NFL Kneeling

Lol you realize that the 'string' is nothing but an extension of the 2016 results. By the way, I never give any president credit or blame for what happens to the economy in the first two -three years of his presidency. Its all either superficial short term stuff that does not matter, or a reflection long term patterns for which his predecessor is more responsible than he is. Obama gets what little credit/ blame a president can take, for at least another year or more because capital investment growth and borrowing patterns on which employment and pricing and inflation numbers are dependent, are a long term response to economic policy and pressures that take years to plan for and change plans for.

Again I notice that you do NOT and will not judge Trump based on his character or integrity or the liberities he takes in his campaign or in office. In a peculiar twist, I am supposed to live by a moral code and behave in an 'honorable way' that he need not worry about. My character is compromised for engaging in the same behavior that does not seem to compromise the leader of the free world. You have not quite explained this sanctimonious and hypocritical stance. Might I convince you to address his moral code, his sense of honor and decency as reflected in his statements and behavior either before or since election? Do you need more quotes to compare how he treats his political opposition with seven microphones or the entire internet global media recording and documenting his vicious and personal attacks to mine on this lowly forum? Where is the outrage at Trumps 'liberties', sir?

 

First it was 40 years ago

Second, neither you or i was there and its only your extream hate toward trumn now that causes you to assume he dodged the draft

And third, liberals are the ones talking ut of both sides of their mouths since 40 years ago when they celibrated known draft dodgers and even elected one to be president

 

You are very hyper and full of hate for those who disagree with you on the issues

And hiding behind a phony cloak of non partisanship will not fool anyone except yourself

 

Actually trump has changed his tone since taking office

Yes he continues to call out members of congress and the extreamly bias liberal press and they resent it mightily

But I don't think that excuses them trying to undermine trump's ability to govern by trying to destroy him personally

Because they are also hurting America when they do that

And that goes double for the unpatriotic black NFL and guilt-ridden white players woh are teaching an entrier generation of black children to hate white people

 

Thats the result of mixing politics with sports

It can ruin a teams concentration and unity

And if it can happen to the Raiders it can affect other teams and their fans also

 

They do insult the flag because the requirement is to stand and face the flag

Their intent is to show disrespect by taking a knee ust as Kaepernick explained

 

I agree, you wouldn't think that needed to be explained to people.

 

Ok, fair enough, and that's true. You can't justify even hillary clinton as being worse than trump, there's just no real way without massively motivated reasoning. All of that being said, even if somehow you could justify clinton being worse, here is the main point:

If you are not many many many times more disgusted with trump than you are with kapernik and his ilk, then your outrage at nfl players is not real, or at least not honest. Your patriotism is limited to situations that are convenient to you.

The vitriol exists because of this. People are insisting the sky is green, then wonder why others are so exasperated.

 

This guy thinks trump was a draft dodger 40 years ago and for him thats when time stopped

In fact we don't know if trump was fit for duty or not and never will know

But Kaepernick and other NFL players are insulting the nation based on damn lies and that we do know

 

"Lol you realize that the 'string' is nothing but an extension of the 2016 results".

I see you no nothing whatsoever about investing or the economy. Ignorance of that is not offensive. Acting like you knew what you were talking about is.

 

I understand where you are coming from, however, I think it is unreasonable to to imagine anything on here is "helping." This is just catharsis. I don't think anybody here is really changing anybody's mind.

In the interest of full disclosure, you are right, there are plenty of good people who support trump. But they are wrong and bad at thinking. I don't mind yelling at them for it. I also am not wrong.

I understand people get their feelings hurt, but, that's too bad and I'm perfectly ok with shaming people for their fake patriotism.

Also, I have a family member who is married to an absolute loser. He's terrible in almost every way and every one knows it. And deep down she knows it too, and it's clearly killing her. The problem is she has argued about it with her parents and will never give them the satisfaction of letting them know they are right. So, she will keep destroying her life so she doesn't have to admit she was wrong. trump voters know they were wrong, but I don't see them ever admitting it even to themselves.

 

We don't know lol, there are lot's of things we weren't there for. We don't know that OJ wasn't the real killer, it's just overwhelmingly unlikely that he wasn't. It takes a lot of motivated reasoning to imagine he didn't buy his way out. There is nothing more certain than the fact that trump lies.

If you are ok with draft-dodging, and service to the country is unimportant to you, how about his comparison of going to school to military service, and the sacrifice of families that have lost loved ones? How about calling POW's (and by extension anyone killed captured or wounded in the line of duty) losers. How about equating morally the United States and russia?

