Predictions on how Biden will respond to drone bombing

What the hell are you talking about? War?

Say what you're talking about! Do you think we should go to war with Iran? Or what the hell is it you're proposing?

 

And after Trump removed them, they were forbidden from going... ANYWHERE. Those military sites were not a priority. There was no evidence that there was ANY nuclear material there. But, of course, Trump was President. Se we had NO person capable of negotiating anything.

What threat of military force was there when Trump was President? He withdrew the inspectors and then... .did he bomb 85+ Iranian targets in Iraq and Syria? Did he attack Iranian bases in Yemen?

So what is this "great" response you are talking about? Also, what is it you're proposing? Going to war with Iran?

Please speak clearly and tell us what the hell you are talking about? "Threat of military force" is absolutely VAGUE. But you praise Trump's response. So what the hell is it you're praising?

 

I'm talking about deterrence. You were the one yapping about war, as if it was the only other option available to us.

It's not. False choice.

If you did your research, you would know that war is what you get with the weakness and appeasement that has been the centerpiece of the Obama and Biden Administration's foreign policy, and war is what the world has gotten - in Ukraine, Israel/Palestine and elsewhere in the Middle East.

And where the hell have you been? Obama and Biden's masters in Tehran have been at war with the United States for decades.

Here's something else you can research - before WWI and WWII we didn't aid our enemies, as the "progressive" traitors in the Obama and Biden Admin have done with the "Death to America!" crowd. Now, Iran is off the chain because its leadership doesn't fear any repercussions from the candy asses in the White House that they're playing like a Stradivarius.

You may not like it, but Lieberman is right - Iran cannot be trusted - and Trump was right when he reimposed sanctions on Tehran and shoved a Hellfire missile up Qasem Soleimani's tail pipe.

Again, this isn't difficult. In fact, it's simple enough for a schoolboy to understand. The only way to deal with bullies is to stand up to them. You don't give them any lunch money, you don't let them push you around.

 

The set of sites that Iran absolutely forbade inspectors to enter was "not a priority"...?! Oh, please, Golem, you can't be serious! I know you're smarter than that! If these wacko Iranian 'priests' were intent on developing nuclear weapons, where do you imagine that they WOULD pursue it? Where they were subject to inspection, or, where inspections were forbidden?! Military sites are exactly "where the hell" I would continue my nuclear research if I were in the Iranian government....

Next, in a demonstration of uncustomary restraint, Trump didn't go over and destroy the Iranian military. He may be a bombastic, childlike egotist, but not even Trump would just haul off and pull something like that if it weren't necessary. Don't you see? Trump's essentially a "money guy". At that time, and situation, he knew that the right way to handle the Muslim priesthood governing Iran was to cripple them economically -- so -- he undid the half-witted 'agreements' that Obama and Kerry had thrown together at the last minute (to give Obama some kind of "legacy" besides the abject humiliation of Obama's "red line" fiasco in Syria). Trump had the Iranians by the throat, but then along comes Biden and he undoes everything -- and more:

"Iran has received approximately $71.02 billion more under Biden than it would have under Trump.
Biden repeatedly has said that there is no “specific evidence” showing that Tehran had any involvement in the Hamas terrorist attack, but Iran has funded Hamas for years." Link: https://www.dailysignal.com/2023/10...-admin-freed-iran-hamas-terror-attack-israel/

Lastly, I'm not necessarily "praising" Trump's tactics. If I had been in power, I would have demanded that Iran submit to unrestricted inspections everywhere, and if they did not comply, I would have removed Iran's capability to conduct nuclear research and 'neutered' its military to the point of being capable only of defending itself from unprovoked foreign attack. No more "proxy armies" like Hezbollah and Hamas, no more belligerent terrorism in the Persian Gulf, and no more development or construction of nuclear weapons and long-range missile systems!

