I read a bit of the Quran the other day - I intend to read the whole thing at some point to get a better idea of what I'm dealing with. Death to gays, women should be submissive, death to the non-muslims, Jesus was a liar - that's about the jist of the few things I read. Along with Mohammed's ramblings about how everything he was saying was supposedly the message of God and everyone should follow it unquestioningly. That's right kids - who needs critical thinking? Mohammed will do it for you! (or rather, he'll get high again and have hallucinations leading to more of this prophety crap) Oh, and lots of ass-kissing praise for God. "God is great" and all that. Not only is it barbaric, it's whole premise is laughably stupid as well. It sounds exactly like something a paranoid, superstitious desert dweller wrote. Funny, that.
Funny how you pulled the quote out of context....and edited it....here is the stuff. fitnah does not mean persecution of Muslims, it is more like causing tribulation and these lines clearly show that it is a reaction to this that the fighting is about. This is about fighting oppressors.
I don't know what you were reading but most of what you say is not in the Qu'ran. You should probably grab a copy that isn't printed by a someone with an agenda.
Then how is it in Saudi Arabia they use their religion to justify the barbaric things they do if the Quran, apparently, does not tell them to do so? Why is mistreatment of women so widespread in the Muslim world? If their holy book doesn't tell them it's ok to do so, why do they all do it?
A government that allows a film disparaging Mohamed to be posted to youtube is oppressing Islam. You understand this fundamental difference between Islam and the other major religions... right? I must follow Islam, whether or not I follow Islam. Islam = submission Democracy is made of mans laws. Submission and freedom are incompatible. Islam and democracy are incompatible. Islam is not a religion... it is a complete way of life predicated on the notion that there is no law but God's law, and Mohamed was His prophet. This will be a problem so long as Islam is not crushed or the Qu'ran is changed.
reading comprehension issue, he was asking about a public opinion poll 4 pages of posts and did not see 1 that contained what the OP was referring to Pew Poll from May 7, 2013
Because al-Saud and the rest of the Gulf monarchs don't care for Islam. They care for power and money. All that oil has gotten to their heads and replaced Islam. For example, Quran does not forbid women from driving. Whether it is cars or camels. Because they mix tribal and cultural practices with religious practices. For example, honour killings is not Islamic either. Why do Americans break the laws of their country? If the law doesn't tell them it's okay to do so, why do they all do it?
What "bits" did you read? Let's see... You found this in the Quran? Wow. Please, show me where! http://quran.com As are men. Muslim: one who submits their self to Allah. Interesting. Especially the part about the Quran saying Jesus (pbuh) is a liar. Please, show me where it says this as well: http://quran.com [quote- that's about the jist of the few things I read.[/quote] You must own a very unique copy of the Quran. I'm guessing it's the translation by Ibn Kadhaab. Fascinating how without reading a word of the Quran, you use critical thinking to come to such an ignorant and baseless conclusion of it. And you boast about your ignorance in such a stereotypical American way, too.
Depending on their social status of course, but that is beyond the point. My question was not "what do you do to Americans who break laws?" but rather "why do Americans break laws?" It was to help my friend find the answer to his question, why do Muslims do something if the Quran does not say we can.
My implied question is why, in your numbers, do you not handle your own? A deeper layer of that would be why do you produce so many lawbreakers... in the worst of ways. Of course that question would be rhetorical as I have given what I believe to be an answer here already... so let's just stir that a little and leave it alone... like our export of democracy.
hmm quick news searches islamists attack islamic violence seems to me 60% of those polled have their heads in the sand Christians attack Christian violence
I'd say that's a pretty decent estimate. But hey, maybe the deniers are right. After all, what's a few million murdered infidels? Wikipedia - Persecution of Hindus Wikipedia - [Incomplete] List of Islamic Terrorist Attacks
You must own a very unique copy of the Quran. I'm guessing it's the translation by Ibn Kadhaab. Fascinating how without reading a word of the Quran, you use critical thinking to come to such an ignorant and baseless conclusion of it. And you boast about your ignorance in such a stereotypical American way, too.[/QUOTE] The main problem is that many of the inhumane things done in the Islamic world are done because of Sharia Law, which is religious law derived from the teachings of the Quran and from the actions of Mohammed. You can deny it all you want, but everything in Sharia law, from the execution of gays to mistreatment of women to Jihad, is done because somewhere in the Quran or in Mohammed's teachings, something justifies it - even if you see it as contrived, or a flat out lie, you are clearly the minority because most Muslims support it. Any religion where people think it's ok to kill someone because they wouldn't let you govern them with your religion is by nature oppressive. I do apologize for being so ignorant of your holy book - however, it does not change my opinions on Islamic culture. Following the Quran is fine as long as you do not force anyone else to join you. The fact that the Muslim world thinks of its religion so highly that any other beliefs must be either stamped out or not treated equally is oppressive, and that they want to spread it to Western Civilization is concerning.
