Please help me understand why some people are refusing to get vaccinated against COVID-19.

Thanks for clarifying that.

I'm in IL and our in-home caregivers were given priority with first responders.

 

Now you make crap up. What does a walking spite protein factory mean and how is a spike protein toxic. Eleuthera having an opinion is one thing, spewing nonsense is another. Back up what you say or move on.

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-vaccine-safe-idUSL2N2NX1J6

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-covid19-shedding-idUSL2N2OB1OX

https://health-desk.org/articles/wh...of-spike-proteins-made-from-covid-19-vaccines

https://www.factcheck.org/2021/07/s...ike-protein-is-safe-contrary-to-viral-claims/

https://healthfeedback.org/claimrev...ection-and-vaccination-misrepresents-studies/

 

Yer welcome and I hope you agree that makes sense in terms priority. I have a good friend in Florida who is an emergency physician and she got Covid 19 because she did not get the shot yet but was treating so many. Yah the military has no choice given the obvious security implications. There was of course special concern on the large aircraft carriers which are floating cities really you can imagine what an outbreak would do on a carrier.

By the way the labour law legal precedent saying once a drug is FDA approved can be mandated in the work place is American case law. In Canada we have a Charter of Rights with a clause similiar in wording to your consititution that allows freedom of choice especially for religious reasons that can allow one to refuse treatment for example.

The problem also is we have a section 1 clause never interpreted that says if the government can show the greater needs of the public trumps the individual rights the law requiring something could be justified. So far our courts have only interpreted our Charter of Rights to support individual rights never curtail them. So like the US if and when an employer mandates you take a vaccine to be able to return the work so we may very well see constitutional challenges just like you may have them in the US once certain emloyers mandate them. If the employer does not mandate them in theory the employer is resposible for safe work place which means they must take precautions to check for immunity othewrwise a person who catches Covid 19 at work could see them for failing to take precautions to assure a safe work place. On the other hand if they do someone may argue it infringes on their constitutional rights and that could take anywhere from 1-5 years to decide. In the interim what happens?

Its complex. On the one hand do we want unvaccinated people working in hospitals or old age homes. Well an employee might argue it goes against their religion. Well the law might say ok then, do not take the shot, no one can force you to, but don't expect to continue or return to any job where you put people at risk. Its going to be a balancing act and its not going to be easy.

I think on this one what the US Supreme Court decisions do depending on their timing and due to the newness of this issue will have weight in other common law country nations too. Its new law for all of us.

 

This whole controversy is bullshit beyond belief. I truly cannot credit that we have this fatal disease that literally turns most of us into bloody Typhoid Marys and we let people refuse to get vaccinated against it. If this was Ebola or plague with that asymptomatic carrier feature you'd have flying squads going door to door who would simply shoot you dead if you refused the vaccine because god curse your rights it's you or us. Well that IS the present situation and eventually we WILL get a nearly totally fatal variant if this keeps on and I guess that's what all you anti-vaxers really want anyway since then all your fantasies about evol gubmint will come true

 

I can definitely see how this is so multi-layered. Look at all the changes in recommendations since COVID arrived in our countries. I tested positive in November (I think it was a false positive because I had ZERO risk or exposure) and the Health Department rep. outright told me that she can't speak to what happens after I self-quarantine for 14 days because things are "changing daily".

It very well could be that X number of changes and official recommendations and rules will change many, many times before a case could even make it onto the court docket.

I really hope we can all learn something from this so our descendants aren't floundering in the dark for months on end trying to keep the world spinning during the next pandemic.

 

You "don't want the pharmaceutical industy or the govt Fing with it" means what? That you fear pharmaceutical companies and government? You fear they invented the info they gave you? You fear that? What about your own doctor, a public health nurse? You fear them? You fear pharmacists? You fear what exactly because someone who says they simply don't want to be Fked with means what? What are you afraid will happen that should not?

Stop taking around the fear. You fear the damn vaccine. I get it. But that fear is it justified? You really think exposing yourself to the virus and spreading it for that matter when you can cut down the spread is reasonable? You think you are an island and your decision does not impact on others? Would you be ok getting the virus and speading it to others and having them die? How about you? You have any responsibility if you catch the virus and taking up valuable medical space for a virus that would not have required hospitalization had you taken the vaccine? What if the space you took up which was avoidable meant someone else died because of your decision?

Do you not see any consequences to your choices other than to your own immediate need?

 

Wow and well stated thank you.