And that, Golem, is exactly "what the hell" Trump should have done, but nevertheless, Trump was a hell of a lot better at dealing with the Islamo-Nazis in Tehran than Joe Biden is....

 

And I'm asking WHAT that is. And you're not responding.

Deterrence, to me, means for example international inspectors. Which Trump removed. And then did NOTHING to replace the deterrence. To me it means sanctions, it means bombing 85+targets and attacking Iran's interests in Iraq, Syria and Yemen. And who knows what comes next...

You said that was "weakness". And now refuse to say what "strength" would be.

All of which indicates you haven't even thought this through. Let me know when you have.

 

They would do it in sites that nobody would think of looking in.

It matters way less WHERE they develop nuclear weapons. What is important is that they don't enrich Uranium or extract Plutonium to nuclear weapon capabilities.

It WOULD be important to look into those places. And Trump dropped the ball by not negotiating that properly. But they were not such a big priority to pull out the inspectors and then... do nothing. Trump withdrew from the JCPOA promising that he would do a better deal. And then did NOTHING. So, I ask again: how is doing NOTHING something you praise?

You WERE praising them. I'm glad you changed your mind. But you need to do much more than that. You need to aware that he set us back enormously!

What Trump SHOULD have done is easy: resign. He is not nor has he ever been qualified to be President. Even Pence might have handled it better. And I'm expecting that he'll name a VP that's even LESS qualified than him this time around, so nobody dares asks for him to resign.

So, again you praise Trump... and you don't know WHY. Tell us again how you expect us to believe that you are not a MAGA?

 

You got your response, and as usual you deny that it was provided to you. FYI, that's a transparently lame discussion/debate tactic.

As has been pointed out to you, Obama's "deal" did not include an air tight inspection regime, which is why it was a BS deal in the first place. Furthermore, even before that, Iran never allowed the IAEA full access to Iran's nuclear program and facilities. Did you ever bother researching their reports? Evidently, not. You're clinging to the myth that international inspectors had full access to Iran's nuclear program and facilities when they never have.

As for the sanctions, Obama lifted them and Biden didn't enforce them, so Iran enriched itself to billions of dollars that it is now spending to foment war in the Middle East.

What did I tell you about weakness and appeasement leading to war?

And what about the recent strikes that are reactive, not deterrent, in nature? Biden said he'd strike back after they killed 3 U.S. soldiers and then gave them several days to move their personnel and assets before the attack took place.

1) I said Biden's foreign policy is weakness, and the wars in Ukraine and Israel/Palestine and the attacks on shipping in the Red Sea are testimony to that weakness. Weakness and appeasement beget aggression.

2) I told you what strength (and weakness) was. What part of dead Quds Force commander do you not understand? Do you think a Hellfire missile is a Valentine's Day greeting? Get real.

Projection, and all your comments indicate 1) you didn't read my post or 2) you didn't comprehend what I posted or 3) you're being dishonest pretending that you weren't provided what you were provided.

 

So you don't have a response. That's what I thought....

If anybody else wants to take a whack at it, the question was: if not war with Iran, if not sanctions, if not inspectors on the ground, if not military strikes to Iran's interests in Iraq, Syria, Yemen, and others (all of these discarded by this poster)... what is deterrence?

 

You got your response, you denied you got it, par for the course.

That's already been answered, sport. You just need to learn to read and comprehend what people put in front of you instead of pretending it's not there. That game got lame a long time ago....

 

You confuse my saying that "Trump was better at dealing with Iran than Biden has been" with praise for Trump. I'm merely contrasting something that sort-of, kind-of worked effectively on the Iranian economy (Trump's policy) with something that has done nothing but brought more and more belligerent, destructive warlike initiatives from Iran and its 'proxies' (Biden's policy).

And, really, do you understand that mixing and confusing your concerns about our citizens who want to 'make America great again' with American foreign policy regarding a mentally unstable theocracy led by a Muslim 'priesthood' that thinks war against all "infidels" is a religious obligation is both illogical and far-fetched?

