Racism in standardized testing

Do we need different tests for different cultures:

 

Equity.

 

We’ve already seen what happens when you just let people in based on equity and AA. Sure they’re “qualified” to get into college and unsurprisingly they drop out at the highest rate too. shocker!! Then again many colleges can’t even accept THAT so they push them through like it’s done in elementary school…and who cares if they really graduate. As long as we can ignore and FIX those disproportionate failures rates. Nobody look. Got to be equitable or it’s RACISM!!!

Just look at what Oregon is doing now. Hehe. We’ll have generations is really stupid people, but at least they didn’t FAIL!!! Sounds like CA, oh look, crime is going down because crime isn’t even crime anymore Look how the statistics are better. Never mind stores are closing, but LOOK at the crime statistics going down, hehe. Just don’t look too carefully. If you do you’re just a racist!!!

 

All IQ test in essence measure knowledge acquired at a given age and make extrapolations based on that information. and they are all normed. Note what Golem spoke of does not sound like any actual IQ test I've ever heard of. unless it's one of those bogus internet IQ test that sadly litter the internet like dead rats in a plague ship.

 

I think it was an example that was made up, either by him or by someone else.

 

The IQ tests I've taken asks you to extrapolate sequences of digits or patterns. No knowledge required.

 

Wrong. That is also a learned skill.

 

I must have been playing hooky the day they taught it.

 

Did you take math in grade school?

 

Sounds like pure stupidity and not racism. The test is ridiculous.

 

When I was in college in one of my Education Policy Studies classes we were given the example of a kid in California. His native language was not English but like most kids he had picked it up quickly. He was given an IQ test and performed poorly because while his language skills were good his cultural experiences lacked, and he was then placed in special education. He graduated high school and applied for college. California had an open admissions policy and had to accept him, on probation. He made deans list, repeatedly, on probation. When he graduated with highest honors he gave a commencement speech thanking everyone and ended by pointing out that he was still on academic probation.

That ended those type of tests in California and now most states,

Where I was a test for specific problems can be given and must be done in the child's maternal language. SATs and such are used by schools mainly as a measure of cultural aptitude. For example, I had a student here for whom English was his 6th language and he was self taught. When offered help to go to college from a Harvard prof that does research here he took the SAT and didn't quite score 800 (compared to my 1410) but he still got into college in the US and is now working on a PhD in computer science and he has been published.
The point being that standardized tests have a place but it is not to measure intelligence but rather level or type of education.

 

Rather than racist I'd say the SAT and ACT tests are very culturally biased. A suburban black American kid would score higher that a smarter white kid from Poland. A ghetto American Hispanic kid would not score as well as white Brit kids from well off homes of similar actual intelligence.

 

We AGREE that the GOP/NRA Gun Culture is the PROBLEM.

If the guns are SECURED there is not a problem but Xtofascist racist white supremacists have CREATED a CULTURE of VIOLENCE where NOTHING is allowed to done to even MEASURE the extent of the CULTURE problem, let alone allowing any SANE REGULATIONS that would keep guns OUT of the hands of the CRAZY people that are the primary cause of these MASS SHOOTINGS.

Almost 98% of ALL mass shooters are MALES!

Over 52% are WHITE!

https://nij.ojp.gov/topics/articles...masses-details-half-century-us-mass-shootings

Little wonder that Xtofascist racist white supremacists do NOT want ANYONE looking into their Gun Culture because that is where MORE than HALF of all the CRAZY mass shooters can be found.

They already KNOW that the crazies in their ranks will IGNORE all regulations.

Furthermore they OPPOSE all attempts at MENTAL HEALTH alternatives because that would EXPOSE the INSANITY that is the CORE of the GOP/NRA gun culture. Yes, it is a sign of insanity to ALLOW crazy people to have ACCESS to guns and still EXPECT them NOT to engage in mass killings when it is happening on a FAILY BASIS now.

Disclaimer: NONE of the above is intended as an INSULT to any member of this forum. It is just a matter of stating FACTS backed by credible sources. If anyone feels slighted because they self identify with the groups mentioned above please take note that I self identify as a liberal and do not take offense at LEGITIMATE criticism of my fellow liberals. I am opposed to any and all attempts to deny SANE people their RIGHT to own guns. However there is an URGENT NEED to have this DISCUSSION in an OPEN manner where ALL aspects are FAIR GAME for scrutiny.

 

OP: I used to administer standardized IQ tests for a living, including minority groups. These tests have a useful function in certain contexts. The important thing is that a qualified psychologist is administering the test who will take into account context, culture, body language, emotional states of the participant, etc.

