Trump Clears Way For Julian Assange Pardon

Oh dear...

Well, some people are just too obdurate and obstinate for mere facts to penetrate.

Have a nice day and goodbye.

 

Apparently even one fact is too much in some cases. So long.

 

He publishes info just like the WP or NYT does. He speaks truth to power. This is journalism, pure and simple. The US military killing journalists is speaking truth to power. But the power does not like that. Tough sh*t.

 

LOL If assange walked out of that embassy he would be in custody in a new york second and on his way to the US to be prosecuted. You are quite naive sir, quite naive. And yet I doubt that you are. I have heard congress exclaim that they want this dude. For what, then, if he is under no threat? LOL

 

Nonsense. All governments have classified information and those who have access to it have a sworn duty not to release it to anyone who is not authorized to have it. It is an offense to do so. Manning commited that offense and Assange was in on it.

 

He publishes hacked and stolen emails and files. I don't call that journalism. In the case of the Manning material Manning committed a crime releasing those files to Assange and Assange was in on it from the beginning.

 

Do US service members take their oath to POTUS, to DoD, or to protect and defend the US Constitution?

 

Like the Pentagon Papers, sure. This is journalism, whether it is a town crier of old, or today. Speaking truth to power will piss off those in power. And yet, so much of our business is conducted in secret and we never know what is being done in our name. There is far too much secrecy today. Secrecy is the beginning of tyranny. So assange is serving a purpose our own faux Press is shirking in duty. You just do not like speaking truth to power and informing the people of what is done in their name, on their dime, perhaps? You must trust your own gov't? Well, many of us don't and for plenty of documented, damned good reasons.

 

All countries see fit to keep certain information secret and have done throughout history. I know of no case where this has led to tyranny. Tyranny happens but that is not the cause.

This case is not about speaking truth to power. Its about criminal activity. Manning plead guilty to 12 charges and was found guilty of 19. These included theft and violations of the Espionage Act. Assange was complicit in this.

You admire weasels like this and believe they are somehow doing us all a favor. I think that's ridiculous. I consider them a particularly disgusting type of criminal who should receive the harshest punishment possible under the law.

 

The degree and volume of secrecy in our gov't is beyond the pale. They will classify things which have no need to be classified but would be valuable info for the voters. They hide what they do in our name with secrecy. And it only gets more prolific and worse.

Whistle blowers do their deeds knowing what is at risk to them personally. I have seen zero evidence assange was anything but a publisher. That it was revealed our military killed journalists is something the american people should have been told and were not. There is no reason for that to remain secret. These people work for us in case you forgot. And the employer needs to know when our military kills innocents, including journalists and why in the hell it happened. It is called accountability and responsibility. Owed to the american people.

 

There may be some stuff that is classified that doesn't have to be, I don't know, but I certainly would not put military information in that category. Its extremely naive to think that the military doesn't have to keep anything secret.

You seem to be particularly pleased that the killing of the journalists was revealed. That is something that should not have happened, but it didn't do anybody any good to show it to the whole world. War is hell. Nobody wants to be there. Everybody wants to get home in one piece. **** happens that shouldn't happen. As far as I am concerned what happens on the battle field should stay on the battle field.

 

It is true that all governments have classified information and that those who have access to it have a sworn duty not to ... leak it under threat of legal sanction.

That's where the reality ends. Some get punished, like Manning - a lowly soldier. Others, of more advanced rank don't. It's a two-tier system and typically hypocritical and full of double standards.

And

My bolding
http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/43160-when-intelligence-agencies-make-%20backroom-deals-with-the-media-democracy-loses

There are many similar examples of journalists publishing leaked classified information - sometimes on behalf of the intelligence community, sometimes not.

 

Ecuador has granted Assange citizenship and provided him with a passport. It seemsevident that much is happening behind-the-scenes and this may be the first major step in breaking the impasse with the British authorities, who have now refused to grant Assange diplomatic status as requested by Ecuador.

Watch this space, I think.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5255849/Ecuador-gives-Julian-Assange-passport.html

 

Yes I agree, it would be indeed naive to think our military does not need to keep some info, classified and secreted from the american people. But hiding the truth from the People, by classifying it, as was done with the killing of journalists by our military is not acceptable to any rule of law constitutional republic, where the gov't is supposed to be by and for the People.