 

No. You said more than that.

Anyway... not too relevant.

 

You see? This is what's wrong when people try to exchange ideas, Golem. You and I have different opinions about how the U. S. has handled our growing problems with Iran, and you accuse people who disagree with you of being "binary" -- but consider this: the position you take is that it's Trump's fault and Biden's got the right plan, and no other explanation is possible! In your estimation, it's all either ONE way or ANOTHER... with no "middle ground". And that's the very essence of "binary" -- "My way or the highway"!

I've tried over and over to tell you that despite the fact that I don't approve of Trump's handling of the entire Middle East situation(s), his approach was far better than the tardy, on-again-off-again, dribs-and-drabs mess that Biden has gotten us into already, with no prospect of any resolution on the horizon. But, because you won't acknowledge 'shades of grey', then it's either BLACK or WHITE. So, to those in your camp, it's either Biden (good!), or Trump (bad!), with no middle ground. And the worst part of all of it is the fact that, even after both Trump and Biden, Iran continues right on its path toward getting nuclear weapons and the missiles to deliver them with. We squabble endlessly with each other while our enemy works his plan to destroy both of us!

 

Thinking in binary is not an accusation. I'm just pointing out that your opinion is based on a logical fallacy. It is not personal. But if you start with the premise that there are only two options, you just shut yourself off out of realistic alternatives.

I have said no such thing. That's YOUR binary approach weighing in. Trump DID undermined a plan that started many years before him, and that was kinda sorta working. It was a mediocre plan, but it was at least a stone in the shoe of the Iranians. In hindsight, it could have been a little better. But it WAS helping. Trump had NO plan. He stopped this "mediocre" plan, and replaced it with NOTHING.

On a sidenote: Binary things EXIST. But to apply them to something as complex as this is what YOU do. Not me.

Trump had NO plan. He didn't do ANYTHING. But why are you insisting on that?

You said: "One of the very few things (in my estimation) that Trump actually did get right was his general approach to the Middle East -- and specifically, IRAN. You are welcome to criticize Trump from many standpoints, and I'll probably join you about 75% of the time -- but NOT on Trump's policy toward IRAN."

I'm happy that you changed your mind after you wrote the nonsense above. That's fine, and it's a good thing. I would have left it at that. But now you insist.

As for Biden, what he has done so far in response to the attack is ok. There are NO good options when you are killing people in an international conflict. But he has struck Iran's interests. That is as effective a deterrent as we can expect without starting a war. If there is anything else you think we should do, say it. If you don't say what that is, you are criticizing only for the sake of criticizing.

I don't know what Trump would've done. But my honest impression is that he would have either done nothing, or started a war. In the very very best of cases, he would have taken the advice of his military and would have done EXACTLY what Biden is doing.

 

Oddly enough, I appreciate your candor, and I agree completely that it was impossible to know with reliability what Trump would have done -- and, to Iranians, Russians, Chinese, et al, that's part of what made him so unpredictably dangerous! As president Trump was mercurial, temperamental, peevish, and prone to temper tantrums -- scary behaviors in a person who can wreak 'hellfire and damnation' on another country. He didn't have a "plan", Golem... and some of the "plans" he did have were badly and illogically formulated -- like the "wall", or, his idiotic desire for European-style negative interest rates....

I've already enumerated the ways I think Trump should have confronted Iran, but to focus on that "shade-of-grey" difference between what Trump did do, contrasted with what the Obama/Biden administrations did, and continue doing, Trump's was more effective in inhibiting and delaying the Iranian quest for nuclear weapons and dominance over the entire Middle East!

Biden has belatedly deployed American firepower to the Mediterranean, the Red Sea, and the Persian Gulf, and, yes, he authorized launching the '85 strikes', but with relatively very few terrorists actually neutralized (as little as 40): https://www.reuters.com/world/us-la...q-syria-nearly-40-reported-killed-2024-02-03/ . That's what I criticized by calling Biden's reaction in the Middle East, "dribs-and-drabs".

