Russia caught lying again. Finally admits truth about MH17

Probably You didn't understand me because of the language barrier. This I ask you to bring any evidence against Russia. In the meantime, your sound just the bare words, slogans and the letters are in upper case.

 

As I have stated.....we KNOW that it was not a member of the Russian Military who shot down the 777.

We KNOW it was a Seperatist.

The only blame we are placing on Russia for this disaster is they should not allow MORONS to play with SAM Launchers!!

AboveAlpha

 

You do know that you didn't respond to my post in any way, opting instead to post more ...... bull(*)(*)(*)(*).

Just checking, because everyone else can see that.

 

And that's not true.

1. Ukraine had in the area a few working SAM "Buk" and even conducted air defense exercises. Links to Ukrainian(!) news on this issue I gave above.

2. Ukraine was a reason to worry about from the air. A few days before that, the army of Donbass said that they managed to capture a Su-25 and soon it will be applied. It turned out to be fake, the Su-25 was captured, but to fly it to no one. But Ukraine at that time didn't know that.

[video=youtube;iipddlBpmEQ]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iipddlBpmEQ[/video]

3. To shoot down the plane, not necessarily of malice. Enough mistakes.

Therefore, it is most likely that MH17 was shot down by the Ukrainian air defense exercises, by mistake. Produced training on targeting and accidentally made a start.

Another less likely cause is the shooting down by mistake due to the fact that MH17 took over the Su-25 of Novorossiya.

Technical capability of shooting down the plane by SAM BUK Novorossiya is so small that must be considered somewhere on the same level with provocation by the Ukrainian side. Close to zero. The militia was not exactly surveillance radar. And without him to shoot down an aircraft flying at an altitude of 10 km (30000 ft) is almost impossible.

- - - Updated - - -

It needs to be proved. So far all facts speak well for the Ukrainian SAM BUK.

 

The NSA Recordings are exact...specific and comprehensive.

Names are used.....VOCAL ANALYZATION....leaves ZERO DOUBT to whom is talking.

U.S. Satellite Data...and we have many covering this area.....details where the SAM originated from and it was NOT a Ukrainian SAM.

This Satellite Data will NEVER be released.....as it would detail just how advanced it's detection capabilities are.

I was surprised as HELL when Obama ordered the NSA to release the recordings.

There is no doubt what happened.....it was a major screw up by Spetsnaz to think they could allow Seperatists to either guard, man or operate such a SAM system.

AboveAlpha

 

It shows the Russian insurgents had and were using these systems at the time, which supports the audio recordings of them talking about shooting MH17 down, which supports the BUK manufacturer saying it was a BUK that downed MH17. The Ukraine is defending its established borders from Russian efforts, if you cannot see it your blinded by something.... Crimea was staged and NovoRussia is the distraction to cement the theft of Crimea - the only terrorists here are in the Kremlin and there proxies fighting in the Ukraine. Everyone can see it clear as mud, you pro-Kremlin liars look like massive fools and the quicker you wake up to yourselves and join the real world the better it will be for everyone.

 

And where these records?

Then it — not the proof.

It happened. MH17 was brought down. And who brought down it — I referred to elementary logic and the public facts above.

And about yours "Data will NEVER be released" — we in Russia have a comic song which fragment can be translated as "... at us there are such [cool] devices! But we won't tell you about them". This phrase is often said when referring to the supposedly secret data. Which actually is emptiness.

 

Anyone can Google NSA Recordings of MH17 Seperatist SAM shoot down.

AboveAlpha

 

Here, I brought some photos of those "Russian insurgents".

http://www.politicalforum.com/showthread.php?t=411955&p=1065079122#post1065079122

Think about it: how can Russia make Ukrainian children and women to fight for Russia against Ukraine.

Maybe it's not really as simple as you think?

If it's all for You event somewhere on the other side of the earth, I saw how this whole situation has been maturing in recent years. Including how the US has invested in the destabilization of the region billions of dollars.

Victoria Nuland Admits: US Has Invested $5 Billion In The Development of Ukrainian, "Democratic Institutions"

This development led to the fact that in Ukraine there was a resurgence of Nazism, did the harassment on ethnic grounds, because of what Russian Crimea (The Crimea was Russian and as a part of Ukraine) preferred to separate began, and Russian-speaking Donbass wanted federalization.

 

By agreement, treaty and DEAL with the U.S.....Russia agreed NEVER to invade or harrass former Soviet Territories especially Georgia and the Ukraine.

P!$$!NG OFF the United States is just stupidity.

