What is it about Jew-Hating that the left finds so alluring?

Correct me if Im wrong, but I infer from your post that you believe that in response to the barbaric escalation by Hamas aimed solely at killing civilians, that Israel should cede to every demand of Hamas and make Hamas' barbaric act a smashing success.

That is utterly preposterous. Your position is precisely why I and most of the Western world have no sympathy whatsoever for the Middle East position regarding Israel. It is irrational and bereft of reality. Terrorism is a scourge on this earth, and in no way should it ( or can it) ever be allowed to succeed. People from the Middle East, yourself and Palestinians included, keep thinking that it is going to work and that it is an acceptable tactic. The Middle East position IS the problem, not the solution.

That position is simply not realistic in any fashion. That position is why the Western world does not sympathize with the plight of Palestinians.

 

hence point 1 - Call in an independent investigative team to study the events of October 7.

Btw, my crystal ball has shown me why you absolutely DO NOT want this to take place .....just yet. The IDF have a little more house work to do before it allows in the inspectors.

 

An independent investigation? Do you have ANYTHING in the historical record that shows this as a response to a country being attacked?

That position is not realistic in any fashion. It is utterly absurd, and in some bizarre universe where Israel would cede to this strange suggestion, who would determine who qualifies as an independent investigator? It would be literally impossible for both sides to come to an agreement on that front.

You are not part of the solution. Your unrealistic position IS the problem.

 

So what?

 

Yes, independent investigation to see how many of those 1400,..scratch that, 1200...no scratch that too, 1000 and dwindling, Israelis were incinerated beyond recognition by ak47s.

 

....so lets suspend reality and pretend like this is realistic...

What would change if that number goes down to 800? Similarly, what would change when the fake hospital/parking lot stray Hamas Missile blamed on the Israelis death toll were revised down from the ridiculous 500 claim?

What in your mind does this accomplish?

I would suspect that Israel would be more than happy to have their claims put to the test vs the claims from Hamas. The problem is it is not realistic.

 

It would get to the truth amongst all of the lies flying around. Did you see the line of cars on the road by the rave, about 30 cars lined up all burnt to cinder?

Israelis need to know, the more lies, the more truth comes out.

 

Anyway this is off topic. Please continue it in the 7th October testimonies thread, thanks.

 

There is no need for us to sit here and argue whatever statistics that you or I choose to believe because nothing can be proven here. Nor could anything be proven by a so called independent investigator because lets face it, whichever side was proven wrong would insist that the investigation is bogus. There is not a chance in hell that you would accept that Hamas has completely lied about their numbers and that Israel has mostly been correct with minor errors. You would cry foul, and you know it. At least be honest with yourself.

As far as a line of cars, no I did not see them, but I can absolutely envision a scenario where Hamas had a line of cars with bombs and militants retreating down a road. The existence of this line of cars proves absolutely nothing. I assume that you are implying that these were civilians, but you have no way of knowing that. You choose to believe the narrative from people who purposefully target civilians for death without a military target in sight while also hiding amongst their own civilians to maximize their death toll. I choose to consider them as barbarians and wholly untrustworthy. For the life of me, I cannot fathom how a civilized person could see these barbarians as trustworthy. It does not make any sense. It is akin to taking the word of Charles Manson. He simply cannot and should not be trusted.

 

off topic.


See here:
http://www.politicalforum.com/index...trike-major-blow-to-israeli-narrative.614507/

 

What is off topic?

I read your link. You provided a link to a middle east publication that pushes their narrative by claiming unknown "witnesses". They decry unverified claims from israel while pretending like their claims ARE verified. What exactly does this change?

As I said, you choose to believe the narrative of terrorists. I do not. I find their terrorist actions to completely destroy any shred of credibility that they may have otherwise held. Your problem is that you are not applying common sense while simultaneously unquestionably believing the words of literal terrorists.

 

That link was for a thread where your discussion will be on topic. This topic is about lefties hating Jewish ppl. Idk what the 7th October events has to do with lefties in America. Perhaps you can enlighten us all...

 

Good points.

I would add that Palestinians whose homes are in certain large areas of Palestine are being ruled by the military law of a foreign state in which they have no representation.