Frankly, after Biden's recent display of senility in confusing former French president Mitterand with existing president, Macron, and, further confusing France itself with Germany, it's time for Joe to bow-out and go home... it's time for 'new blood'.
Link: https://www.lemonde.fr/en/internati...ad-french-president-mitterrand_6498094_4.html

In the meantime, it is to be hoped that whatever else Biden's handlers do, they pay very close attention to Iran's feverish work toward producing nuclear weapons. When they reveal that they have them, it will mark the beginning of a terribly dangerous time for everyone in the world which Islam regards as an "infidel"! As Iran's belligerence increases it will require a lot more than '85 strikes' to deal with it, and, a LOT more enemy casualties....

 

By doing WHAT exactly? Iran wasn't on a quest to develop nuclear weapons in 2018. And we now know that's a fact because, if they HAD been, they would have a nuclear weapon by now. It would have been easier after Trump removed the inspectors. six years ago. So please explain what this "more effective" thing you're talking about is...

All that is nonsense. Biden is famous for his gaffes since he was in his 30s. If you want to have fun with gaffes, you could look at Trump, who thought he was running against Obama. Those are funny but they happen to politicians in their 30s as much as in their 80s. And not just politicians. EVERYBODY. We enjoy making fun of them on both sides. But they're just mistakes, usually because candidates are tired.

I'm not concerned about that. I'm much more concerned about the mental state of a candidate who keeps quoting Hitler and is constantly publicizing how he admires dictators and says that there are "good people" on the side of White Supremaicsts.

 

I had hoped you wouldn't resort to something as transparent and threadbare as deflecting from Biden's obvious dementia, to Donald Trump, but that was your choice.... Sad.

As far as what Trump did to counter Iran's belligerence, its funding and promotion of international terrorism, and nuclear weapons pursuit, I already stated it several times... but... here goes again:

1. Trump withdrew from the utterly useless, ill-conceived "agreement" that Obama/Kerry had hurriedly slopped together in 2015, which lifted sanctions on Iran, flooded Iran with desperately-needed capital, and gave them a bright, green light to go ahead with nuclear aspirations -- WITHOUT ANY INSPECTIONS PERMITTED AT ANY PLACE IN IRAN DESIGNATED BY THEM UNILATERALLY AS "MILITARY"!

2. Trump clamped the sanctions back on Iran and choked the Iranian economy so hard that they teetered on the edge of insolvency -- until the Biden Administration saved them, lifting the sanctions and flooding them with money as Obama had done... only even more so.

3. Trump deliberately assassinated the commander of Iran's international terrorist QUDS organization while he was working in Iraq... and Trump authorized it with a precision, pin-point attack that gave the Islamo-Nazis who rule Iran a crystal-clear example of exactly what they could expect to gain from their terrorist activities.

C'mon, Golem. You don't really believe that a person is necessarily in love with Trump just because he thinks that Joe Biden is little more than a senile, animatronic 'wind-up toy' that progressive 'wokesters' use to further their own various agendas. You're smarter than that, even though you don't want to let anybody know it.... But rest easy, as I said -- neither Donald Trump, nor any other Republican candidate is going to be elected President of the United States in this year's election!

 

No. The question is what did Trump DO. "Withdrawing" is NOT doing. What did he actually DO.

The sanctions created a temporary recession in Iran, but they produced NO policy change. Because there was no policy to change. There were no demands. Just PUNISHMENT. So they were absolutely useless. And, besides making the Iranian people suffer, there was NO change in any policy. It was idiotic because there was NO plan attached to it. No objective, no purpose...

What? Are you understanding what we're talking about here? How does that curve Iran's intentions, if they had been building a nuclear weapon?