There is absolutely no advantage and no benefit to the Russian People for doing tis.

The ONLY benefit is to Putin and the 110 Putin Buddies who own over 35% of Russian Wealth.

It doesn't bother you that Putin controls your media...or that not one Ruble of Profit has been used from Siberian Oil and Gas Sales to develop Russian Infrastructure which is dismal?

Keep believing the lies from Putin and see where it get's you.

AboveAlpha

 

Please, give the direct link. Google finds articles like this.

https://www.recordedfuture.com/buk-sam-mh17-investigation/

But there mistakes catch sight almost at once:

But SAM Buk-M2 has never been in Ukraine:

The illustration below provides a view captured by Novorossiya SAM BUK photo... BUK in Azerbaijan Baku!

http://www.1news.az/society/20130620105146473.html

And so on. To me to continue analysis of article or so it is already clear, what there a juggling on a juggling? You have more reliable materials? Then share.

 

Here's what Putin here? I see him once a year on television, when he speaks before the new year. Me enough direct information from Ukraine and Novorossia. Have friends in Kiev and Donetsk. There are acquaintances who fought for Ukraine. There are those who now fights for Donbass. Ukrainians, not Russians.

And Putin in Russia on the contrary many do not like. For not helping Novorossia...

 

Voice Transcrips.

Forget not that separatist field officers and their Russian superiors must communicate with one another in order to be briefed and issue orders. In the case of the BUK systems, there are instances where they use code words, like “beauty,” but in most cases they speak clearly about BUKs. Apparently, their communications are routinely intercepted by the Ukrainian side, just as I imagine similar Ukrainian field communications are by the pro-Russian side.

The transcripts of the intercepted calls show that rebels on the ground were receiving instructions from superiors in Russian military intelligence (GRU), that they discussed receipt, disposition (including hiding), and use of BUKs to bring down Ukrainian planes, that at least one BUK had come into Ukraine across the Russian border, that there was a crew that knew how to operate it, that there was likely more than one BUK, that the rebels considered the BUKs a game changer, and that they were expecting some sort of Russian hostile action launched from across the border.

Here are the English transcripts and the voice recordings of intercepted phone calls in Russian:

Talks between terrorists, July 14, 2014

“Oleh” – Oleh Bugrov Valeriovych, army chief of staff of self-proclaimed Luhansk People’s Republic, deputy minister of defense of “LNR”

“Oreon” – a citizen of the Russian Federation, officer of Main Intelligence Directorate (to be identified).

Oleh: – Worked out a plane near Stanitsa. Missed.

Oreon: – Great. This way they are taking revenge on planes, but only several days remain. Now we have BUK, will shall bring them (planes) down.

Talks between terrorists, July 17, 2014

Khmuryi: Sergei Nikolaevich Petrovskiy, officer of Main Intelligence Directorate of Russian Federation, Deputy Chief of Igor Girkin on Intelligence; at the time of the interception he was in Donetsk.

“Buryat” – militant of rebel group “DNR,” or Donetsk People’s Republic (to be identified).

Buryat: – Where should we load this beauty, Nikolaievich?

Khmuryi: Which one? This one?

B: Yes, the one I’ve brought. I’m already in Donetsk.

K: Is it the one I’m thinking about? “B…,”M” one?

B: Yes, yes, yes. “BUK”,”BUK”.

K: Is it on a tractor?

B: Yes, it’s on it. We need to unload it somewhere, in order to hide.

K: Is it with a crew?

B: Yes, with the crew.

K: Don’t hide it anywhere. She’ll go there now.

July 17, 2014

Khmuryi: – Tell me, have you brought me one or two?

Buryat: One, one. Because they had a misunderstanding there. They didn’t give us a tug. We loaded it and went at their own pace.

K: Did it go on her own or on a tug?

B: It crossed the line (border).

H: And now have you brought it on a tug? Don’t put in anywhere… I’ll tell now where it should go, it will go together with “Vostok” tanks.

July 17, 2014

Khmuryi and “Sanych” – militant of terrorist organization “DNR”. Deputy of Khmuryi.

K: Sanych, the point is that my “BUK–M” will go with yours, it is on a tug. Where should I drive it to put in a column?

Sanych: There, behind “Motel”, not reaching Hornostaevka.

K: Just after the Motel, right?

July 17, 2014

Khmuryi: Listen to me carefully, behind the circle near “Motel” there will be you know what. Call to “Bibliotekar” (Librarian).

Bring inside only those, who just came back, only as much as you need for the convoy. Leave everyone else here. Not far away there is Pervomaiskoe, look at the map.

