US voices concern over UK exit from EU

Well, I have given solid and valid reasons why I believe that not to be the case. And I am not alone. You think different. Fine.

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What are you talking about?

Seriously, I cite a very valid piece about the strain put on the NHS, and what is your response.. 'projecting'.

 

Well, yes, of course, but that goes without saying.

That's not what is happening though.

 

Actually, produce tends to be cheaper in the developing world. A large portion of food that is sold in America is Chinese, for example.

Subsidies in American agriculture sometimes lower prices (like with beef), whereas others raise them -- like with milk.

While I support ending all agricultural subsidies both here and in Europe, the fact remains that food is cheaper in plenty of places outside of the West even with the subsidies in place.

 

It is not any of the USs concern.

 

If America greatly reduced its interventionism, much of Europe would pick up the slack. The Libya invasion gave some hints of that. That was a conflict primarily driven by France and Italy.

Also, plenty of European powers still intervene in the affairs of their former colonies.

Nationalism is a good thing when it comes to preserving sovereignty. I think we can agree that when nationalism manifests as racism, it's bad. However, when it simply seeks to preserve self-rule, it's not bad.

I just don't put faith in the EU until some member states (like Greece and Portugal) fix their internal problems first. It's financial suicide to tie your own nation's fiscal future to countries that are swimming in debt and can't even properly collect taxes.

 

Yes, but it is all part of the carve up, and weakening of nation states, to have a construct like the EU.

That is why there is lots of rhetoric to support it, you will notice, and even personal abuse if you do not. Yet rarely any hard benefits, to say, my country, for example.

They talk in vague terms, or give out this seeminly dire warnings of what could happen to Britain, and how the freaking sky will fall in if we do not remain in the EU, and how we must 'progress' (WTF?), and that to even dare think this all just yet another bag of manure, for the already rich, to get richer, of the backs of the majority...is the stupid one? Huh?

Um..I guess I had best not warn folks that the Make Money From Home Stuffing Envelopes is a scam. Don't want to be thought of as not progressive or anything, or closed minded to 'business opportunities'..



Btw.

Europe have never done SFA for Britain before, and we managed.

Even although we had not built up the same war machine that the Germans had, and even though it was against all logic, bankrupted our country, and destroyed our then empire we declared war on Germany. I did not see France, who fell flat on their arse, doing anything about the Nazi issue. I did not see Spain and Italy do anything, no wait, the latter did, they joined forces with the Nazi's. I was going to mention the Germans, but they were of course the one's central to this..

Um. Who else in Europe really helped us? And I don't mean a wee pocket of resistance in France? Leave out Russia, different thing, who in Western Europe did anything of note, save for us? I mean REALLY of note?

Almost no one.

They all rolled over, and gave the fark in.

Only we did not. And the island of Malta, no less. Lufftwaffe and Italian crap planes, bombed the crap out of those islands, to dominate the airspace, and yeah, clearly to shape both along their lines, if they had been able to invade and secure.

They failed. They could not do it, even at their strongest. I know there were others from other European countries that were in the air force, etc, but let's be honest here, Germany went for it, the rest of Europe mostly weakly folded, and it was only really us in Europe that did anything.

Sometimes I wonder why right enough, when I look around at the world today.

 

Anything that allows Europeans or gives Europeans the idea to think is a bad thing. When Europeans think you get things like world wars and ethnic cleansing and crematoria and mass graves so Europeans thinking must not be allowed.

 

I can see you lasting long..

 

I'm not sure whether China is a good example here. They have their own ways of 'outtrading' both us and the developing world and they are cheaper because just like most of the developing world they ruthlessly exploit their workers. It's not as if Chinese or Vietnamese prawn farmers could well afford to eat their own products: http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2003/jun/19/food.fishing

I'm talking about the African poultry industry being ruined by the EU exporting chicken legs that nobody wants here (http://www.africanagricultureblog.com/2008/02/subsidised-imports-decimate-ghanas.html, http://yaleglobal.yale.edu/content/french-ngos-push-save-african-chicken-farmers-europe) or about Mexican corn farmers being ruined by the import of subsidized US Corn (http://www.nytimes.com/2003/08/27/business/us-corn-subsidies-said-to-damage-mexico.html)

 

I disagree in part. I suppose it is what’s happening, ie USA aid, but who knows the real motivation behind the help? Personally speaking I don’t think any nation helps another in a substantial manner unless there are ulterior motives to be had. I put my trust in the Churches and religion sponsored aid groups as well as the secular groups/organizations. They help and do not expect anything in return etc.

reva

 

Fair points, but I'll put it this way. If we removed all subsidies, that still wouldn't end the massive amount of overproduction we have with food.

We utilize only a small portion of our arable land, and yet, because of advances in agriculture, we produce more food than we can eat. America is one of the largest exporters of food and would remain that way even without subsidies.

