BMW Ends ICE Production in Germany! Mercedes?

Ev charge times and range are not going to get much better. As it stands now if you rely on fast chargers your damaging your vehicle.

But this is limited by several things. First the battery material. For an anode you need an atom that is willing to give up an electron and you don't get much better than lithium in a solid material. I don't think there's any plans to make a gaseous State Battery.

Did you have charge times if you can slowly charge it home and you have that option then it's fine. Anybody who rents their home can't do this.

So the vehicles are going to be extraordinarily inconvenient and they won't last very long for a large section of the population.

Even if you don't care if your car is going to wind up in the dump in three years and you use a fast charger I can only charge so fast the limit on charging speed is temperature. When you charge your pushing that Adam out of the carbon matrix back into the lithium. That movement requires heat it also generates heat. So cooling the battery in this process will slow down the charging. Beating it up will probably cause thermal runaway.

So is it stands range and charge time are probably about the best they can be there may be a tiny bit of room for the smallest bit of improvement but I don't think it's going to make a difference.

The only way to make them cheaper to manufacture is put a battery that you have less range per kilogram in the vehicle.

So much of the mythology surrounding electric vehicles is based on scientific illiteracy not understanding the laws of thermodynamics and the chemistry involved in the battery, and wishful thinking believing everybody will take on these horrendous inconveniences to drive a more expensive less convenient vehicle.

Sales increasing from point 9% of the car market to 1% of the car market is not that profound.

 

The batteries is expensive as they are are horrendous problem.

You can't fully charge them because it will reduce the capacity you can't fully discharge that because it would reduce the capacity if you charge them too fast are too often it will diminish the capacity.

I can dump a full charge of fuel into my truck every single time and run it from 100% full to zero every single time and it doesn't reduce the size of the fuel tank.

Also discovering a new atom that can be in a solid state or a molecular lattice that can be a better anode than lithium is very far-fetched.

Sort of maybe trapping some gaseous materials within a molecular lattice this is as good as it gets.

Another component that suggests that this is doomed is the need for government Force. People didn't have to be forced to give up their horse and buggy when the car came out they wanted the car because it was better.

People have to be bribed or coerced or tricked into adopting electric cars because they are substandard. You wouldn't have to force people to adopt these if they didn't suck.

 

Battery technology is improving in all the dimensions you mention.

The Lucid Grand Touring has over 500 miles of range, for example.

The cost of batteries is constantly falling significantly. For one example:

https://about.bnef.com/blog/lithium-ion-battery-pack-prices-hit-record-low-of-139-kwh/

You are searching for failure. Nobody wins by searching for failure.

 

Delete

 

Wow!

My F150 has about 700 miles of range, 500 pulling an 8000 lb. trailer.

And it refills in 10 minutes, every time.

And I'll guess it's at least 40% lighter than the Lucid.

And the tires last for about 80,000 miles.

No matter how you spin it, the Lucid is much more impractical crap.

 

Hey - a lot of people like riding around in an F-15!

You'll note that I haven't tried to convince you to change your vehicles.

 

Do you have any idea how a battery works? How they charge and how they discharge?

Inside of all batteries there are three components. A cathode, an anode and an electrode made out of dissimilar substances. There's more chemistry on the atomic level and the molecular level but we'll forgo that for now.

As a battery discharges the anode gives up an electron to the cathode the electrolyte typically a bath of either paste or liquid that carries the election.

When you charge the battery you are pushing that electron back into the anode

In lithium ion batteries the anode is lithium oxide and the cathode is carbon lattice. These two materials were carefully selected. The reason they were selected is they can tolerate a lot more charges and discharges. There is a different reason lead acid batteries are in gasoline and diesel cars. I think they'll be better in hybrids but we'll forgo why for now.

The reason lithium was selected isn't just because of its extra electron that it's happy to give up but it's resilience. Iron has two electrons it's willing to give up but placing it in a bath makes it deteriorate.

The only thing you can do to give greater discharge is find a super material or capture gas in some sort of solid or place it under enough pressure to metallicize it

You can't do anything about the heat generated by charging.

So do you have any idea what materials they are making these new batteries out of, or how they plan on charging fast without thermal runway?

 

No, but your government is trying to do that with your support.

 

Not an electric one.

You probably couldn't. Electric cars are for electric car enthusiasts. Just like how you couldn't convince me to buy a Land Rover or a Porsche I don't like junk.

 

I think it's a bluff from the government and I think it's largely a scam.

 

No. I wish it was, but EPA has more regulatory power and hubris than anybody can control.

