Is Hellfire A Bible Teaching?

ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

The teaching of hellfire is commonplace in Christendom and non-Christian religions. This teaching defames the Creator and portrays him as a sadist who tortures people in flames of fire for all eternity—as punishment for wrongdoing committed during the relatively brief human lifespan. The hellfire dogma was brought into Christianity by the Roman Catholics who copied it from pagan religions. (Pagans are those who do not worship the God of the Judeo-Christian Bible.)

The Bible makes it clear as to how God views the ritual burning of people. Jehovah ended up rejecting the ancient Israelites after they got involved with pagan worship, which included burning their children to death.

"And they [the Israelites/sons of Judah] have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, in order to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, a thing that I had not commanded and that HAD NOT COME UP INTO MY HEART." (Jeremiah 7:31)


"{58} And they kept offending him with their high places, and with their graven images they kept inciting him to jealousy. {59} God heard and got to be furious, and he condemned Israel very much. {60} And he finally forsook the tabernacle of Shiloh, the tent in which he resided among earthling men." (Psalms 78:58-60)


The scriptures indicate that hell is nothing more than mankind’s common grave. Proof of this is provided by a verse of scripture in the Bible, which no hellfire-believing Christian can explain away. I’m referring to the scripture that says Jesus Christ--the epitome of a perfect, sinless, and obedient man--died and went to hell.

"{21} In fact, to this course you were called, because even Christ suffered for you, leaving you a model for you to follow his steps closely. {22} He committed no sin, nor was deception found in his mouth." (1 Peter 2:21-22)


"He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that HIS SOUL WAS NOT LEFT IN HELL, neither his flesh did see corruption." (Acts 2:31--King James Version)


NOTE #1: The Bible uses the word "fire" symbolically to indicate cleansing OR permanent death OR permanent destruction. In the few times when the Bible used the word "fire" literally, it was with reference to events such as the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah--at which point, the individuals did not suffer eternal torment, they died immediately.

NOTE #2: the words "Hell" and "Hades" and "Sheol" and "Pit" are synonyms that mean THE GRAVE (of mankind).

NOTE #3: "High Places" as used in the scriptures that I quote in this thread refer to the worship of the false gods.


DISCUSSION QUESTIONS:
1. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did Jehovah command the ancient Israelites to burn anyone in the fire?

2. According to Jeremiah 7:31, did the burning of people come to God's heart?

3. According to Jeremiah 7:31 and Psalms 78:58-59, did the ancient Israelites offend God by getting involved with false worship in their "high places", which included burning people to death?

4. According to those who teach hellfire torment, hell is a place for people who are wicked and sinful. If Hellfire is for wicked people, why did Jesus spend three days in hell--considering that it says at 1 Peter 2:22 that he did not commit any sin?

5. Jesus obeyed Jehovah and died a slow and torturous death for mankind. Hadn't he suffered enough? He'd suffered terribly--because of being obedient to his Heavenly Father. So why was he being punished again with burning hellfire? What's the logic for punishing him all over again?

6. Recall that after Jesus' resurrection, he appeared and spoke to several of his faithful apostles on different occasions before he returned to heaven. Why is it that Jesus made no mention to any of his apostles--after his resurrection--that he went to hell where he burned for three days?

7. When people are being tortured in hellfire, wouldn't they have to KNOW or be conscious/aware of the fact that they are being burned? I mean to say, what's the point of punishing people in hell if they aren't even aware?

8. Those who believe in eternal torment say that the person's soul is being burned forever. What is the soul? Is it something separate from the person's body? Are animals souls also or is this only for humans?

 

The concept of hell fire was introduced in Deuteronomy 32:22 = For a fire is kindled in My anger, And shall burn to the lowest hell; It shall consume the earth with her increase, And set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

The Bible fary tale ends with a lot of evil people being tossed into the lake of fire, along with death and hell itself. Therefore hell fire and the lake of fire are different things, at least according to the Bible.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- THE WYRD OF GAWD:

The concept of LITERAL hellfire is nowhere to be found in the Judeo-Christian Bible. The scripture at Deuteronomy 32:22 is using figurative language. The fact that it ends with the words "it shall consume the earth and her increase," is one of several red flags, since the Bible makes it clear that the earth will never be destroyed.

If you go back and read my OP you will see that I gave the synonyms for hell.

ALTER2EGO -to- THE WYRD OF GAWD:

The "lake of fire" is found only in the book of Revelation. The book of Revelation is written mostly in symbolic language. This is made abundantly clear in the very first verse in that book. I suggest you go read Revelation 1:1, and you will see what I mean.

The "lake of fire" is symbolic for permanent death or permanent destruction. I could provide you with scriptures that will prove this, but I've read enough of your posts to know you are an atheist and that you could care less about Biblical truths. I suspect your sole purpose for posting in this thread is to play troll.

 

Nope nothings biblical unless YOU say it is, mr Jehovah's witness............

 

The concept of LITERAL hellfire is nowhere to be found in the Judeo-Christian Bible.

If by Judeo you mean jewish, there is no such thing as a Judeo-Christian bible.

Judeo-Christian is an oxymoron. That's like saying there is a Negro-KKK association.

