Most people will be going to hell. Not to mention everyone who was born before Christianity existed. To me is seems we are not held in high regard, and doubtfully made in His image if hell is mostly our fate. Being a Christian (Or other religion with an equivalent promise of hell), how does that make you feel? Most people adopt the religion of their parents and have little chance to change to the "True" religion, whatever it happens to be (i.e. Islam requires death for apostasy). I mean this is your fellow man. He has the same emotions, fears, and desired as you. If you've ever been able to meet people from around the world you may know this to be the case. Were not so different after all. How do you reconcile this uncompromising situation with a loving God? PS Please note that I find it hard to believe your particular religion is "obvious". If it were I'd expect to belong to the religion along with the great majority of people.
It is obvious. The Catholic Church created Hell to raise money. With or without Hell Christianity is real, Christ is real and your future depends solely on what He did on the cross for you. Whether you believe it or not.
With or without reaching moksha, Hinduism is real; Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva are all real and your future depends solely on how you identify with Brahman. Whether you believe it or not.
that's a very rational question. "what about the rest, the people who were not warned and did not get the message?" i know the question was for christians. i'll try to explain the islamic pov, maybe to look from a different perspective. we can track that information in the passages of the noble qur'an where moses (pbuh) argues with the pharaoh: that was your question. so far i think we spotted the problem... now let's try to match a reasonable explanation and see if islam provides an answer, with the permission of Allah. first let's see what moses (pbuh) answered to pharaoh: the answer might be interpreted as "don't worry, Allah knows it all, all the history has been recorded. He does not forget nor He makes a mistake" with his answer moses (pbuh) makes sure that nobody will be punished for no reason / randomly. every single tiny thing is recorded and will be brought in front of each person at the day of judgement, everyone will face his deeds. now that we covered that the previous nations / people were not ignored. we need to find out how fair this is to punish someone if "the way Allah wants" has not been given as an open invitation... so let's move on to the next phase with a hadith*: so according to this hadith a large number of messengers has been sent to all nations starting with adam (pbuh) up untill muhammed (saw); passing the same message over and over again. but the number is 124.000 or 224.000? how many to be exact? so for every nation there was the same message called islam. what does islam mean? islam is a simple message. starting with the core idea to worship Allah (God) alone. to put your will underneath your creator's. it's the way of life chosen for us by our master. do submit only to Allah, not to his creation yes. do not worship a man, nor a prophet, nor the moon, nor the sun, nor the money, nor your children, nor yourself... only Allah (God), the one who created everything. you should also check this part of qur'an, it's about the promise we give to Allah. we = meaning all humanity, each person. (called "qalu bela" among muslims): also take a gaze at this part, where it addresses to the doubters. regards.
Thank you for your detailed response. The Holy book described the situation better the would have expected! That said (previous generations have an "out") do you think the same rational may be valid a person living today that was never given access to the teaching (Say a Mongolian farmer for example)? What about person who is aware of Islam but brought up in another religion (never "turned" from the faith because never belonged)?
I have always found it interesting that Christians believe that God only came to them with Jesus… Like God is a racist or something and only those Jews will go to Heaven. If God is God, he would come to those people as God in a way that they would understand. I mean, they are his kids right? You don’t come at all 1 million of your children the same way since they are all different… How could a Jesus convince Indians into believing in him? They still aren’t Christians! If there is a God, He is not a biased son of a #### that treats people different. I think He is fully capable of coming to everyone in a way that they will believe in Him. I think God has many names. I think that is why there has been no group of people found that didn’t believe in a or many God’s…. Just sayin…
Absolutely! Soooo glad to find someone who can see God as an universal/personal entity, not diminished, narrowed to human limitations such as culture, time, and understanding of the scientific/natural world! In my view, you are 100% correct! God is so far above "manmade religions." And we only diminish HIM/HER/IT by imposing our narrow understanding and standards as HIS/HER/ITS only "image!"
Yes. . .the problem is that the Holy Books were written by MEN. . .not God! So, although they may have been INSPIRED by God, or by men's search for God, they are really the interpretation of men's needs to identify with an image of God. . .which by definition is limiting!
What most Christians believe in this regard is false and in which you are basing your argument. Scriptures clearly shows that the vast majority of humanity, whom never repented or never knew about Jesus will be in the second resurrection. Most Christians are not even aware of the second resurrection, even though Jesus mentioned it and it is mentioned in the Old Testament and also in mentioned in the book of Revelation. The second resurrection is for those you are referring to. So when those such as yourself try to make an argument based on a false or untrue foundation the end of that conclusion the result will be false.
I really wasn't aware of the Second Resurrection.. What great rejoicing will attend the first resurrection! What great anguish at the second! What a responsibility we have to share the Gospel! And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire (Jude 23).
Well when Jesus said this like "Only through me..." maybe I'm making assumptions but I don't think he meant someone like Joseph Smith is an acceptable alternative (I'm not picking on Mormons, it could have been anyone). So I'm getting the impression that your particular faith is a non factor of going to hell or not?