 

I think is there a mandate gets closer and closer first they're under the executive authority and the executive can just bitch slap them. And they would be much more likely to do that than to totally tank an industry.

End of the executive doesn't do anything the supreme Court will.

Forcing me to drive a piece of s*** that I have to spend hours of my life charging the violation of my civil rights.

 

EPA is part of the Executive branch. Currently they work for Biden. They're doing what Biden tells them to do.

Congress is supposed to be the ones who tell EPA what to do through authorizing legislation. But the Supreme Court decisions Chevron v. NRDC (1984) and Massachusetts v. EPA (2007) changed that to let the agencies themselves (and their Executive bosses) decide what they wanted to do regardless of what Congress actually legislated.

There is currently a case before the Supreme Court called Loper Bright Enterprises v. Raimondo that was heard in January and will be decided in June that looks very likely to overturn Chevron. If it does, EPA's authority to regulate CO2 dies. If it doesn't, we're simply unbelievably screwed as a country.

 

Biden will tell them otherwise or there will be consequences.

I argue the EPA should strictly be an advisor as well as the ATF, NSA, FBI, CIA, FDA FCC and all their ability to make law should be stripped and the division possibly defunded

 

Charging factors such as heat are monitored by software.

I know that manganese is being added to some lithium iron batteries, but there are a number of new chemistries reaching production.

What I'm pointing out is that:
- battery prices are coming down by significant amounts. By the end of this year, Sachs says EV battery price will have dropped by as much as 40%.

- there are cars in the above 400 mile range available today.

- charging times are falling significantly.

- Tesla and others are adding new charging locations at a significant rate - you can look it up.

- China is subsidizing its auto manufacturing and plans for China to own the industry. Their rate of export is increasing rapidly. Who knows what they will do outside of the light auto industry, but they certainly have other major transportation technology.

 

I know how seriously you want air pollution.

Do you want river pollution equally strenuously? How about drinking water? Lead is cheaper.

I'm just not sure where your limits are for adding toxic chemistry to our lives.

 

And of course Biden rings then every day

it is not just America - places like Jakarta are choking on fumes and that is why Indonesia is about to go electric - big time!

 

Yes, the consequences are huge. But Biden's already stated his goal of having the US be CO2 free by 2035. It's happening, period.

And I'm genuinely on your side. I also fully understand that "climate change" is probably the biggest, most arcane scam ever created. But Executive agencies are already properly Constitutionally defined. They are what they are.

Progressives merely found the magic work around first.

And there's nothing you or I can do.

 

CO2 is not a pollutant.

The rest of that snark is not worth entertaining with an answer.

 

Nobody is choking on CO2. It's virtually impossible unless you're trapped in a spaceship and your air scrubber fails.

And last I checked, Indonesia is a sovereign nation. It can do whatever it wants.

And someday you might want to figure out how America actually works.

 

yeah and it will not be any faster. Going faster will cause thermal runaway.

manganese might make it less likely for there to be a dendritic growth which is metallicizing lithium it falls out of solution from the outside but it will make charge time slower and it will reduce the capacity of the battery based on the nature of the atom.

Demand has dropped.

No, manufacturers claim that

Not possible.

I'm not interested.

I want to know how you charge a battery faster.

China cooks their books. There are fields with thousands of EVs rotting away. If China is your hope it's already over.

Pirated reverse engineered warmed over Tesla left overs tied to the world's biggest road flare.

Oh goodie when can I get my Chinese death trap.

 

When Biden is 92 and nowhere near office? It's not happening period.

Somebody is going to have to pull 200 million traction batteries out of their ass.

There's no magic work around. They can't make batteries for all of these cars.

 

I know.

They don't.

And the regulations that will be released shortly will cover 2027 to 2032. And unless something like Loper stops them, 67% of new cars sold in 2032 will have to be EVs.

Nobody ever said Biden, EPA, and the rabid climate nuts were bright.

 

they'll throw that right out.

If they hold fast on this and don't repeal it because it's national suicide there will be court cases that will force them to repeal it.

The only way they can make it 67% of new cars is if they drastically reduced the number of cars they manufacture. And no that's not going to happen.

On let's say they just go ahead and manufacture them what's the EPA going to do?

I love the belief that not only will this not happen it can't.

 

LOL. Indonesia “going electric” by massively increasing coal usage—the dirtiest most CO2 polluting of fossil fuels.


https://news.mongabay.com/2023/08/c...urn-even-more-fossil-fuel-for-green-tech/amp/

Clearly, reduction of pollution is not the goal.