It's the debt ceiling again!

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by wgabrie, Feb 26, 2023.

  1. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's the debt ceiling again!

    I just ran across another news article today about how the Treasury is using extraordinary measures since the debt ceiling has been reached. Not relevant, but here's the article: Government Shutdown 2023: Will Social Security Payments Stop Now That the Debt Ceiling Has Been Reached? (msn.com)

    We know this.

    But what I'm worried about is that our Congress critters think that just because we haven't defaulted in the past with these stunts, that we won't default in the present or the future. So, they play games.

    Technically, we're already in default, and the Treasury is just cooking the books, deciding who gets paid and when.

    One of these days, the bill will finally come due before the estimated default date that extraordinary measures will take us to, and the government won't be able to pay it.

    Cue the end of the world as we know it.
     
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  2. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    The extraordinary measures have been going on for quite some time since we hit the debt limit a couple of months ago. But the Freedom Caucus is trying all sorts of ways to force a government shutdown. That is why they want 13 separate budget appropriation bills knowing that 11 of them will not pass the 60 vote requirement in the senate. It is also why the Freedom Caucus is against the budget reconciliation bill. It is also why they want the cuts before they agree to a debt ceiling crisis. The problem is the bills are coming due today on everything that has been passed and authorized but does nothing to prevent from this happening again. They are only cutting a penance in the budget that they can and will touch and most of that won't do a damn thing except keep their flock in line. And since they run the show and have McCarthy by the balls in that threat to oust him, here we are.
     
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  3. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Our current system is absurd, these budgets have been signed into law and these domestic terrorists use these to cause undue damage to the stability of the nation and the faith of our systems.

    If they don’t want to spend the money then they should not vote for the legislation that approves these bills in the first place. Republicans voting not to pay the credit card bill once the bill is due is typical of their way of governing by kicking the can down the road for someone else to handle.
     
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  4. Canell

    Canell Well-Known Member

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    Chill out, it will be like that till the end. You're right on that one. ;)
     
  5. PPark66

    PPark66 Well-Known Member

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    They don’t have McCarthy by the balls that’s the lazy media narrative. Take look at his actions over the past eighteen months. Then take a look at McConnell’s acts to insulate—isolate the rot—in the Senate.

    McCarthy is a nutter.
     
  6. Chrizton

    Chrizton Well-Known Member

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    We are not technically in a default. That does not happen until we don't pay off a bond when it matures. Anyway, if you are expecting a tax refund, file right now today. If you wait til April 15, you may not get it til Thanksgiving. That will be the first place they will start holding what cash they do generate.
     
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  7. wist43

    wist43 Banned

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    And yet none of you guys realize the debt is intentional, and that eventually crashing the system is perfectly logical from the standpoint of the Robber Barons??

    They deliberately crashed the stock market in 1929 and artificially created The Great Depression.

    They bought up companies and gained control of entire industries for pennies on the dollar - "crisis" is always good for those at the top.

    We're over $31 trillion in debt now, $181 trillion in unfunded mandates. Those numbers are scheduled to be about $44 trillion, and $235 trillion in 4 years.

    Of course the system is going to collapse, or I should say it is going to be deliberately collapsed - how anyone can think the future sunshine and rainbows is beyond me.

    De-Nile is a river in Egypt ;)
     
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  8. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I agree, at some point we will crash, no need to hurry it up though... as we are already past the point of no return
     
  9. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Then you tell us what the all-wise and knowing Democrats would do to fix the situation?
    Share with us their master plan.
     
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  10. wist43

    wist43 Banned

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    What's this, a liberal/progressive admitting that our out of control FedGov spending will end in disaster??

    You do realize that is a serious violation of the liberal code?? You're not ever supposed to admit any approaching the truth.

    Maybe your liberal brethren will let you off the hook because you say we should keep spending like crazy ;)
     
  11. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    of course, it will, are you admiting the right wants that to happen sooner than it needs too

    Trump alone caused 25% of the current debt in 4 years.... you think that is sustainable?

    just like a game of monopoly, eventually the rich own everything and a reset is needed - name any society that this
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2023
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  12. wist43

    wist43 Banned

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    I've been trying to stop you spendaholics for 40 years, now all of a sudden Trump (the boogeyman) is responsible, lol...

