God works in mysterious ways

That contradicts the nature of prayer and is indistinguishable from a universe without a theistic god.

Seems like you are describing deism.

 

I'm not angry about anything. If you choose to believe in your faith how am I to argue that? I just expect people who call themselves religious and or faithful to follow their own guidelines.
You are another one who picks and chooses what parts of the bible you will follow and believe in. Yes your first post that set us on this course is a judgment. The following have been you trying to explain why it was not.

The post that began this dialogue was a quote from a book that goes unproven and I questioned that. To which you have evaded an answer. Either you know it is unproven and can't find a reliable source or you are just trying to ignore the fact that I questioned it.

So far you have an A in creating spin. But you lack the ability to truly respond to the first post.

 

When I was a Christian I learned really fast that God does not answer prayers, ever. And despite what many Christians say or think about prayer, I honestly don't think that's the purpose of prayer. As in praying or essentially, 'wishing', to God that he do certain things for you or give you things.

It was from my understanding that God just let the world go and run all on it's own without him interfering with it at all. And that seems like an easier way to explain all the evils of this world too.

So despite what modern Christianity may teach, like when the 700 Club holds a prayer session to heal some random audience member out their behind their TV screens, I am pretty positive that is not the purpose of prayer and I believe people who do things like that are lying to their viewers/listeners.

I think prayer is meant for thanking God or just worshipping him. Maybe it's even there to give people comfort in their lives when they really need someone to talk to. But I don't think it was ever meant to just 'wish' for stuff.

And yes, while many modern Christians may think that the great things happening to them are thanks to God, like getting that awesome job, chances are they should be thankful for their own hard work or they're just lucky.

For the Christians who truly believe prayer magically gives them all their little wish fulfillment though...well I wouldn't wait too long to hear a logical answer as to why prayer works for them but not for the thousands of starving people around the world. Just know that they are probably oblivious to the real purpose of prayer and are incorrectly giving thanks to God where they really only have themselves to thank or be thankful that they were simply born more well-off than others.

 

Again another person quoting an unproven source. That's bad form. Your sources should be verifiable in a debate.

 

You can tell people not to use the Bible all you want to, but you have to realize you are in the Religion forum and the question is directed at Christians and Christianity. Obviously they are going to look to the Bible to explain their beliefs. What do you expect them to use? The Dictionary? An Encyclopedia?

 

Sure Luke 13:4

http://bible.cc/luke/13-4.htm

 

I know what you are saying to be true. I do expect in a debate no matter what the topic that the source should be verifiable. The bible is not a verifiable source. A bible used as evidence of god is useless.

 

Very well done.

My past Uncle was a devout Catholic. However he had a very interesting idea concerning prayer, he said he did not believe you were talking to a god or that the god was listening if it did exist. He said that he used prayer as a means of meditation, to concentrate and work through a particular problem and move on from there.

A very insighful man.

 

As I said the book is meaningless until you can prove it and it's authorship. Good luck with that.

 

But it can certainly be used to explain how prayer is supposed to work within the Christian religion or even what the purpose of prayer is.

The debate here isn't whether or not God exists. It is assumed already that God (may) exist and he only gives to certain people who pray to him and appears to ignore others who pray to him.

I think the purpose of this thread though is to look more deeply into why some believe prayer works for them and grants them their petty wish fulfillment while those of us on the outside of the religion recognize that if that were really true then why are thousands of people around the world being ignored and go on to starve to death or die in wars or die from disease, etc.

If you want to debate the existence of God you'd have to start a new thread.

 

And I honestly think that is the purpose of prayer for the most part. For people to meditate and commune with their deity.

But sadly, in this country, televangelism is on the rise and what I call 'modern Christians' seem to think if you pray to God for what they want they will magically get it. And when good things do happen to people they incorrectly attribute it to God because they just happened to pray to him last night for that very thing.

I just looked up online though the purpose of prayer, because I am honestly not totally knowledgeable about it and I came across this website that sort of explains the purpose of prayer, at least from this person's understanding.

I agree with him for the most part.

http://www.toughquestionsanswered.org/2009/03/20/what-is-the-purpose-of-prayer/

 

I didn't quote the Bible anyway... just explained what I knew..

But he can read the link to Scripture himself as "source" if he is so inclined.

 

It speculates on how prayer might work.
I asked a poster to explain a response in which he used scripture to prove his point. I asked for a better source. He pushed this in this direction.
I know exactly what the topic of the thread is. If a person is going to make a statement that uses a non source let him defend it by explaining why. I have no intention of starting a thread on the existence of god as it is a waste of time.
I am asking people to use reliable sources for their information. I could really care less who believes in god or not.

 

According to your quote prayer is a waste of time. It alters zero.

 

I disagree with this.

While I do agree with you that people are probably not really speaking with any real deity I do believe that prayer can be a mental thing and that it can really make people feel better or help them in some ways. Meditating is nothing new. Therapists often recommend people meditate to help them psychologically.

Maybe if someone prays or 'meditates' before going to an interview it can help get them in the right state of mind to really wow their potential employer. Maybe that's why some people attribute good things that happen to them to God, because they prayed or 'meditated' before-hand, thus altering their state of mind.

If a person truly believes that prayer will help them then I think it can. It's like a placebo effect if you think about it.

Does it work supernaturally speaking? I don't know. No one knows this and no one can measure it. But I do think it can change the way someone thinks or feels because they believe it will change/help them.

 

You are correct. The calming mental benefits are proven.
The meditative process does work in that regard. I didn't even consider that aspect in my earlier response.

 

There are a great many subjects that cannot be "verified" with any perfect proof.

I thought you wanted the SOURCE of the parable.. I provided it to you.

 

Prayer really isn't about gimmie, gimmie at all..

 

Hmmmmmm..... seems in line with my thinking for sure.

http://www.politicalforum.com/humor-satire/220321-prayer.html

 

I think its called the "Prosperity Gospel"... or "Prosperity Theology"..

 

omg...my dad's ex-girlfriend believed this. She said she gave 10% of her earnings to her church every week or month or something and swore up and down that it worked. But after getting to know her and her line of work really well...yikes. She was a very hard worker but she also manipulated a lot of people to make her money as well.

 

The source of the parable was very nice thank you. The question to the earlier poster was the validity of the source of his quote.

 

It sure sounds that way hearing what people pray for. You may pray in a different way.

 

Oh I pray for the safety of my friends and family and their well-being.. just like others.. but I also pray for mercy, wisdom, acceptance and a peaceful heart.. I am getting up in years so maybe I am not so hardheaded as I once was.

 

Can "I" say something about that?!