Part 39 of Post Your Tough Questions Regarding Christianity

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Mitt Ryan, Oct 27, 2021.

  1. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

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    Obviously, you do not understand the concept of original sin adequately, let alone the Scriptures of the Holy Bible. If you had, then you would know that Jesus was sinless because He did not inherit a sin nature.

    How you became a Gospel preacher is bewildering. I guess your church was desperate and just threw in a guy who wasn't really qualified but then again there is this other explanation that maybe you weren't telling us the truth and so I have my doubts about what you claimed regarding your past personal history.

    But anyway, I know you've told us in the past that you studied outside the Bible and that's where you went wrong. Instead, you should have studied and read the many articles that my favorite Christian Ministry produces that thoroughly explains and answers all sorts of questions regarding God/Lord Jesus/Holy Bible. And as one notes, as you read their explanations, they always back up what they're saying by giving reference to where in Scripture their statements are supported.

    In this article I'm presenting, they answer the questions, "Was Jesus the biological son of Mary? If so, how did He not inherit a sin nature?"

    That Jesus was Mary’s biological son is a significant biblical assertion, and yet Jesus was without sin. The context for what has become known as “the virgin conception” begins in Genesis 3:15. God is judging the serpent for deceiving Eve, and God announces to him that He would put enmity between the serpent and the woman and between his seed and her seed. It is notable that this serpent is identified later as Satan (Revelation 12:9; 20:2), and it is perhaps surprising that the serpent would have “seed.” Perhaps even more surprising, the woman also has “seed” (Genesis 3:15). God further predicted that the seed of the woman would crush the serpent’s head, while the serpent (not the serpent’s seed) would crush the heel of this seed of Eve. Taken at face value, the text points forward to a specific seed—a biological descendent of Eve, but not a seed of Adam—to crush the serpent. In the process, the seed of the woman would receive a wound from the serpent.

    Next in this remarkable path toward Jesus being Mary’s biological son comes a prophecy in Isaiah that a virgin would be with child. While the child was still very young, God would give Judah victory over two oppressing kings (Isaiah 7:14–16). It is not clear in the immediate context whether that Hebrew term alma refers to a virgin or simply to a young woman, but it is clear that the prophecy was actually fulfilled by Jesus (Matthew 1:20–23). Jesus was indeed conceived in Mary (Matthew 1:20) and born of Mary (Matthew 1:21) while she was still a virgin (not simply a young woman). Matthew explicitly tells his readers that Joseph kept Mary a virgin until Jesus was born (Matthew 1:24–25). While we often refer to Jesus’ birth by Mary as the “virgin birth,” it is more accurate to understand that Jesus was both conceived in and born from Mary. She was His human mother, and Jesus was conceived in Mary by the Holy Spirit (Matthew 1:18, 20).

    It is significant that Jesus is Mary’s biological son but not Joseph’s for several reasons:

    First, as the biological son of only Mary, Jesus could fulfill the prophecy of Genesis 3:15—He was biologically of the seed of woman but not of the seed of man.
    Second, Jesus could fulfill the prophecy of Isaiah 7:14–16—He was actually born of a woman who was still a virgin. While this is, of course, humanly impossible, it is possible with God (Luke 1:37). The angel explained to Joseph how this would take place (Matthew 1:20–25). Jesus would be conceived by the Holy Spirit, and that would be one of the reasons Jesus would be recognized as the Son of God (Luke 1:35).

    Third, the fact that Jesus was not biologically descended from a man is important because Joseph was in the line of Coniah. God had declared that Coniah would not have a descendant rule on the throne of David (Jeremiah 22:24–30). While Jesus was legally Joseph’s son, He was not biologically descended from Joseph. Thus, Jesus was not from Coniah and could fulfill the Messianic prophecies without God breaking His word about Coniah’s descendants.

    Fourth, it is significant that Jesus was not the biological son of Adam because of humanity’s sinful nature. Jesus was and is a man, but He was not biologically descended from a father related to Adam—Jesus came not from a man but from a woman, by the Holy Spirit. Thus, Jesus was not made in the image and likeness of Adam, as were Adam’s sons (see Genesis 5:3).