DNR militant: I got it.

Khmuryi: Settle somewhere in that area, bring there those who are left. Your task is reserve, plus protection of this piece, which you will drive now. “Giyrza” will come there too. If anything, I’m on line.

DNR militant: – Ok.

July 17, 2014

Khmuryi and “Botsman” – officer of Main Intelligence Directorate of Russian Federation (to be identified).

K: Yes, Botsman, I’m listening.

B: Hello, big brother. How are you?

K: Not so well. We are in Mariinovka. That’s why not well. Carrying on.

B: What’s wrong?

K: What do you think? (The Ukrainian army is) attacking with “Grad” (multiple-rocket launchers) all the time, finally now we’re having a little break. We’ve just hit a plane, Su–type. Because we’ve got BUK–M. They (Ukrainian soldiers) are now in Zelenopillja, trying to break free, but their way out is only through me. Yesterday we hit 2 Su jets, today – another two. Thank God “BUK–M” arrived today in the morning. It became easier. But in general, of course, it’s tough.

B: What can I say, if you need anything, call me – and I’ll arrive immediately.

H: Thanks, brother. I’m going in two hours…Seems like it’s a lull. In two hours I’m heading to Donetsk. Because I was sent three more “Gvozdika” (self–propelled artillery). Will carry ‘Gvozdikas’ here because it’s really tough now.

B: Maybe we should cover them with (our own) Grad (multiple-rocket launchers)?

H: The thing is that we have Grad, but no spotter. And secondly, we are waiting for Russia to f*** them from their side.

Independent Russian military analyst Pavel Felgenhauer, advises Putin as follows:

“It would be better if the separatists and Russian authorities stopped lying and fantasizing and “placing the responsibility on Ukraine” (to use Putin’s words) but admit as soon as possible their own guilt, such as it exists, not prolonging their unpremeditated crime with a premeditated concealing of facts and the destruction or distortion of evidence.”

AboveAlpha

 

Thanks, I on a transcription learned a source. Alas, it not the NSA. It is the Ukrainian SBU (Security Service of Ukraine).

[video=youtube;YgdqdklrqDA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgdqdklrqDA[/video]

Which was caught already repeatedly in a direct lie and fabricated materials. The information value of these negotiations — zero.

 

[video=youtube;T34AB6CImTE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T34AB6CImTE[/video]

There are subtitles in English, you can watch with the translation.

 

One section of the audio includes a conversation between two militants nicknamed “Major” and “Greek” as rebels inspected the crash site. They discuss the evidence that it was a civilian plane.

“It’s 100% a passenger aircraft,” Major is recorded as saying, noting that he saw no weapons on-site. “Absolutely nothing. Civilian items, medicinal stuff, towels, toilet paper.”

Here's a full transcript of that recording from the BBC:

[Male voice, captioned as "Greek"] Yes, Major.

[Major] Well, the Chernukhino lads shot down the plane.

[Greek] Who shot it down?

[Major] From the Chernukhino roadblock. The Cossacks at Chernukhino.

[Greek] Yes, Major.

[Major] Well, the plane fell apart in the air, near the Pertropavlovskaya coal mine. The first casualty 200 [military jargon for dead body] has been found. A civilian.

[Greek] Well, what do you have there?

[Major] Basically it was 100% a civilian aircraft.

[Greek] Are many people there?

[Major] [Curses] The debris fell right into backyard.

[Greek] What kind of aircraft?

[Major] I have not figured this out yet because I haven't been close to the main body of the debris. I am only looking where the first bodies began to fall. There are the remnants of inner brackets, chairs and bodies there.

[Greek] I see. Any weaponry there?

[Major] Nothing at all. Civilian things, medical bits and bobs, towels, toilet paper.

[Greek] Any documents?

[Major] Yes. From an Indonesian student. From Thompson University [curses].

In another segment, a militant reports to Mykola Kozitsyn, believed to be one of the Cossack leaders of the rebel movement. “As to this plane shot down nearby Snezhnoe-Torez,” the militant says, “this turned out to be a passenger one. It fell down outside Grabovo. There is a whole lot of bodies of women and children.”

In another quote from that recording, a militant says to Kozitsyn: “On TV they say like it is a Ukrainian AN-26, a transport plane. But the writing says 'Malaysian Airlines.' What was it doing over the territory of the Ukraine.”

Here is that transcript (again, from the BBC):

[Male voice, identified as a fighter] Regarding the plane shot down in the area of Snezhnoye-Torez. It's a civilian one. Fell down near Grabovo. There are lots of corpses of women and children. The Cossacks are out there looking at all this.