This is not about liberals, this is about trump, and anyone pretending patriotism is important to them but trump is ok.

 

Reality says, the issue was ongoing before Trump said anything, Right?

 

So you are telling us that everyone who got a dratt deferment was a dratt dodger?

If so thats a very narrow view of a proud liberal tradition

I happen to think universal military service is a good idea but thats not how it was then or now

 

Nope. You're wrong yet again.
But i can see how you think that for i am that way towards most of your posts. For you belong in the far alt right group and i do post in the opposition to you.

But when i post to nornal people i am very much to the middle.
I care little for how people want to live or think. Just let people be as long as it isn't infringing on another.

Far alt right/left don't want that. The fringe wants all to do and say as they do. And view anyone different as the enemy. Even if they live next door.

 

Plenty were legitimate, his wasn't. He's fine. I'm not pretending liberal draft dodgers were patriots either.

 

The difference is the alt left is mainstream Democrats where as the alt right is a tiny fringe group.

 

Well to begin with, who is worse - Trump or Hillary - is purely subjective. This isn't North Korea. In our society, we may hold different opinions and values, and those differences affect the way we judge our political leaders.

Now as for your "main point", who disgusts me more - Kaepernik or Trump - that, too, falls into that subjective category.

But I can tell you this ... Before Trump made his comments about the kneelers, I was disgusted with them. I made comments about it here on PF. And before Trump said what he said, I knew that if I were the NFL owner of Kaepernik's team, I would have taken a hard line with him. I would have told him that he was to stand respectfully for the anthem, and, if he wouldn't, I wouldn't play him, I wouldn't renew his contract, and I would trade him if I could. I wouldn't even have him suit up for a game. I'd pay him according to his contract until I could get rid of him. But I would also let him know that he could say and do whatever he pleased on his own time, and he would receive no repercussions from me. I would encourage him to exercise his free speech rights off the field to his heart's content, but not on the field.

My value is that respect for the anthem and the flag transcends the politics and issues of the day. Accordingly, I would not permit a player to take a knee during the anthem for any other issue either. For example, if a conservative player wanted to take a knee during the anthem to protest all the abortions performed in this country, I would not allow that either. I would be perfectly consistent. That time and place is just the wrong time and place for a protest. It is a time to reflect upon all of those Americans, both past and present, who have sacrificed, fought, and worked to establish, preserve, and protect this country. It's not about us or our issues. It is a time for humility and gratitude.

Now, if we're unsatisfied or angry at our country for some reason, then give voice to it by all means. But let's not do it in a way that disrespects those who came before us, who gave so much to all of us. Those two minutes or so are their time, not our time.

As for Trump ... Sure, he's offended me in the past. I could give examples.

As for Trump's remarks about the kneelers, I wouldn't have said "sonsabitches", but I otherwise give him credit for having the balls to give voice to something that every other politician in America was afraid to give voice to. I'll bet he even gave voice to a lot of NFL players, coaches, and owners who were just keeping their mouths shut.

A while back, Trump visited Walter Reed Army Hospital in Bethesda, MD, and awarded a Purple Heart to one of our soldiers who was an amputee after getting shot in Afghanistan. I can tell you from personal experience that being among our wounded in a place like that changes you forever. This is where you find out about such things as courage, honor, dedication, respect, and patriotism that you never knew before. Oh, you may have thought you knew about these things, but it's not until after an experience like this that you really know.

Compared to these young men, Kaepernik is nothing. He is not courageous. He's not respectful. He's not patriotic. And he knows nothing about humility or honor. I see him as a self-absorbed, spoiled rich kid seeking attention.

I am not alone in that perception.

Seth

 

Nope. But alt right would see it that way.

 

Maxine waters is the new hero of snow flakes so an entire generation is alt left .

 

I wondered why the NFL basically had no response to the kneeling.
Imo, perhaps a greater outlash?
Sponsors will determine a response.
I am not aware of sponsors leaving yet.

 

I know this much - I used to be glued to the TV when a football game was on.

Since Belicek and Kraft allowed twenty players to take a knee, I have not watched a single NFL game - and I will never again watch the NFL.

 

And yet you demand that the "fringe" agree with you or else you will get hyper

You are just as much on the fringe as the people you go ballistic over

 

Doubtful.
About as much as the alt right dude in Alabama.

 

You don't know that

All you are doing is picking and choosing your outrage from 40 years ago based your politica today