    Adam had been given a direct command by God not to eat of the fruit of one particular tree (Genesis 2:16–17). When Adam and Eve disobeyed the command, Adam was held accountable for sin, resulting in the death of the human race (Romans 5:12, 17). Eve sinned as well, but she was not accountable in the same way, as she was deceived (1 Timothy 2:14). Adam was not deceived, as he had been given the instruction directly by God. God held Adam accountable for sin and the fall of mankind. It is significant, then, that Jesus was the seed of Eve and the biological son of Mary. He did not possess the image and likeness of Adam as did Adam’s other sons. He possessed the image of the invisible God (Colossians 1:15). All other men bore Adam’s image, which was stained with sin, but Jesus—by virtue of the conception by the Holy Spirit—did not. In fact, Paul contrasts Jesus with Adam in Romans 5, explaining that Adam brought death, but Jesus brought life (Romans 5:15–19).

    While the Bible doesn’t provide the details of how the Holy Spirit conceived Jesus in Mary, it is clear that Jesus was born while Mary was still a virgin. That Jesus was Mary’s biological son and Joseph’s legal but not biological son is important and helps us understand how Jesus is able to be a sinless sacrifice for our sins. Jesus didn’t have a sin nature, and He never sinned, so He could pay for the sin of others. He alone was righteous. If He had been made in Adam’s likeness and image, Jesus would have had His own sin to deal with. But through the miracle of the virgin conception, Jesus remained qualified to be our Savior—the perfect, sinless, sacrifice for sin on our behalf.

    https://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-son-of-Mary.html

    Ok thanks trev for your post, I hope now you thoroughly understand why Lord Jesus was indeed sinless after reading this thoroughly in-depth explanation given by my favorite Christian Ministry.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2023
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  2. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    I'm content to know the goodness, charity, and divinity of Gods spirit. So I'm not impressed with Satan. Neither do I care what he knows. It is irrelevant to me. God has provided my foundation in his time. So too hopefully my crown at his leisure, should it please him. And his pleasure will be mine to his glory. This is in keeping with all gospel principles. So I don't care if it offends the world or the adversary.
     
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  3. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    There is no evidence of sin. Sinless is the requirement of a perfect sacrifice. His baptism is an example to mankind who are sinful.

    The holy spirit reveals that which is necessary to salvation and understanding.

    He comes quickly in their hour of need. That they perished is no indication of losing their crowns. That after them there was a falling away and a reconstituting of the Church of man masquerading as God does not reflect on the former. My religion is founded on God restoring his gospel and authority thru Joseph Smith.
     
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  4. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    and with that your avoidance and deflection from your previous folly is complete. You were the one yammering on about Satan .. calling others all kinds of names .. running around crying "You don't know God" .. but you are the one who can't name the God you worship .. one second stating the Bible is worthless the next quoting scripture.

    Now you are talking "gospel Principles" ?? What principles from the Gospel .. the book you claimed was worthless in terms of being Gods word ...and on what basis have these princples you call worthless been your foundation ? and who is this God we all don't know ... and how can we get to know him .. ?
     
  5. trevorw2539

    trevorw2539 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There's no evidence of miracles either. There's no evidence of a 'Holy Spirit'. And Joseph Smith's experiences were witnessed by no-one.

    Mohammed claimed that his religion was the new religion. So have many others. The fact is you can believe what you like but it doesn't mean it is true. Like many Americans who believe in Trump but have never read his history and accept what he says as 'gospel'. It's called scamming.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2023
  6. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    The world is filled with counterfeits and knock offs. It takes nothing away from authenticity. It is said also that Satan can appear as an angel of light, that one should try the spirit and test the fruit, and beware of wolves in sheeps clothing. Btw, a dozen or more saw and testified to many of the same things as Joseph Smith. Some saw Moroni, others saw the plates, others heard Gods voice speaking, others saw and heard all three. And though some fell away from the Church, they never denied their testimonies, and some returned to the Church. It is not so cut and dry. Still it is as you say a matter of belief without the testimony of the spirit.
     
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  7. trevorw2539

    trevorw2539 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What a load of tripe. Jesus was of Mary's flesh. Impregnated by the Holy Spirit of not her flesh was inherited from her parents.

    If true, then what is Jeconiah doing in the genealogy of Jesus in Matthew’s gospel? And how can Jesus qualify to be the Messiah? First of all, we have to wonder why Matthew would ever have included Jeconiah among the ancestors of Jesus if this so obviously disqualified Jesus from being the Messiah. In fact, the Scripture shows that the curse was only short-term, if not altogether reversed by God.

    There are three parts to the curse on Jeconiah (who is also called Jehoiachin or Coniah):

    • that he would be childless (this is how the Hebrew text literally reads)
    • that he would not prosper in his lifetime
    • that none of his descendants would rule in Judah
    The Scripture shows that in fact none of these took place.