 

Nonsense. Those words specifically addressed the facts you ignore and directly repudiate what you said. You also again engage in illogical conclusions. The fact that hydroxy is licensed under a different section of the EUA does not mean the vaccines were passed under an emergency measure precisely because hydroxy was touted by your President as a CURE for Covid 19 and endangered millions of Americans and people around the world picking up on his absolutely irresponsible statement. I also never argued not what was given to you said the EUA process was designed to cut short the safety precautions, in fact it says the exact opposite. At least take the opportunity to read what you are given before you mistate it.

Good God man read the damn label before you take hydroxy. You clearly do not take the time to read.

 

You can lead a horse to water…

 

All that can still happen if I take the vaccine. Im already unlikely to be injured from covid. I dont see being even less likely to be injured from covid but more likely to be inujured by the vaccine as acceptable risk management. And yes, I think many doctors, pharmacists, and govt officials are either lying or have been lied to about both the effectiveness and the safety of the vaccine, and no I cant prove it, but I dont need proof to exercise caution, nor do I need your approval.

 

Many people are not taking the vaccine because they no longer trust politicians, health experts and the MSM.
You just have to wonder why. Don't you?

 

Your reasoning that there is less risk getting Covid 19 then taking the vaccine is nonsensical. Your paranoia about pharmacists, government officials and doctors is illogical.

You also stated something completely irrational. You say on the one hand you have no proof that any of these people are lying to believe they are lying but you don't need proof. Well you have proof. You have proof you choose to ignore. You chose to ignore proof. Its not that it does not exist, you choose to ignore it. For you to even state that there is less of a danger you getting Covid 19 then taking the vaccine is based on a deliberate choice to ignore common sense let alone medical studies and people who have no vested interest in forcing you to take a vacccine.

Worse still you admit you think your needs prevail over all the people you expose to the decision you make to be a pathogen of disease. Pathogen means spreader.

You are not just deliberate in your choice of ignoring evidence but in being selfish.

If there was any justice when you do get sick you should not be allowed any hospital treatment however you will be spreading it and taking up valuable medical services that could have been prevented.

You typify the kind of anti-vaxxer your country has to deal with.

Ah this is why I have an ignore button as well. Have a nice day.

 

Nope. Jethro Bodine was self explanatory.

 

That is what the left feels is their "ace in the hole". Badmouth and discredit ANYONE that does not toe their line. I've had my vaccination. If others choose not to, they will get the natural immunity. We will overcome this without shutting down (the dream of the left). Already numbers of deaths are way down.

I never said it was permanent. It would destroy the economy exactly as this ruling party class wants. Everything they do is to destroy the economy. They want to destroy it and then rebuild it to their design. Why else would they try and promote a 6 trillion $ budget? Why else would they open borders and give free healthcare to the world that wants to come here? Why else would they want to extend eviction prohibition to non payers? Yes the left wants the Pandemic to be permanent so they can always call the shots!

Trump never lied about the pandemic. He pushed through the vaccine when leftists Waters. Biden and Harris said they'd never take it because it was "Trump's Vaccination". They lied. Now they've reversed and want you to forget. Hydroxychloroquine also works wonders against the China Virus.I know examples personally. It is very cheap, safe , and has been around for years. Trump took it himself and we know how quickly he recovered. The left lies because they are in the pocket of Big Pharma as well and the both make millions and gain power due to the fear they spread. Makes you proud, doesn't it?

 

My own father took it in the Philippines during WWII as he contacted malaria. Great informative post the left does not want you to hear.

 

A human fetus is not a petri dish.

I've already defined 'living human' for you. You are pivoting away from it because it makes you look bad.

Continued pivoting away from the definition of 'living human'.

You support the choice to kill a living human who has not committed any crime nor has expressed any desire to die.

 

But it is a somewhat subjective decision, and not one that is really entirely obvious.

 

Conception happened in the petri dish, are you saying it's not a human at that point, if so we agree

 

Irrelevant to my point.

 

Inconvenient to your point, but very relevant

 

You have to have an open mind as to the mindset of others in order to understand. If you will only accept your thoughts and your thoughts only on the subject, you will never understand the thoughts of others. Only the arrogant believe that everyone should think the same way, their way. Did it ever even occur to you that many of the unvaccinated wonder why in the hell you would get the vaccine?

 

The most vaccinated countries are having another wave of infections like the Netherlands and the UK while the least vaccinated countries are not.