That's why WE revolted. WE understand why the acts of Israel are intolerable - if we simply read our own founding documents and think about it.

 

Huh? You were the one who was going to respond to when I said...

"From where I sit, it looks to me like Israel wants nothing other than peace while also maintaining their land. They are in the midst of an entire region that seemingly wants nothing less than their complete and utter destruction. With that being the backdrop for them to seek anything other than peace is wholly irrational.

I truly do not have a dog in this fight, but when I look from afar, I see the Muslim world as being the bad guys in this situation. Their entire response is terrorist acts aimed solely at killing civilians. Yes, civilians are killed when Israel responds to this terrorism, but when the terrorists purposefully surround themselves with civilians, I place the civilian deaths at the hands of the terrorists, not with Israel whom is giving warnings before they strike.

If you are from the Middle East, I would not expect a position different from the one you are espousing. I have a very good friend whom was born in the US but his parents are from Lebanon and he has your same position. There seems to be no reasoning with him. It is inherent in how he was raised, and I suspect you too were probably raised that way.

What surprises me, are the Americans (mostly from the left) that oppose Israel's actions to defend itself. It just does not make any sense to me that they paint Israel as the bad guys and the Palestinians as the victims while never seeming to spend more than maybe a sentence of condemning the actions of Hamas or Palestinian's support for Hamas and Hezbollah. For the most part, they support the notion of killing Israeli citizens, and I find it hard to sympathize with their cause as a result.

That is my sincere position. I just dont get it. I can grasp how a middle easterner opposes and despises Israel's existence, but I dont understand it with an American that is peace loving. To me, terrorism needs to be eradicated, and I cannot fathom supporting those that use it as their tactic. I do not mean this to be offensive."


You have spent the last 10 posts or so refuting that notion now you want to summarily declare that "WE" are off topic?

Hmmm. I can only surmise that this conversation has not went as well as you had hoped. You have been more than a willing participant in what is now a very long discussion. Perhaps you just dont like someone taking a deep dive into your belief and position on this subject. When exposed to the light of day, it does not hold up to reason. Thinking that Israel is supposed to cede to the demands of terrorists is simply not logical in any form or fashion.

 

According to left leaning academic, Noam Chomsky, USA and Israel are the biggest terrorists in the world right now. That might be the reason lefties dislike Jewish ppl.

Btw, iDidnt read your essay, too many right wing soundbites and cliches by the looks of it. I'm an excellent skim reader and can detect insincerity immediately

 

So?

According to the bulk of the western world, Hamas is nothing but "actual" terrorists.

It is obvious that you are now shrinking away from having a legitimate exchange of ideas and are now opting to bicker aimlessly. That's not my thing.

 

That might be a reason lefties dislike Jewish ppl.

 

I agree.

Chomsky is an America-hating Socialist, as is a certain percentage of the American left. I do not doubt that Chomsky influences a great many of them. In truth, I think your statement is very insightful.

I dont buy the notion that the American left cares one iota about the plight of Palestinians, but it makes perfect sense that the portion of them that support Palestiniaians, do so for the express purpose of opposing America. There is a reason that some people call a certain subset of the left the blame America first crowd.

To them, every problem in the world is America's fault. What was it that Obamas pastor famously said after 9/11?....Oh yeah..."America's chickens are coming home to roost."

 

Who was Obama's pastor who said that?

 

Jeremiah Wright I believe.

 

Trump claimed he was out helping find survivors after 9/11. He claimed hundreds of his friends died on 9/11 (despite not attending a single funeral). He claimed he was watching people jump to their deaths from Trump Tower . . . which had no view of the building. He claimed he saw New Jersey Muslims celebrating in the streets on 9/11. Another lie.

 

Cool story bro.

 

The only way to defend Trump: ignore facts.

 

You are wanting me to defend Trump in a thread about anti-Israel sentiment amongst the left because I made mention of Jeremiah Wright saying Americans chickens are coming home to roost after 9/11?

How are you rationalizing this to be even tangentially relevant to what is being discussed?

 

Is the thread about anti-Israel sentiment or anti-Jewish sentiment? And why is it okay for you to talk about 9/11 but not for me to do the same?