    • Though the Hebrew literally reads, “Record this man childless,” Jeconiah in fact had children.
      The descendants of Jehoiachin the captive: Shealtiel his son, Malkiram, Pedaiah, Shenazzar, Jekamiah, Hoshama and Nedabiah
      — 1 Chronicles 3:17-18

    • He did prosper in his day.
      In the thirty-seventh year of the exile of Jehoiachin king of Judah, in the year Evil-Merodach became king of Babylon, he released Jehoiachin from prison on the twenty-seventh day of the twelfth month. He spoke kindly to him and gave him a seat of honour higher than those of the other kings who were with him in Babylon.
      — 2 Kings 25:27-28

    • His grandson Zerubbabel prospered and ruled. In fact the same words God used in rejecting Jeconiah were deliberately used in establishing Zerubbabel.
      “As surely as I live,” declares the LORD, “even if you, Jehoiachin son of Jehoiakim king of Judah, were a signet ring on my right hand, I would still pull you off.
      — Jeremiah 22:24

      “‘On that day,’ declares the LORD Almighty, ‘I will take you, my servant Zerubbabel son of Shealtiel,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will make you like my signet ring, for I have chosen you,’ declares the LORD Almighty.”
      — Haggai 2:23
    Though Zerubbabel did not sit on the throne as king, the fact that Haggai 2:23 uses the same terminology as Jeremiah 22:24 shows that Haggai intended to indicate a reversal of the curse.

    We have to conclude that in Jeremiah 22:30, “in his lifetime” qualifies the following phrases, and “for” explains that no descendant of his will prosper and rule during his lifetime.

    GotQuestions referring back to Adam is irrelevant. No-one - even many Christians, accept the story is made up. That shows how dated these websites are.

    It is not clear in the immediate context whether that Hebrew term alma refers to a virgin or simply to a young woman, but it is clear that the prophecy was actually fulfilled by Jesus (Matthew 1:20–23)

    It's not clear at all. It's simply what the Gospel writer wanted you to believe.

    While the Bible doesn’t provide the details of how the Holy Spirit conceived Jesus in Mary, it is clear that Jesus was born while Mary was still a virgin.

    It's not clear at all. It is simply what the Gospel writer wanted you to believe.

    the girl was very beautiful, a virgin (בְּתּוּלָה), and no man had had any relations with her” Genesis 24:16 בְּתּוּלָה Bethula = virgin. This term applies to any woman of any age.
    Isaiah uses the Hebrew word the Almah (הָעַלְמָה) the young woman.
    He knew the difference and used the right words. Christianity has simply taken the recognised mistake of the LXX and used it for its own purpose.

    Isaiah reference is at the time when 2 Kings threatening Jerusalem, and Ahaz is terrified. Isaiah asks Ahaz to test God but Ahaz refuses to test God by requesting a specific sign. Isaiah then names the sign that God would give to Ahaz. That sign is that a woman who was already pregnant would soon give birth to a male, and that child was the sign for Ahaz. A sign is not a miracle but points to something. When Ahaz saw the child he would be reminded of God's promise. While the child was still young those two kings would be destroyed. And they were. It has nothing to do with Jesus.

    I suggest you do some real study of the OT for yourself. Prophecy for 800 years time is pointless as I've said before.

    As I've pointed out to you time and again Matthew simply made up the Nativity story from misinterpreted OT scriptures.

    PROVE ME WRONG Does Hosea 11:1 mention Jesus. The Hebrew OT does not say that the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem. Just that he would come from there. Nor does it say he was from eternity. Show me how Joseph and family were in Egypt and Nazareth at the same time.

    Of course you doubt my story. You are stuck in your own - and GotQuestions - rut from which you cannot escape. The horse is in control.
     
  8. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    "The world is filled with counterfeits and knock offs"

    Can say that again .. those who wish to substitute man made dogma for The-Word of the Logos .. ( the Word of God ) would be a fine example and you need Look no further than the Mirror .. and hearken to the words of Jesus ... take log out of own eye.

    "It is said by Smith" you say .. others say Koresh .. others Muhammad .. but why do you not hearken to what Christ has to say ... and thus turn away from the Truth as you say .. "Satan can appear as an angel of Light" .. such as "Moroni" for Satan has great power .. a God in his own right .. Son of the Supreme one .. as is his half Brother the Son of Man..

    but you deny the Holy Scripture from the mouth of our Lord - in favor of the musings of men ... such as beloved Paul .. who says Hitler is your Master .
     