So, the fact that less developed nations can't compete with our efficiency in that respect is just a matter of comparative advantage.

It's no different from how our labor can't compete with China's when it comes to low skill manufacturing.

 

That's where the idea of a one-world-government with a one-world-currency, one-world-taxes and one-world minimum wages comes in. It would automatically make it always more attractive to consume as many local products as possible to save shipping-costs. The world is getting too small to be divided into nation states or to ruin the planet by intensive monocultural industrial farming for that matter. Of course there are regional differences between people that ought to have a say about what they deem culturally sensible for them, but that doesn't contradict having shared agreements on issues that affect us all.

 

Truly frightening scenario.

 

I think trade organizations do a better job of that than a one-world government would.

As you've pointed out, the WTO is far from a perfect or consistent body, but I can't imagine a one-world government being better.

John Lennon once suggested we could "imagine" a world without countries, but if history is any indication, the closest we've come to unified governance is vast empires via colonialism or conquest.

I think unifying the world under one government would be a giant step backward for humanity when considering the progress made from independence movements. The 20th Century saw the end of European colonialism.

Even though vestiges of colonialism remain via corporations, self-rule is still a more natural outcome than foreign paternalism.

 

I bet if you put it to a vote, people would not back one WORLD Gov, and everything made the same, in some sort of horrible and artifically moulded, grey society..

 

Serf, I wish to just add this.

I support political diversity of choice, true and fair choice, right across the spectrum. Not just in nature of the given parties, but in the system itself.

This is something that not the EU and certainly not a 'World Gov' can tolerate, since they are all about less diverse choice, less political flavours, less self empowerment of nation, and retaining only the present system(at best), of, two establishment parties, both of whom are obedeient and complient.

If anything, I sense more people are starting to get tired of the faux democracy as described, and the system that goes with it, and I see them seeking out alternative forms of Governance, that may be a version of some direct democracy, like the Swiss model, it may be having a greater selection of possible parties to vote for, that are afforded a more level playing field, heck, what happens if one nation find one man that they want to lead them, and are happy to give him the responsibility, irrespective of the charade of elections.

There could be another hundred ways, and my purpose is not to evaluate them and, and say which I think would be better,but to always allow for people wanting to Govern in a manner that they may decide to go with, at the time, even if that is different from the accepted 'norm'. The more you get dragged into large + faceless unions, the less hold you have on such options.

Jack

 

Your depiction of a world government is far removed from my vision of what a world government would entail.

 

We have enough problems trying to establish ONE decent Government. Anywhere. Which doesn't fill me with faith that we are ready to make any moves beyond that.

 

source

I am baffled why Mrs de Kirchner have not yet condemned Brexit

 

Sorry, no offence, Mut, but, JESUS...Greece, what were you doing????

INSANE. On several levels.

Israelis invited to buy up Greece's infrastructure

Israeli companies, with the encouragement and assistance of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, are taking advantage of the economic crisis in Greece to find some bargains while helping to advance the privatization efforts of the Greek government.

As a means of coping with the ongoing crisis, the Greek government has decided to privatize dozens of government companies, including the national lottery, the old Athens airport, the national oil company, refineries, the ports of Piraeus and Thessaloníki, local water companies, large industrial plants and more.

In recent months, top Greek officials visited Israel to find investors. They met with a number of top Israeli business leaders and presented the various opportunities to invest in and own Greek infrastructure.

These meetings have already led to a number of signed deals. Israeli mega-corp Elbit won a tender to buy the old Athens airport, and a number of hotels were purchased by Israelis in hopes of boosting Israeli tourism to Greece. An Israeli company is also in talks to buy Greece's national oil company.

In August, Israeli business leaders were invited to a state dinner in Athens in honor of the Greek president. Greece sincerely hopes the Israeli investment in its economy will create the jobs and economic growth needed to pull the country out of the gutter.

Israeli-Greek relations have been warming up for some years, especially in light of growing tension between the Jewish state and Greece's traditional rival, Turkey.

That's why when Greece joined other European nations last month in voting to recognize a state of "Palestine," Israel perceived the move as a slap in the face from a close friend. But Jerusalem ultimately decided to shrug off the UN vote, assuming that with its current economic difficulties, Greece could not afford to lose investment and business from Arab and Muslim states.

http://www.israeltoday.co.il/NewsItem/tabid/178/nid/23588/Default.aspx

Sorry, no matter what else you did, you should NEVER have done this.

I am disgusted with the Greeks that entered into this.

 

I'd never heard of this gentleman before, but he speaks with a lot of truth here, and with a great deal of sincerity;

[video=youtube;6GZlKxrmdyA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GZlKxrmdyA&feature=player_detailpage[/video]

 

A small note on the public lottery , they announced 500m € of net profit inside 2012 only last week .

 

A voluntary tax on the terminally stupid.