    We'll crash, you'll blame me, have me and other thought criminals thrown into gulags and worked to death.

    It's what authoritarians always do.
     
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  13. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    25% of the current US debt is Trump's, in just 4 years... crazy
     
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  14. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    He almost spent more in 4 years than the prior Democratic administration did in 8 and Biden has reduced the deficit each year.

    It’s fascinating to watch them act like this is the lefts fault.
     
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  15. wist43

    wist43 Banned

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    And Obama doubled it... so whoopedeedoo.

    Who is sitting in the White House is irrelevant, as the Executive has little control over the budget, and no control over the money supply and interest rates.

    The real power behind the throne is the FedRes and the international banking cartel.

    As long as they keep churning out "money" like a snow making machine on a ski slope, you'll be happy and tell everyone how great big government is, and how we need ever more spending programs.

    You're at the bottom ring of the fraud, but you still work for it.
     
  16. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    Well the treasury needs to print some money to keep a supply of bills handy for use in the economy.

    Perhaps a good question is what investments people can put their extra cash into that don't count as liquid money?

    Then, maybe, they can take some money out of circulation to ease inflation.
     
  17. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Trump raised the debt in 4 years almost as much as Obama did in 8 years

    the truth is... perception is reality... otherwise... money is not worth a thing (some on the right want to change that perception, which could bring down the whole house of cards), it's a dangerous game republicans are playing
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2023
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  18. Moonglow

    Moonglow Well-Known Member

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    The GOP loves to make debt and then refuses to pay for it.
     
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  19. wist43

    wist43 Banned

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    Yikes, lol... Republicans this and Democrats that, oh my!!!

    The leadership of both parties do the bidding of the Robber Barons, and the Democratic Party is wholly in bed with the banks, corporations, and the central banks.

    At least a few Republicans, who have exactly no power, are trying to fight them - no one in the Democratic Party is.

    Joe Biden, Barack Obama, George Bush, Mitch McConnell, Kevin McCarthy, Nancy Pelosi... they all work for the Robber Barons.

    Wake up.
     
  20. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    who is it you think are the heroes in this story - lol - enlighten us

    I noticed you didn't list trump as one of the bad actors
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2023
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  21. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    The perception government creates is that American money is worthless. This is created by unfettered spending and constantly raising debt limits.
    It's not created by the Republicans attempt to pass a bill that changes how budgets are passed. A bill that balances the budget today and in the future.
     
  22. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Republican raised the debt more under Trump in 4 years then ever before, in fact Trump's debt is 25% of the current debt

    republicans had 4 years to pass such a change, but under Trump they said... debt doesn't matter

    funny how Obama was President and debt mattered,
    then Trump was President and debt did not matter,
    now that Biden is President... debt maters again
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2023
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  23. Alwayssa

    Alwayssa Well-Known Member

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    Yes they do. If McCarthy does not toe the line, make do with the promises he made, such as giving Tucker Carlson the January 6th tapes, a single person can put forward a no confidence vote. With a slim majority and 20 or so Freedom Caucus members, McCarthy will be out of a job. the Democrats are certainly not going to help McCarthy, but neither would the Freedom Caucus. It is why Speaker McCarthy is the weakest Speaker in the history of the HOuse of Representatives and why for the first 6 weeks, not one bill to help the American citizen in this economic crisis has been either proposed or passed. None of the first bills in their agenda have a chance to pass and become law, but they are just cannon fodder for the 2024 election and nothing more.
     
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  24. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    There will be no bill balancing the budget. If you think there will be, you are dreaming and people have been misinforming you.

    McCarthy knows full well that he can't balance the budget, especially since the option of cutting entitlements was taken off the table during the state of the union address. Without deep cuts to SS, Medicare, defense... there will be NO balancing of the budget. And even IF we could balance the budget by making the required cuts, it would lead to an immediate deep recession, if not depression.

    Therefore, they will force a few cosmetics cuts here and there, mostly to things Republicans don't like (maybe the EPA and CDC?), so they can say the cut spending. This will have ZERO significant effect on the deficit.

    In conclusion: The math doesn't work out for balancing the budget. Give it a try and make a proposal, if you think it does. I'd be happy to discuss.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2023
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  25. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    Lol.
     

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