  9. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    Appearing as an Angel of light isn't the same as actually being an Angel sent from Gods throne. Besides, the first personages that Smith saw were God the Father and his Son Jesus Christ when Smith went to the woods to pray to know which Church to join. Moroni came at a later date. Latter Day Saints believe that Moroni is the Angel whom John saw while in the spirit in the book of Revelation, flying in the midst of heaven in the last days "having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,.."

    That said, Smiths testimony isn't my testimony. Mine, by Gods spirit, is that God lives and the LDS Missionaries are his servants. By this I know that everything about the LDS Church is true, including the Bible. I am not a fanboy. My testimony comes from God. Not from sophistry, scripture, emotion, reason, surmising, conclusion, science, or anything of this world or the underworld. God sent his spirit to me in strength sufficient to cause me to recognize and remember him, to then show me in vision that missionaries are his servants, and filled my heart with peace, cleared the table of my soul, and filled my mind with light. Now you can say I'm deluded, unhinged, imaginary, brainwashed, or whatever you need to think to not take me at my word as if it were too much to bear. But I tell you as I would a Brother or friend, the truth.
     
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  10. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    "My testimony comes from God" - Thanks for your honesty mate but that is straight up heresy. You are claiming to be the Logos ..emmissary between man and God .. your words supplanting the words of Jesus in Scripture..

    but who am I to argue that you are a modern day prophet as you claim .. like you I too met God .. but unfortunately he did not tell me about you .. so I will have to take your word for it.

    If what you claim is true .. and indeed you have God on speed dial .. and thus can answer questions directly from God .. tell us who Jesus was crying out to on the Cross "My God .. My God .. Why have you Forsaken me" .. Who is the God of Jesus .. and why did this God forsake him ?
     
  11. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

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    Why would I, a Christian expect a non-Christian such as yourself to interpret anything in Scripture correctly and so it's not surprising to witness your reaction that is really unwarranted.

    Those words you got all upset about originated from verse 14 of the Book of Isaiah Chapter 29 titled, "A Message about Jerusalem" And the Apostle Paul used those particular words in his passage of "The Wisdom of God" from 1 Corinthians Chapter 1 verse 19.

    And so essentially what you're doing is taking a verse out of context only to get an incorrect message. You are just like your brother Gawd who has a bad habit of taking verses out of context only to come away with an incorrect message in other words misinterpreting what is being read.

    Ask yourself Gift while looking in the mirror, "Who is really the moron here?"

    What?...did you think God was going to destroy the wisdom of all wise people? You need not worry Gift; I mean you don't fall into that category...lol...relax...j/k Gift.

    Furthermore, on a serious note who are you to tell us what Scripture is from God and not from God. Did God reveal to you personally what is from Him and what is not from Him? Truth is, all Scripture is inspired by God. And all of His prophets like the two here, Isaiah and Paul wrote down what God wanted to tell mankind.

    We Read in Scripture:

    20 Above all, you must realize that no prophecy in Scripture ever came from the prophet’s own understanding, 21 or from human initiative. No, those prophets were moved by the Holy Spirit, and they spoke from God. 2 Peter 1:20-21 NLT

    16 All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives. It corrects us when we are wrong and teaches us to do what is right. 17 God uses it to prepare and equip his people to do every good work. 2 Timothy 3:16-17 NLT

    Exactly, I wholeheartedly agree with your statement Brother Injeun. The Apostle Paul was a prophet of God and so what the Apostle Paul tells us in Scripture comes from God.

    So true indeed because the truth is, Gift is not a believer of the Christian God. He doesn't believe in the Holy Bible, calls it for the most part, "Man-made dogma".

    Well said, I couldn't agree with you more. This is not the first time Gift has judged the Apostle Paul in a negative way. There are other disparaging words he used against the prophet of God the Apostle Paul.

    Gift said posting writings of the Apostle Paul is nonsense, then he goes on to say like he truly knows it as fact that the Apostle Paul never met Lord Jesus. How does he know? I mean it's possible that he did meet Lord Jesus. But anyway, below is what the Gift said:

    And below is what I said to Gift in my response:

    If only the Gift would heed his own words from the past such as what he said below:

    Ok thanks Brother Injeun and Gift for your posts.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2023
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  12. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    What a joke of a post - Why would I expect a uneducated CHINO and disciple of the deception "such as yourself" to interpret anything in scripture correctly ? someone who has no idea what logical fallacy is and thinks name calling is an argument for something.