There is far too much secrecy with our gov't and it has been that way for a long time. Classifying in order to hide screw ups and incompetence, or to protect particular ruling class oligarchs, is the rule rather than the exception today, IMO. How much is classifed, kept from the american people, by our so called(it is such a joke) public servants, in order to hide the CIA operating outside our own constitution. You know the drug running of the CIA of coke into america would have been classified. Even when their operation congress would not finance was completed. Well, of course the CIA, the heads, did not want the People to know the crimes they were doing in our name. And so secrecy serves these people, personally, as it does the questionable CIA.

Schumer told one helluva secret on MSM when he confessed and warned trump, that he best watch out when it comes to this all powerful CIA. For they could get trump, our president, 6 ways from sunday! If that does not enlighten you on what our CIA actually is, then enlightenment is an impossibility for such minds. I think that is rather obvious and not at all confusing or difficult to perceive.

Loose lips sink ships, so I have not problem at all with needed secrecy, when it is done in the interest of the People and america our nation. But this isn't the only reason things are classified and things kept secret from the american people. And therein is where the great problem lies. I acknowledge the reality of this while others just go into some sort of denial, and the act of ignoring. SO, informing these people of facts is wasted time and effort. For they choose, by their own volition, to ignore it or deny it. And they are scared to do the research, in fear their denial or ignorance, will be shown for what in reality it is. A belief in disinfo and misinfo, propaganda.

 

There is no rule of law that requires the military to publicize what goes on on the battlefield. They do release information. They have journalists with them. But why would they be expected to choose to release the info and video of the accidental killing of two journalists? In whose interest would that be? The enemies interest of course, because it serves to diminish home support for the war effort.

 

You bet your arse they should have told the american people that they killed journalists by accident. The right to know what is being done in your name by your servants should not even be questioned unless it indeed does involve the safety of the People. This was not in that category. Ever hear of the My Lai massacre? If not this will get you up to snuff...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Lai_Massacre

IMO, DC is filled with people like Mendel Rivers as reference in the above quote from the article on My Lai. The officer in charge of the ground operation, served only a short term on house arrest for the mass murder of civilians, men, women, children.

So, the American People certainly should have been informed about this, what was done in their name. My money says if this happened today, you would never know jack shi*t about it. It would be classified, for national security. lol Yes, one helluva joke, with motives for classification being obvious. To cover and protect arses.

 

Oh, in regards to the OP, I just saw this..



So it seems the principled patriot, assange has been granted citizenship by Equador as they make an effort to help get assange out of hostile territory.

Of course the UK, is having nothing of assange being free. America would have a big problem with the Brits if they didn't ship him off to america, as DC wants him in prison, for as long as they can lock him up. This talk of there being no charges against him, so he should not fear such charges, as voiced by some on this very forum is just naive nonsense.



It is true that in times of fascism and the tyranny this requires, speaking the truth to power is a revolutionary act. Assange is only guilty of doing what our so called free press is supposed to do, and to speak truth to power and informing americans what is being done in their name, and is kept hidden from them.

Assange is an idealist, and who knows and understands of the abuse of power, how prolific it is, and is doing the job of a free press as a publisher, in speaking truth to power. Of revealing things about our ruling elite, their actions, which may not be acceptable to the people they serve. In this act, he exemplifies a patriotism to a rule of law, representative constitutional republic, a gov't that is supposed to be by and for the people but no longer is. Given this fact, Dershowitz has said many times that assange has done nothing illegal, committed no crime and is protected by our constitution. The kink of course is that if we bring him to the US to charge and prosecute, it would be expected that our gov't would drag it out, and make sure this wait for trial was as long as they could manage it, so he is locked up with real criminals, as some in DC would be hoping he got himself murdered while in prison Even when he beat these trumped up charges, he would spend plenty of time locked up, enduring any nefarious treatment which would come his way from the establishment.