Jesus saying that does not make null and void the fact that He also said the wicked will be in the second resurrection. What I tell people is what the Bible says and it says all those who are in the grave will be resurrected. Those who say if a person did not repent before they die are doomed for Hell, are among the many who don't study the Bible but instead believe everything they hear in Church from the pastor. They are some of the ones that would believe pretty much whatever the pastor tells them even when the Bible says something else.
maybe god, shoves evolution down the morons throats, so that either the people evolving with the knowledge, or die lying about the beliefs. nature is pretty fair the SOB's are who lie When i tell you that you must breath air, i bet you will. When i say, you must eat, i bet you will. nature dont lie and anyone can understand the basics. It is the liars that cause the stupidity within mankinds beliefs, not god(s). but there is actually only ONE definition of 'existence' (mother nature; god itself) and only ONE idiot with the name upon the head, walking on this earth today. And it aint you but you have been slapped around by that idiot for months. Christianity; aint truth! ie.... jesus wasnt the idiot with the name
you are welcome. your questions make sense, you are in sincere pursuit of knowledge. and actually, this is what Allah (God) requires from his servants. not beleiving blindily, just because someone told you to. we are required to think on our own, to research, then to know, to understand and finally to comply with pure intentions. but most of the muslims including me, are ignorant /unaware of many things. may Allah forgive us. about your question; again, we find the answer in the noble qur'an: there are still tribes today who are being discovered in the middle of amazon. so what will happen to them? well, one thing is for sure: Allah tells us (above) that they will not be punished. that is a promise by Allah. but if you ask me in detail what will happen to them, what kind of eternal life they will have, or will they? Allah knows best. scolars say that the unaware/uninformed person is expected to comply at least to the fundemental humane behaviours. but i have no hadith or ayah to show you about this. so it's just a view. let me elaborate about "how to get to paradise" while we're at it, so that you maybe have a better notion, insaAllah. you have to understand tawheed (the oneness of Allah) is the core of islam. and idolatry is the only sin Allah claims will not forgive. in "fatiha", the surah that a practicing muslim recites 40 times+ a day, there is a part that says "you (alone) we worship, and you (alone) we ask for help". that is the very soul of islam among many other beautiful things. so facing to God and only God, accepting no intermediaries or partners is a must to take the ticket to paradise. we see, in qur'an, at the beautiful story of the abraham (pbuh) how he discovers the truth by pondering about what's around him, and how he frees himself from everything else by submitting to Allah: for each individual, -only- Allah knows whether they will go to hell or to paradise. a muslim can not say that he/she will wind up at the paradise "for sure". and actually we are warned in qur'an not to do so. nor get desperate about anything. because being desperate is from sheitan (devil). so, we do our best, constantly, untill we leave this world. we rely on Allah and we work. it doesn't matter if you see a guy praying all day long, fasting, giving charity, so on... it doesn't mean that he will 100% go to paradise. the intentions are important. the heart is important, and only Allah sees hearts... but we assume that person is good, and we hope he will be granted paradise. there is no prescription in islam like other religions: "if you are born in "x religion" then you are saved", or "believe in this "x deity" and it doesn't matter what sin you commit". nope. nobody, and i mean nobody, has a predetermined contract. one last thing: Allah also warns us about people who has been informed about islam yet they get even more persistant or at least do not change their ways, because of what their forefathers shown them or they do not free themselves from the society, they do not ask for guidance etc... i have posted these previously on another thread, here you go: and this passage is for the informed ones, it's about freewil. and also about punishment for deliberate bad judgment and serving evil. sorry for the long post and typos. hope that i could answer your question. regards.
Depends on which people you are talking about since HE has come to all as different forms. You are taking the "white mans" God and not the Planets God or God's... Big difference.... [edit] I'll explain it like this. If there is a God he is over this planet! Thus, he is God over this planet, and there is no other God. Thus, the God the Eskimos worship is the same as the Mek tribes and the white guy, Asian guy and black guy... It's all the same. A God rules over this planet. Is is all - he is many - he is GOD! And if there is one - he's not a bigot, a racist, not jealous, not anything but love and hate and all that there is, and that is outside of our understanding!!
Ever wondered if HE is a she? i like that the sun? the egyptian god 'rah'? ah.............. ONE god and the rest are creations? ie.... god(s) are manmade, perhaps? is is............? So the 2 big emotions but not the little ones in between (love/hate.......... but not jealous, bigotry...etc...) In a way i like it. Would that mean; megadeath or peace in the 'end times'? ps..... christianity, aint true. evidence: a).....matt 16:20 Then did he charge his disciples that they may say to no one that he is Jesus the Christ. b) ..... 'megadeath' c) ..... Peace
If none of the religious books had ever been written, what do you think the imact on yourself would have been? I suggest that you have been introduced to god via these books and poeple who follow them. If there had been no books, it would be unlikely that you'd have a religious mindset.