Trump made a lot of people hurt. But... so what? What was the use of it? To satisfy some sadistic thirst for pure cruelty, just for the sake of being cruel? Why would Iran's authorities give a CRAP if their people suffered? They had Trump to blame, and they're done... But NOTHING is accomplished.

I say again: he removed the inspectors and replaced them with... WHAT? What did he do that would prevent Iran from enriching uranium or developing nuclear weapons or... ANY kind of weapons?

Of course, as I said, now we know they WEREN'T building a nuclear weapon. At least not while the nuclear agreement was in place. That was the PURPOSE of the agreement.

Your concept of "effective" is really odd.

 

It's so agonizing for me to be perceived as defending Trump, when that's not even what I'm trying to do. Trump didn't (DIDN'T) fix the 'problem' with Iran -- and that's the truth! No matter how much we may disagree, one thing remains true -- today, Iran is not dissuaded at all from pursuing its nuclear weapons ambitions, and the repercussions of that will be felt shortly after they announce that they have them!

For me this whole thing about Trump's performance versus Biden's performance is classic 'shades-of-grey'. But I've been over this a dozen times, and so now I'll just say that I sincerely hope (very sincerely hope) that Biden remains in the Oval Office until noon on January 20, 2025! Just don't inflict us with Kamala-la-la -- PLEASE! What is there left to say?

 

I'm not talking about "fixing" the problem. I remind you: I DON'T reason in binary. I'm talking about doing anything that would help impede Iran building nuclear weapons after he removed the safeguard that we had. Which, BTW, was WORKINNG.

I assume you no longer claim that that is one thing that Trump did "get right". But you still appear to believe that... whatever he did, was better than what set in place BEFORE him.

The objective is not so much to disuade them as it is to make it more difficult. Inspectors DEFINITELY make it more difficult. Sanctions... NOT so much. They haven't changed any policy because of the sanctions. So long as it's the US that is imposing the sanctions, the Ayatolah simply blames Americans for their people suffering. It doesn't affect them personally in any way.

Sanctions work when they are made in an intelligent manner. To obtain a planned result! If you do this, we lift this sanction. If you don't to that, we impose that other sanction. The ONLY thing Trump did was try to PUNISH them for... existing, I guess. There was no purpose to the sanctions. They were just... sanctions.

I hope he sits there until January 20, 2029. If Trump is elected, you can be sure he'll try to stay there beyond that. To be honest, I like Kamala more than I like Biden. I think she would be a very good President.

 

Oh, that's nothing.

Biden Touts Productive Climate Change Meeting With French Leader Napoleon Bonaparte



"Listen up, folks," the president said. "Climate change is an imminent threat. I just met with… I met… I sat down with the… I met with Napoleon… on the… I talked to Napoleon there. He agreed that it's a serious problem. We agree that it's in the best interests of both our countries to address climate change head-on. He was there with Josephine. She's a nice broad. She smelled like ice cream."

If Bribed Joe's response to the bombings doesn't stop the bombings, he failed.

 

You may indeed get everything you wish for! And I honestly cannot think of others who would be more pleased at the prospect of a President Harris than Vladimir Putin, Xi Jinping, and Iranian "Supreme Leader", Ali Khamenei....

At this point, I have nothing new to say except I hope that when some Iranian 'proxy' force puts a hypersonic missile into one of our aircraft carriers that there's enough life-vests on board to save everyone. We've been reduced to this....

 

I did not believe that this story was even possible, @Zorro , although I have always had high respect for all of your posts. So I searched for a source for the story -- and to my surprise, I found it: https://babylonbee.com/news/biden-t...meeting-with-french-leader-napoleon-bonaparte

The part where Biden was talking about Josephine smelling like ice cream left me unable to speak a word. I wonder how Biden's announced meeting next week with Britain's Queen Elizabeth is going to go...?

(Sometimes I feel like I'm in Hell, surrounded by people who don't even realize that they're in Hell, too....)

 

What a great post!