    You are not a Christian Brother Mitt .. who are you trying to Kid ? You are a CHINO -- Christian in Name only. You are not a follower of Christ .. you run from the teachings of Jesus .. try and supplant those teachings with man Made Dogma from your Idol Martin.

    Jesus warns about the Wolves in Sheeps clothing such as yourself -- Matt 7:15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them.

    Your fruit is deception and falsehood .. you are not a follower of Jesus .. you have consistently run from his teachings .. in to the loving arms of man made dogma .. you worship not the Christ but your Idol Martin .. and have no idea the name of your God.

    What can we expect from someone runs around crying "believe in God" .. but can't tell us which God is being referred to ? You talked about Morons but, is this not moronic behavoir ? Would I not be a moron to listen to such a person ?

    You call yourself a Christian .. but can not tell me the name of the God of Christianity ? What kind of a pathetic Christian is that ?
     
  13. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

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    No trev, it was a load of truth that was presented. But I get it, you're in denial of the truth.

    True, He was of Mary's flesh but not of Joseph's flesh...are you following so far?

    Huh? Sorry but I don't quite understand what you're saying because apparently, it's incoherent. That's what happens when you get all riled up emotionally, you tend to garble up your language to the point it becomes incoherent to the reader.

    But anyway, let me repeat what was presented in my previous post below:

    It's true, for a Christian anyway.

    Ah...because he is part of the lineage. Let's not forget, what we are seeing in Matthew 1:1-17 is the lineage, starting with Abraham with Jeconiah somewhere in there and ending with Joseph, who was Mary's husband.

    Having Jeconiah among the ancestors does not disqualify Lord Jesus from being the Messiah. Obviously, you have misinterpreted what was presented to you. So let me present it again the portion that you misunderstood below:

    Did you get it now trev after reading the above very carefully and slowly so as to not miss any key words?

    But you know trev, it's rather obvious with all these questions of yours, you did not fully understand the well written out, methodical and thorough in-depth explanation given by my favorite Christian Ministry.

    But let me repeat once again, through the power of Almighty God, Lord Jesus was conceived in Mary by the Holy Spirit (see Matthew 1:18, 20).

    The virgin birth, in bypassing a human father, circumvented the transmission of the sin nature and allowed Lord Jesus the Messiah to be a sinless man.

    Ok thanks trev for your post, I hope I shined some light here to help you understand what you didn't understand before. You can have the last word but as far as I'm concerned, I'm done here and got to move on to other questions/comments posed to me.
     
  14. trevorw2539

    trevorw2539 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You've simply shown yourself up again. You've ignored all the important points. If you study the OT, Isaiah is not pointing to Jesus. His actions were related to the time. You're simply taking verses out of context yourself. Something you tell others not to do.

    There is nothing related to Mary, Joseph, Jesus in the OT. It is all Christian misunderstanding/misuse of the OT.

    You can't even deny that as you completely ignore my questions. Now we have the excuse - again - of 'moving on to other questions posed to you'.

    What else can we expect from someone so ignorant of scripture.
     
  15. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    "Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
    And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.
    I receive not honour from men.
    But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you." (Jesus Christ) John 5:39-42
     
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  16. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Isn't that one of the statements wherein Jesus denied the OT?

    He changed the rules, leaving Judaism following a false road to heaven, even to today.
     
  17. trevorw2539

    trevorw2539 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have searched the scriptures, that's why I said categorically what I said. You really ought to read and study the Jewish OT .
    If you've read my posts and bothered to check them, you would see the problems for Christianity's claims.
     
  18. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    You said that there is nothing in the OT related to Jesus. Jesus who was a Jew, said the scriptures testify of him. What am I missing here?
     
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  19. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    Are you saying that Judaism is false? If so, I would agree with you. As I read it, he is saying that there is no salvation in the scriptures. And that salvation is in him and the Father. But by the Jews loving the scriptures, they had no love for or relationship with the living God, even while he stood before them.
     
  20. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Well, the idea that there was no salvation throughout the history of Judaism makes no sense. Nor does it make sense to claim that the OT characters we know from the Bible were denied salvation.

    So, I'm suggesting that Judaism can not be claimed to be a false religion.

