussion. You have already shown a link that speaks to the totality of all this testing and the best they could muster is that results have been inconsistent. With inconsistency, one can obviously find whatever result they desire, but deep down you too know that proves absolutely nothing.

There have always been a scant few with chromosomal differences and pointing to that also changes nothing. If you want to point to the tiny subset with chromosomal differences as scientifically valid I could go along with that. This specific issue is not what is being debated. That would be a prime example of there not being evidence to the contrary thus it would not be legitimately a delusion even in the minds of people that call most transgenders delusional. You can say the same thing for hermaphrodites.

 

“scant few”? Intersex/ DSD represent 1.7 - 2% of the population

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans...und,not legally protected from discrimination.

And since we are discovering more and more causes for DSD I would not be at all surprised to find that genetic/ hormonal variance is root cause of transgenderism. Certainly there is some evidence suggesting that a rise in Endocrine Disrupting Chemicals may play a role. In other words there is very little evidence that it is a disorder that a person can be “groomed “ into

 

First, what is anti trans? not accepting it? In the same vain of not caring what people do why should I care what people accept? I am gay, I am in a same sex relationship. i am legally married. what do I care some bible thumper doesn't approve? Why should caring about what people accept, believe, or approve of be a one way street?

There are certain issues regarding trans identities that are a problem. First, males participating in female sports. this basically undoes title IX. we disqualify men from competing with other men if they are taking anabolic steroids, such a person has less advantage than a male has over a female. There is also an issue of men in the women's locker room. I also take issue with spreading this to children. other than instances where we are interfering with others I don't really care. I think this is a pretty common viewpoint.

 

Get real. This is happening.Snd children's hospitals are making scandalous amounts of money of it. You may be down with that bull **** but the only thing Carlson did was quote what the hospital itself said. And the only thing Libs of TikTok did was quote libs bothe then asked obvious questions. So yes indeed it is happening and your willingness to ignore reality on this subject doesn't look good on you.

 

As I said have you got proof? What actually happened was they rang the hospital switchboard who is usually NOT a medically trained person who may or may not have understood the question fully due to fielding multiple tasks and took that as “gospel”.

Other than the vile Tucker and co - where is your evidence for any of your claims? I have searched and I cannot find any actual evidence that this is being “pushed” on children. There is evidence however that up until about 10-15 years ago children born with ambiguous genitalia were being arbitrarily assigned a sex and surgically altered to “fit” that sex. The Intersex/DSD community, which BTW is approx 3 times as numerous as true gender dysphoria lobbied to have the procedures delayed until puberty so the kids could decide for themselves

 

But why not deal with the issue the same way differing abilities are dealt with within the para sports. Basically a handicap system.

Someone who is male transitioning to female is less of a threat than some idiot who thinks he can grab women’s genitals anytime he wants to because “when you are a star they let you do it”

 

Okay, so it seems that you are totally against transing the kids? Given that you only mention "adults" being free to do what they what.

 

Didn’t you admit in a previous statement that transsexualism according to the DSM isn’t defined as a delusional disorder, but that you think it may have been changed for political correctness? Transgenderism is not defined as a delusion in the DSM and according to the criteria of what is delusional disorder, it’s not as delusional disorder. The way that you’re personally defining gender to dysphoria, and the way you’re presenting what transsexuals think is erroneous. Transsexuals don’t need to be presented with evidence of the contrary that they’re not the gender they identify as because they know they actually are not the opposite gender. They know what men and women are. They can tell the difference between men and women, and they know what gender they’re born as. They’re not having delusions they’re the opposite gender, but they identify as the opposite gender. Identifying with a group of people is not a delusion, and it doesn’t matter how much you wish it was. It would be delusional for a teenage boy to honestly believe he was a woman with a uterus and was about to start his period, and saying I am having period cramps. Male to female transsexuals aren’t acting like they’re having delusions. They’re not showing up to CVS buying pregnancy tests, seeing gynecologist because they think they have ovarian cysts. They know they’re not actually women, but they know what it means in society to look like a woman and be treated like a woman. That is not the sign of a delusional insane person. It’s evidence that they’re not delusional and they are conducting themselves in a sane and rational way about how they want the world to see them and interact with them. Once transitioning, they know they are trans.