The so called jews have nothing to do with Christ or anything Christian.

I mention this only because unless one has a right understanding of who the Scriptures were written for, to, about and by,
they will be confused and that forever about virtually everything related to Scripture,
including "hell" and "hell fire."

 

That's your opinion, and here are the verses from the Holy Bible.
.
.
http://www.av1611.org/hell.html
.
.

 

In Revelation 21:1 it states that the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. That sounds to me like they will be destroyed. Besides, Jesus and his angels pretty much wrecked them fighting Satan, the beast, and the false prophet and most of humanity.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- THE WYRD OF GAWD:
Like I previously said, you need to read Revelation 1:1 and then look at the language throughout Revelation. Some of it is literal language, but most of Revelation is symbolic language. A symbolic word is not to be taken literally. It means something entirely different.

"A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. And he sent forth his angel and PRESENTED IT IN SIGNS through him to his slave John," (Revelation 1:1)


Revelation 21:1 is not talking about the literal heaven and the literal earth. It's talking about people. The Bible says the literal earth will never be destroyed.

"A generation is going, and a generation is coming; but the earth is standing even to time indefinite." (Ecclesiastes 1:4)


The "heaven" at Revelation 21:1 is with reference to people in powerful positions—the governments, the ruling class. The "earth" is with reference to the mankind in general, the ordinary citizen. The Bible makes it clear at Daniel 2:44 that God's heavenly kingdom will destroy all human governments (the "heaven" in Revelation 21:1).

"And in the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it itself will stand to times indefinite;" (Daniel 2:44)

The "earth" and the "sea" at Revelation 21:1 is with reference to disobedient and agitated mankind, many of whom God will destroy.



Notice how the Bible refers to people as "the earth."

"Now all the earth continued to be of one language and of one set of words." (Genesis 11:1)



Notice how the Bible says all wicked humans will be destroyed while making it clear that people will continue living on the earth (which obviously will not be destroyed).

"For evildoers themselves will be cut off, but those hoping in Jehovah are the ones that will possess the earth." (Psalms 37:9)


The reason why I gave you the above explanations is for the benefit of others who visit this thread. I personally don't take you seriously. I believe your main objective is to amuse yourself by making a mockery of God, the Bible, and Christianity. You won't get any help from me, because I've already figured you out. I've debated dozens of atheists at other websites, so I'm familiar with your game. I usually put them on "Ignore" when I get tired of them--at which point, everything they post is invisible to me.

 

It's referred to as "the Judeo-Christian Bible" for various reasons. One of those reasons is because the Old Testament/The Hebrew scriptures establishes the connection and affirms Belief in the The God of the ancient Jews/Israelites and the same God, Jehovah, who embraced the Christian followers of Jesus Christ in the New Testament. It's also called "Judeo-Christian" because it contains the Mosaic Law Covenant which applied only to the ancient Jews/Israelites, while the New Testament/The Greek Scriptures contains the New Covenant which Jesus Christ established with his disciples.

 

This verse refers to the gentiles nations which were all sexually promiscuous matriarchies before Moses introduced the monotheism of the Hebrew patriarchs to the world of his day.

It referred to the practice of Abortion which is common to matriarchies where the women trade sexual favors for social and economic benefits.
The fire referred to the destroying of the little bodies right after birth in those, before they invented the coat hanger.

But, the matriarchies which practiced the sexual promiscuity were, indeed, faced with the hell of these patrairchs who attacked and destroyed them, like the muslims today are so clearly doingto the West.

 

Well yeah,...
The bottom line is supported by science todaywhich tells us plainly, "Adapt tot he natural Laws of become extinct."

Extinction is the second death, when the whole gene pool of a species disappears.


The dinosaurs are a case in point.
They are in the lake of fire just below the crust of the earth, in the hot molten magma that has erased their previous existence short of the few bones we still stumble upon.

The previous 22 now extinct humans that disappeared leaving only us, modern man, warn us that we can be too over confident about our eternal life as a species.
We better consider changing our behaviors in light of the fact that man is now man's wort enemy.

Love this god which holds the power of Natural Laws, in this world where loving other men and working together with them seems the key to both survival and an extended Golden Age.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

Part and parcel with the false teaching of hellfire is another false teaching: the immortal soul dogma. According to the immortal soul teaching, when the body of an individual dies, the soul (which is said to be invisible) comes out of the dead body and goes off either to heaven or to hell.

Just as the Judeo-Christian Bible does not support the hellfire dogma, it likewise does not teach that humans have an immortal soul that survives a person's physical death. This teaching of the immortal soul is another teaching copied from pagan religions by the Roman Catholics and grafted into their version of Christianity--after Jesus returned to heavenly life.

As a reminder, pagans are those who do not worship the God of the Judeo-Christian Bible. When the Protestants broke away from the Catholics during the Religious Reformation, they carried this false teaching with them in addition to other Roman Catholic teachings that are also false.

 

Revelation is one of the most astrological of all the Bible's books. The language sounds weird because it's full of astrological imagery and stories based on it. The ancients considered astrology to be "wisdom" and thought that our fate was written in the sky. Since astrology had given us the real benefit of time-keeping and agriculture, they were somewhat justified in this thinking, though obviously they took it all too far when they waxed religious about it.