The OP has some good points. Regarding the situation in Africa and IQ testing, notwithstanding cultural differences,many of the communities there are traumatised which has drastic effects on brain development. Before white people came the various tribes were perfectly integrated into their environment. A perfect symbiosis which has been significantly disrupted and certainly no IQ test is going to be able to gauge that loss. I would leave white supremacy out of it though.

 

Yes. Exactly. Good point! It must be stressed that these tests are useful in certain contexts. My complain is just that white supremacists use them to promote their agenda. Maybe calling them "standardized" is not a good idea, because they are not standard across different ethnic groups.

I would too. But white supremacists won't.

 

Yes

 

A perfect symbiosis? Perfectly integrated? Please PLEASE tell me you're being facetious....

 

No, I am not. Native tribes are (edit:were?) attuned both physically and spiritually to their environments in a way the modern Westerners would struggle to understand. Hundreds of thousands of years of evolution assured this.

As an example related to OP and the topic of IQ I read that our native Aboriginals struggled with left and right (culturally non-relevant) which made comprehending mental rotation tasks more difficult, but did better than average for spatial awareness i.e. compass points.

 

That's some good BS there. Way to stick to your racist anti-gun guns. Let's address your points.
(1) Xtofascist racist white supremacists You say that but the data tells a different story. Roughly 18% of the population contain 49% of the murderers in this country. That 18% are black, not white. Tell me again how it's whitie that has a problem.
(2) MASS SHOOTINGS. Mass shootings are horrible. They are scary and they get people riled up. They account for only 5% of the murders in this country. That's what you are afraid of more than the 95%. Tell my why that is.
(3) Almost 98% of ALL mass shooters are MALES! Again with the focus on mass shootings. But let's just make it simple: Males kill the most people. Doesn't change across race lines. Testosterone maybe.
(4) Over 52% are WHITE! Let's look at that number too. While that may or may not be true for mass murders (since that's all you seem to care about), It's certainly not true for all murderers. When you add hispanic into the mix (they count most all hispanic as white), it says that 19% of the murderers are hispanic, 33% white, and 47% black.

I'm also going to add number (5) AR-15s. Because I know that this is the number one gun that you guys want to ban. Yet it accounts for 5% of murders. It's scary looking and I guess you guys just care about what scares you and not what it is that's more likely to get you killed.

In my opinion, this person should have gotten the mental healthcare that he needed. His provider should have their license revolked. Also, his guns should have been taken away until such time as he was deemed to not be a threat. The problem in that kind of law, though, is it disincentivises people to seek the help that they know they need. The government also doesn't help because they tend to lump everyone together for silly reasons. For example, if you take Wellbutrin to quit smoking, it may be considererd as a medicine to fight depression then the FBI bangs down your door and takes your guns.

Anyway, this is just another example of how you blame "white supremacy" for something that is clearly not a white person problem and you ignore the real race related culture problem because you are afraid to be called a racist. But that just makes you a racist because you are covering for a race problem that you know exists.

 

I Q tests have always been a load of crap.

 

Same racial disparities in SAT and ACT test scores can be seen in test scores on standardized math test made up of solving mathematical equations, with no culture involved.

 

Fancy word for communism.

 

When I was in the Peace Corps students were doing math I'd never seen. I had scored over 700 and 30 on SAT and ACT math. I had University level engineering calculus classes, plural, and could not have performed one of the math questions that was on their.final exam. Did that make them smarter than me?
Schools are not equal in the US. Teachers are not equal in the US. Parental motivation is not equal in the US. All of these things factor into tests like that. As I've said, i have a former student from here in the USA now working on his PhD in CS. He's been published already. Yet he scored less than half my SAT score on both sections.

 

I think you have revealed a fundamental misunderstanding about the purpose of standardized testing as per the OP, it's not about whatever native intelligence you may or may not have, but can you do the work? Compared to what your students were doing, no, you couldn't keep up with them, and it would make sense for them to accepted in an advance program in calc and you wouldn't.

So ultimately teachers being unequal(!), parental motivation, or whatever the case is, isn't relevant to the need to be able to handle the workload. If you can't do it, regardless of your sob story, you shouldn't move up to schooling where you are expected to be able to handle the work. None of this was controversial until very recently.

 

The point is SAT and such are a measure of what you have learned not what you can learn. I repeat, another student of mine got his first touch of a computer with me. His SAT score was half mine yet he is now working on a PhD in CS in the US, working for INTEL and has been published. A business may want a measure of what you know, a University and most businesses wants to know how far you can you go.