Gender is part of culture and transsexualism plays a role in world cultures and the ways trans think and are seen. Transsexualism occurs for different reasons in different cultures. There’s books written about little girls in Afghanistan, who disguise themselves as boys and live as boys because within the culture of Afghanistan, it offers them benefits. There are trans groups in India and parts of Asia that have been there for thousands of years, and how they’re seen and treated is dependent upon the local cultures. Our gender norms are cultural based and western trans people, are sane enough to comprehend our gender norms. They’re not changing their biology nor are they deluded about it. They’re challenging and changing the gender defined traditions and norms they’re allowed and expected to function in.

 

what is so "surprising" about us placing the needs of marginalized people above the prejudices of a questionable majority?

if you would rather think of "black studies" and similar courses as useless there us not much i can do for you. i consider such studies to be subsets of "history" which have not been examined closely enough in the mainstream.

no one complains about the study of "divinity." is study of a being about which nothing can be proven a useful pursuit?

 

It’s not just Christian’s, I’m not religious at all and I am very opposed to it. It’s also about science and not teaching kids to accept a lie. It’s also about trying not to allow men in our daughters bathrooms and locker rooms, it also about making sure kids don’t make life altering decisions that are not reversible. It’s not about adult choices, we couldn’t give a crap if you want to be a moron of age. It’s about protecting the adolescent youth and the name of science.

 

I said nothing about either black studies or divinity. So that is a profoundly ignoble argument

 

Inconsistent and definitive dont typically belong together on the same subject.

 

I seem to recall seeing that transgender is something along the lines of a few per 100,000. This means that your 1.7 -2% number (wherever that comes from), cannot possibly be the number of people that have that issue AND are seeking to transition. Obviously the vast majority of the people that you are saying have a chromosomal anamoly have no desire whatsoever to change their gender, so you are really pointing to what amounts to an irrelevant subset of people. What counts are those that want to transition. In fact, it also represents a small portion of those that do seek to transition. Yes, "scant few" is a proper term.

 

Yeesh...

When people argue that it is a delusion, the false belief that they are pointing to is that they believe they are a woman born into a mans body despite all evidence to the contrary, much like the amputate limbs people believe their limbs are not a psrt of them. Their false belief is that their inside does not match their outside. When arguing against the notion of it being a delusion, YOU are changing the subject and arguing against the notion that they somehow believe their outer body is a woman. Of course they know their outer body prior to transition is a man, and nobody is claiming otherwise. If you want to honestly address this issue, you need to honestly address what the other side is arguing. You are arguing against points that have not been raised. In other words, nobody is asserting that they believe that their outer body is a woman when they have a penis, but when responding to people calling them delusional, that is what you argue against.

That is the textbook definition of a strawman argument.

 

Wicked!

 

Ah so you're saying I'm not malicious, but I think they're subhuman and don't have constitutional rights. That's entirely respectful and totally not combative, nor does it boil down to 'you hate them'. I'm sure.

I've emphasized a few sentences.
The fact you are one of the scream at the sky because a ******bag got elected types, does not equate to me hating anyone, or thinking they deserve to be openly persecuted by the government. That doesn't mean I think you should be able to chemically castrate children, nor do I think that it is discriminatory or hateful to treat someone as their biological sex. That means if an adult wants to play pretend, they can do so without fear that the government will make it legal to hunt them through the streets like wild animals or the like.
You need to grasp that no one owes another person politeness under the law. No one is obligated to parrot another's beliefs out of politeness under the law.
Quite the opposite in fact. That right exists for ALL, including those who don't want to play pretend.