And now future generations continue to take astrologically inspired stories seriously and literally. It's cringe-worthy.

 

Revelation also contains some elements of the Roman destruction of Jerusalem and Judea. It was meant to give hope that they would return to glory.

 

2X

For instance, in 380AD when the emperor of Rome decreed Universl Christianity and mandated the end of Paganism, he brought about a social cataclysm that inspired this prophecy:


Rev. 6:12 And I beheld, (in the days of Theodocius, who established the Holy Roman, Catholic, Apostolic Church), when he, (the Lamb of the tribe of Judah, the off-spring of the root of David;[Rev 5:5]), had opened the sixth seal of (scripture), and, lo, there was a great (sociological) earthquaqe (of institutionalized religious change); and the Sun (signs of Astrology) became (as) black as (the) sackcloth of (a nun's) hair, and the moon became as blood (of Christ, to determine the very day of the Christian Passover).

Rev. 6:13 And the stars' (twelve constellations of Sun Signs) of heaven fell (from popular grace) unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, (ruined), when she is (destructively) shaken of a mighty wind

Rev. 6:14 And (Astrology) departed (from popular practice) as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every (Pagan religion and secret society) were moved out of their places

Rev. 6:15 And (1) the kings of the earth, (POLITICIAN), and (2) the great men, (STATESMEN), and (3) the rich men, (ECONOMIC BARONS), and (4) the chief captains, (PRIESTHOODS), and (5) the mighty men, (MILITARY LEADERS), and (6) every bondman, (CRAFTSMAN), and (7) every free man, (PEASANT), hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks (of the pagan temples);

Rev. 6:16 And said to the mountains (of the previous social institutions) and rocks (of cultural norms), Fall on us, (help!), and hide us from the face (of Papal judgment) of Universal Catholicism), him that sitteth on the throne (Theodocius, who established Christian Rome) and from the (words of) wrath of the lamb, (the Word of the New Testament).

Rev. 6:17 For the great day of his wrath, the one thousand year reign predicted), is come; and who, (what other God or religion), shall be able to stand (during these Dark Ages).


Note, Catholic Encyclopedia:
With the overthrow of the old Roman Empire and the victory of Christianity, astrology lost its importance in the centers of Christian civilization in the West. The last known astrologer of the old world was Johannes Laurentius (sometimes called Lydus) of Philadelphia in Lydia, who lived A.D. 490-565

 

ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

The immortal soul dogma is unscriptural and is used to maintain the false teaching of hellfire. According to this falsehood, the "soul" survives the physical death of the person and continues to live in fiery torment. There are no scriptures in the Judeo-Christian Bible that support the teaching of an immortal soul that continues living after the person dies. The Bible makes it clear that the soul is the entire person and that when the person dies, it is the soul--the entire person--that actually dies.

"Look! All the souls--to me they belong. As the soul of the father so likewise the soul of the son--to me they belong. The soul that is sinning--it itself will die." (Ezekiel 18:4)

~***~​

 

ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

Literal eternal hellfire is not a Bible teaching. The Bible holds out two possibilities for mankind: (1) eternal death, or (2) everlasting life, as follows.

"For the wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord." (Romans 6:23)

As you can see from the above verse of scripture, there is nothing in between death and everlasting life. No mention is made of people being brought back to life for the sole purpose of literally torturing them in eternal hellfire.

 

Jesus spoke of hell more often than anything else.

 

I challenge you to present at least one verse of scripture where Jesus Christ spoke of literal hellfire.

 

Try Matthew 5:22 (KJV) = But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

 

Granny says, "Dat's right...

... dat's what's gonna happen...

... to all dem lefty, lib'ral...

... Bible-hatin', terrorist-sympathizin'...

... gay-supportin', yankee media types...

... if dey don't repent an believe onna Jesus."

 

ALTER2EGO -to- THE WYRD OF GAWD:
Why are you in this conversation at all? You are an atheist and could care less what the Bible says. Your sole intent is to rebut me and other theists for your personal amusement.

The scripture you quoted from Matthew 5:22 is figurative language. Not only that, the expression "hell fire" is a translation blunder in the King James Version. The correct word that belongs there is "Gehenna." In the Bible, "Gehenna" is figurative language for eternal destruction from which there is no resurrection.

BTW: I did bold the word "literal" when I gave the challenge that scripture be presented to prove literal hellfire. You presented a verse of scripture that is using figurative speech, meaning it's not literal.


Try again. You failed.

 

Hellfire has biblical precedent, at least in the NT, after Greek Hades and other newer ideas had come into play in the development of the mythology:

Mark 9:47-49
And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell,
where "'their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched.'
Everyone will be salted with fire.

Then there's good ol' Revelation:
Revelation 20:...
10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
...
14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

 

Since Christians freely declare which bits of the Bible are literal and which bits are metaphorical/allegorical according to their own whims, this doesn't seem quite fair to me.

 

So this is figurative speech as well? "That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment:"

Can you cite even one literal passage from the Bible? I seem to have problems finding one.