The inhumane things done in the Islamic world are done because there are some inhumane people in the Islamic world. The problem with Sharia is not Sharia but the lack of a caliphate. Looking throughout history there has been no issues with Sharia. The only way Sharia can probably be implemented properly and legitimately is if there is a Caliphate, and a number of Islamic scholars look at the Quran and Hadith and derive the laws collectively. Not every Muslim country has Sharia law, by the way. Then why is there not one universal Sharia? And no, the mistreatment of women is not taught in Islam. What a foolish thing to say. Sharia differs in state to state. Scholars do not agree on the punishments either, but no Sharia states considering having a collective of Imams to interpret the laws. That is the problem. What gives you the authority to say something like this? And Islam says this is okay where? In proper Sharia, Jews and Christians are not killed but protected by the state and governed with the laws of their own religion. No need to apologize for your opinion. At least you admit to your ignorance. I do not mean that in a snobby way, it's just most people consider themselves to know more about Islam than Muslims actually do. Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. Say : O ye that reject Faith! I worship not that which ye worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship. And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship. To you be your Way, and to me mine. Who says this is what the Muslim world (ie the nearly 2 billion Muslims) collective agree with this thinking? And what is wrong with people converting to Islam?
Government. More specifically, the monarchies in the Gulf. The complicity of the Gulf states in supporting and promoting extremism in the region for the cause of Wahhabism and their monarchies. They also have the support of a number of Western nations due to all of their oil and Western interests in the region. The same fundies you invaded Iraq and Afghanistan to fight are being supported in Libya and Syria by you as well. Hold on... the top 10 countries when it comes to committing crimes are... The United States at #1... followed by the UK, Germany, France, Russia, Japan, South Africa, Canada, Italy, and then India at 10th. The top 10 countries when it comes to homicide are... Honduras at #1... followed by El Savador, Ivory Coast, Jamaica, Venezuela, Belize, Guatemala, St. Kitts and Nevis, Zambia, and Uganda. The top 9 countries when it comes to rape... Lesotho at #1... followed by Trinidad and Tobago, Sweden, Korea, New Zealand, USA, Belguim, Zimbabwe, and then the UK. ... The answer being? Islam?
Oh you are preaching to the choir there. http://www.politicalforum.com/current-events/305132-syria-what-ing-mess.html Well... first of all... there are Muslims everywhere... so that is a bit of a silly opening... I am pretty sure you are aware that reporting human rights abuses is a wee bit lower in the ME, on which these statistics are based... I am pretty sure you left off the last part of my statement, because it was quantitative. The level of horror they try to inflict on innocent people. We don't butcher people and defile their bodies in the streets for instance... might bump you on the head to take your iPod... but... we don't really do that much beheading... and you guys seem to do it a lot. Just calling a spade a spade here. There is something other than coincidence here, and there is something keeping the people... the great billion strong majority, from issuing fatwas on terrorist Islamists. Islam IS under attack... just not by us. Those who have hijacked your religion and made that book represent hate and murder and horror to the rest of the world... but rather than FIGHT them with your masses... you just sort of shirkingly say "well... he's not with me". As OUTRAGED as MODERATES get at depictions of Mohamed being disparaged, I just don't see a lot of outrage at terrorists... who are the source of those untrusting looks you get from people who don't know Islam and don't want to. Not the giant hillbilly... but Muslims. I am more prone to believe in things I see. I see lip service. I see if someone makes a show of exercising their free speech... everyone goes irate. Yeah... that. There is a sort of a nod nod wink wink feel to the whole thing. "Oh they really shouldn't do that... but you know if the US would just stop supporting Israel... this wouldn't happen." I don't much care for it frankly. No... you had it right. Government.