They say on TV it's a Ukrainian AN-26 transport plane, but they say it's got Malaysia Airlines written on the plane. What was it doing in Ukrainian territory?

[Male voice, identified as Cossack commander Nikolai Kozitsyn] That means they were carrying spies. They shouldn't be [curses] flying. There is a war going on.

LINK.....http://www.businessinsider.com/ukraine-militants-mh17-transcript-2014-7

AboveAlpha

 

It's not the NSA. This is a known fake from Ukrainian SBU (USS) :-/

See above video analysis. There's failings in the preparation of the record. Gluing, distinguished with the naked eye.

 

Sorry for offtopic. As I wrote earlier, I use electronic translators. I can't evaluate the understandability of translation into English. Everything that I write is clear.

Therefore, if it is not difficult to check which of the electronic translators on this page gives a better result?

http://www.politicalforum.com/entry.php?b=1372

 

One more Putin supporter come in Welcome. At this forum the majority is spoken bad English. We understand each other anyway.

 

There are "special troops". They include everything that is beyond the 'regular troops'. Including engineering divisions who are building bridges and tranches etc. And there is a Spetsnaz which is the supermen for the fight on military service. They are different in every aspect.

 

When I talk to someone - I talk to this someone. If I don't understand something that I read here - I ask questions.

If you (or some other reader) needs to learn the difference between the 'active' radar and 'passive' radar then the easiest explanation is that the active radar is using the same device, the same point to send the radio signal and to catch it in return from the target. So basically its work looks like a line between the target and the radar. Judging on its length - all the info is gathered. The passive systems involve "reflector" and its job looks like a more complicated geometry. Easy to say it gives the advantages and reliability.

PS. If you ignore some arguments and I don't mention it in my answers - it doesn't mean that I haven't noticed it.

 

..... it would be funny if it wasn't sad. The only people who are benefiting out of the situation is the Kremlin - they wanted Sevestapol, so they took it. The rest is a sideshow for the absent minded but the rest of the world just shakes it head at the stupidity of the Russian people who support Putin.

 

Crimea joined Russia in the March 2014. Aircrash of the Malaysian Boeing happened on July 17, 2014.

What kind of benefit you're talking about? Just curious.

 

Actually, this is one of a few US forums where forum administration doesn't ban Russians for their political views and manner of talking. That's why sometimes it resembles Russian English-trying-speaking forum.

 

Wonderful!
Let's imagine that Putin has organised Maidan and on purpose made them to use anti-russian rhetorics. Then Putin made fascist activists to come to south-eastern cities of ukraine and organised another agents of his to kick these guys out of the cities. Besides, he organised the burning of Berkut officers and shooting snipers from the roof in order to remove his agent Yanukovich from power and hide him in Russia. Then he organised the invasion into Crimea and made sure that western countries would object against of it and wouldn't recognise it. Then he organised a couple of bloody provocations in Donbass and made ukrainian army to attack Putin's agents with the help of Putin's friends from western countries. Then Putin organised several losses of ukrainian army with the help of his secret agents who were dying in thousands and made other people of Donbass suffer but still fighting against the ukrainian army. Then he organised humanitarian help to the people of Donbass who risked to die of hunger, but at the same time in order to save all the benefits he achieved by that time he desperately needed... to shoot down a civilian plane. And not only that he shot down this civilian plane, but also ordered all the media of the west to write for months about his crime taking a benefit to ... to disagree with them.

Well. I see no gains for Putin. At all.

So far Our US partners decided to make business on gas. But evil Putin was robbing poor russians selling russian gas without giving anything in return for the citadel of democracy! What a tyranic move! So our partners had two main options. First. Ukrainian puppet state is buying all the european gas from Russia and resells it for higher value (storing all the money of the corrupt oligarchs in the banks of the free and liberal progressive society. The other way is that Russia stops to sell its gas to EU and the US starts to sell their own gas for the double price, which europeans in the name of democracy will have to buy anyway. Besides, it would increase the price of european products (somewhat 30%) and the american ones will get a price advantage...

So far anything happened is about the US profit and EU loss. For Russia the happening things are a catastrophe. We gain nothing besides the knowledge of what the Capitol has ever stayed and what their values actually are.

PS. Before the provocation with MH-17 Putin had a press of peacemaker in Syria... Some guys in the west were even saying that the main idea of destruction of chemical weapons of Syria and establishing peace deserves Nobel Peace Prize, but it should have been Putin and not Obama to receive it. Before... But after there were no such talks.