A real patriot who believed in our founding principles, and constitution would be calling assange a patriot, to the american system set up by our very wise Founders. But it is understandable that when many of us think MSM propaganda is real journalism that they would see assange as not being of the Press. Afterall, if we think the Press is what MSM does, we would not be able to recognize what a genuine free press looks likes and does. I doubt if that many of us can even recognize what genuine journalism looks like these days. For you see so little of it, as most of our information that is spread by MSM is little more than propaganda, given they refuse to adhere to basic journalistic standards. I would even bet most americans are unaware of journalistic standards and the absence of them. They are only exposed to one side of an issue or story, when there may be more than two sides. So, the other sides of an issue, a story is kept from the viewers. Now WHO would do such a thing while still calling it journalism? lol Well, a damned liar! People who intentionally set out to deceive the american people. So, compared to this crowd of faux journalists, assange, who is giving us a genuine free press, looks like a criminal. But he only appears to be a criminal to those who are clueless, for whatever reason.

 

You stated above that you agree the military needs to classify some information. Why then would you support people who steal classified info and dump it on the internet? Maybe I would agree with you that some info is classified that ought not be, depending on what info you are talking about, but I certainly don't want people like Manning and Assange making that decision. Who the hell do they think they are?

 

You have a strange choice of heroes, a guy who dumps stolen and hacked information on the internet. Were you equally proud of him when he published Hillary's emails?

 

This has always been my issue. People have long compared Wikileaks to the Pentagon Papers, but it is a poor comparison. The latter were overwhelmingly policy discussions & historical assessments of the Vietnam war. There was very little operational information that could be used against US troops in Vietnam and very little 'low level' detail that might be used to harm people.

Had Wikileaks stuck to that sort of stuff I would have been cheering it from the start. Instead it leaked the names of people who worked with US forces, who had talked to US diplomats etc. These were people all over the world, many of them living under regimes or in nations where merely talking to a US official or talking out of school about the government could have life altering or life ending consequences. Despite Assange's contemptuous dismissal of their fate, these people should have had their identities completely hidden before the documents were released.

Whatever noble potential or intentions Wikileaks may have started with it is too dominated by the dangerous narcissism & personal prejudices of one man. Its only necessary to read up on his personal interactions to understand that he isn't someone who should be making the sorts of decisions he has been in a position to make.

On the good news front, some other nation has taken him on as a citizen. Hopefully he will renounce his Australian citizenship (though I doubt he will...too useful). We have enough sexual predators here as it is.

 

Don't beat yourself up over that - nothing ever happened to them. He exposed them for being the incompetents that they are, and that incompetence might well have been responsible for the deaths of agents in the field on many occasions - who knows? He performed a valuable and virtuous public service; he must have done otherwise the waste-of-space losers wouldn't be so vindictive against him. QED??

 

Ah, the voice of the ill informed child booms forth. Your contempt for the fate of men braver & more substantial in every way than you can ever hope to be is to be expected. Easy judgements to make when you know you will never have to make the hard choices they did. The irony in you deploying the phrase 'waste of space loser' is indescribable.

 

Don't shoot the messenger mate, even if he is an 'ill-informed child'. I'm nowhere near as ill-informed as you'd like to believe ol' buddy!!

 

These are trite words.

Words, moreover, that can equally apply to Bill Clinton, Tony Blair, Bush 2 and Barack Obama - amongst many other leaders - all of whom held the highest office in their respective lands.

Below is an important leak that Assange and Wikileaks brought to the public's attention, namely gun-happy Apache Gunships shooting down civilians, children and journalists.



This is the sort of thing that should be published so that the public know what is being done in their name and have a chance to censure it or approve it.

More recently he released huge leaked files about the illegal CIA mass spying, surveillance and hacking programmes known as Vault 7, as well as earlier revealing the Afghanistan war log files - quite apart from Hilary's emails etc.

 

'Trite', 'crass': Do you think that peppering your posts with words like this makes you sound more clever? The poor quality of your arguments betray you, as does your unwillingess/inability to address my arguments.

I have no issue with the release of the gun camera footage or information on the scope of surveillance & hacking. If that were what he had restricted himself to I would be a vocal supporter. I don't have an issue with the DNC emails either. If nothing else it was a useful reminder that Assange isn't some neutral figure, but a political player and an active Trump supporter.

I do have an issue with leaking information that had the potential to endanger lives. Not only did Assange do that, but he made his complete indifference to that potential clear. So do his supporters. Repeatedly. Those names and that information could and should have been redacted. That was a choice. One you clearly support.

Wikileaks long ago strayed from its core mission to become the vanity project of one man. Sadly there are far too many people who are happy to excuse his every action and stroke his bloated ego. I'm content not to be one of them.