    Jesus arrived and clearly tried to change Judaism. He accomplished a major division of belief, leaving Jews of the time to make a choice between the Bible of the time and the claims of an individual claiming to be God on Earth.
     
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  21. trevorw2539

    trevorw2539 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Christian doctrine
     
  22. trevorw2539

    trevorw2539 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Let me expand my answer. I don't believe for one moment that everything in the Gospels is true. Many of the words spoken by Jesus would not have come from a Jew. I have already shown the Nativity stories to have been made up and cobbled together from misinterpreted OT Scriptures and going against the laws of Rome and Jewish customs of the time. No Jew would have said he was THE SON OF GOD. That he was A son of God was acceptable as all Jews claimed to be sons of God from the OT where God calls Israel his son. No Jew believed in a vicarious sacrifice. They were responsible for their own sins.
    The Gospel writers added words to Jesus mouth to suit their own
    beliefs.'Matthews'Sermon on the Mount' given by Jesus is 3 chapters long. 'Matthews' Gospel was written at least 50 years after Jesus death. 'Matthew' remembered this word for word after 5 decades? We know Matthews genealogy is wrong. The 'temptation' of Jesus was simply a fanciful story. Miracles? Bodies rising from the dead and scaring their relatives in Jerusalem. There were many Roman soldiers in Jerusalem as this was Passover and it was known often to be a troublesome time from AntiRoman Jews, particularly Zealots. Not a mention of this 'astonishing' walk of resurrected bodies by the Romans. The veil of the Temple rent 'in twain'.

    Like the BOM, Quran etc. blind belief is preferred than actual credibility.
     
  23. Mitt Ryan

    Mitt Ryan Well-Known Member

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    You're not missing anything Brother Injeun, it's trev who is missing the boat. He's trying to make the argument that the OT and NT are not compatible with each other that they don't complement one another which is just displaying his inability to thoroughly understand what's written in the Scriptures of the Holy Bible. The Word of God encompasses both the OT as well as the NT. He can't even admit to all the prophecies that have come to pass. The fact is, there are over 300 messianic prophecies in the Old Testament regarding the Messiah— Lord Savior Jesus Christ—many involving His death and resurrection. Most of these prophecies were given hundreds or even thousands of years before Lord Jesus was born; yet we see that He fulfilled all of them.

    Hosea 11:1 is just one example of a Messianic prophesy that trev has a hard time understanding. Well Matthew, one of Lord Jesus' disciples fully understood this prophesy as we note in Matthew 2:14-15.

    We Read in Scripture:

    The Lord’s Love for Israel
    11 “When Israel was a child, I loved him,
    and I called my son out of Egypt. Hosea 11:1 NLT

    14 That night Joseph left for Egypt with the child and Mary, his mother, 15 and they stayed there until Herod’s death. This fulfilled what the Lord had spoken through the prophet: “I called my Son out of Egypt.”[a] Matthew 2:14-15 NLT

    Footnotes
    a. 2:15 Hos 11:1.

    Here trev this is just a reminder for you, the once claimed Gospel preacher.

    The Holy Bible may look like one book, but it is actually sixty-six rolled into one. Thirty-nine books make up what we call the Old Testament, and twenty-seven make up the New Testament. God used many authors....as many as forty...over a time-period of many centuries to write the sixty-six books of the Bible. This makes each book unique. But even though each book has its own style and character, each one contributes to God's life-changing message. What is that message? Through the Bible, God makes it clear that He loves us and has a plan to save us from the destructive power of sin.

    Atheists such as trev want no part of God's love, want no part of God's plan, they rather live with their filthy disgusting sins until they take their last breath of air and become bug food. That's what I've heard some atheists say...they die and become bug food...wow!...so sad for anyone to have an attitude such as that.

    Ok thanks Brother Injeun and trev for your posts.
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2023
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  24. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    So the Prophets over the course of four thousand years, Jesus Christ, and his Apostles who knew him and lived with him, didn't know what they were saying or doing, and/or were being deceptive. But you, two thousand years after the fact, do know all about the matter, and dismiss it all as hearsay, deception and frivolity. You believe that it is all fakery, that there is no God, that we come or evolve from monkeys, and will live and die for no greater purpose than that, which is to live and die. It is sort of a "we are that we are" mantra. This is hauntingly familiar to Moses name for God which he told to the Jews...I am that I am.
     
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  25. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    I'd like to amend my words. I think that Judaism was just and true. But that it ran it's course and was superseded by Jesus Christ.
     
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