What would #metoo for men look like?

I guess LE is our version of wolf-lore?

 

That doesnt really seem like an answer to the question...

 

Lets not skirt the issue here. Do you find it acceptible to use Law Enforcement to punish people who dont have the 'insight and self-honesty' to know when they're trying to date outside of their 'league'?

 

Maybe in the past, but under the present political environment, no. Women that can't do this should be wearing a burka.

 

I guess if you don’t tell a person that they are robbing you as they take your watch it’s abuse of the law?

 

Obviously you don’t know what sexual-harassment is. We are talking about the man who touches you inappropriately or the man who kisses you without asking. You know like Donald Trump does

 

As women gain power and as women come forward you’ll see men learning that they will be punished. In the past women who were assaulted weren’t aware of their options. We were powerless. Today because of some courageous women we are coming forward with our stories and our support

 

Thats assault. The touching at least. An uninvited kiss I think could be a gray area, but I wouldn't fault someone for calling the cops about it.

We're talking about 'he won't stop hitting one me (even though I never told him Im not interested)'

Ive been discussing this particular subject with crank for a while now. If you read back a bit, it should be clear. You've interjected in the middle of a 'side issue' and don't have the full context. If you would like to go back and 'catch up' I would be interested in your opinion as well- should we be using LE to punish people who are trying to date 'out of their league'? Should there first be an expectation of clarity in communicating 'im not interested' before reporting harrassment?

Assume the unwanted attention is verbal. Touching strangers without permission is not OK.

 

Taking someones belongings is clearly theft. Unless you leave them laying somewhere public, of course.

Reporting someone for harrassment without first telling them that they're bothering you is making an unfair assumption that they KNOW they're bothering you when that may just be their version of 'friendly'.

 

To a womam grabbing her or kissing her against her will is clearly sexual harassment , If someone is so stupid To think that it is OK then that is their problem. What is so great that is happening now is meant to becoming aware that unwanted advances are just that… Unwanted
I agree that in the past men had to guess and women felt powerless but now it is clear that you don’t touch a woman against her will and women now have the power to report it

 

You make it sound as though the average woman calls the police when a man is flirting with her. That doesn’t happen. It reminds me of the argument anti-choice people make assuming that women have abortions at the moment of birth. It’s extremism. I think what is necessary now is sensitivity training for men. I know I did that with my students and no more more companies are doing it.

 

Some people will be too dumb to ever get it. Think of the IQ range in the population at large.

 

I said nothing about 'the average woman.' Now you're making assumptions about me.

Did you read the back-n-forth between crank and I *at all*?

 

I guess the thing is, they should know. MOST men do know. It's these 'rogue' elements - who have some kind of self-image malfunction - who are the problem. Unfortunately, in my experience, the rogues don't respond well to flat refusal.

In an aside, I think this is due to their unrealistic ideas about themselves. The reality of their lack of appeal is brought home with a thump, and no fantasist wants that. So when it happens, they take it out on the woman. Which leads me to the next flaw in such individuals. They are invariably old, or hold very outdated and dysfunctional ideas about the passivity and receptivity of women.

 

But still... Do you find it acceptible to use Law Enforcement to punish people who dont have the 'insight and self-honesty' to know when they're trying to date outside of their 'league'?

 

I want to address this. Almost any woman alive can tell you that there is a world of difference between flirtation and friendly. Inappropriate men probably tell themselves and others that they were just being friendly, but the target of their attentions knows full well that that's not what it was.

EG: two 60 year old men approach an unknown (to them) female of say ... 35. One makes very little eye contact while asking for directions, focuses on the topic at hand, stands well back, and behaves in a way which screams "I don't seek friendship, so please don't misread my need for directions as anything but". That's appropriate in this situation. A 60 year old man isn't likely to be hanging out with 35 year old women, so any suggestion of friendship would appear false and suspect.

The other makes lots of eye contact, stands as close as a familiar, and attempts to bring non-related topics into the dialogue. He behaves as though he's opening a friendship, not an information exchange. That would be fine, with women his own age, or men. It's not at all fine with someone he would not ordinarily be friends with (in the natural order of the pack).

Hope that all made sense.

 

Makes sense. But you're avoiding the question.

Do you find it acceptible to use Law Enforcement to punish people who dont have the 'insight and self-honesty' to know when they're trying to date outside of their 'league'? Is it acceptible to use LE to enforce 'the natural order of the pack'?

 

Sounded to me like you were making the exception sound like the rule

 

Nope. Im just trying to address a problem I see. Its a problem from only a small minority, but so is racism. Even small problems are worth solving.

 

So will powerful women like Ashley Judd who set women up for sexual abuse and harassment get a pass? Or their mug shots on the cover of Time Magazine.

“One actress, Sanchita Malik, then 20, contacted SAG-AFTRA the day after attending the session at a Hollywood rehearsal space May 20, 2015, to convey her displeasure. (She subsequently filed a lengthy written grievance with the actors’ union.) In the statement, which she briefly posted on Facebook in October (prompted by the Weinstein revelations) before Trafficked’s legal counsel threatened action if she didn’t remove it …”
THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER, Actresses Detail Groping, Simulated Rape in Audition for Ashley Judd Sex-Trafficking Film, by Gary Baum,12/4/2017.
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/n...tion-ashley-judd-sex-trafficking-film-1063731

 

And yet 31%-57% of women admit to having rape fantasies.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...s-rape-fantasies-how-common-what-do-they-mean

When "overpowered by a man sexually" was used instead of the word "rape", it was as high as 62%.

Someone bought all those copies of 50 Shades of Grey.

 

I'm still undecided on this. Though it's probably reasonable to regard it as our version of wolf-lore. The men who take these risks (like the cocky low ranked wolf) ought to know that it's 'out of bounds'. To put it another way ... let's say the following pic is me. It isn't, but I'm the same type.



Now here's the sort of men who gets away with 'flirting' with me:



and now another type who sometimes try ....



Clearly, pic three must know that he's out of bounds, given pic one. Just as pic two would know that he wasn't.

 

Well, there goes the fat male vote if you ever run for office.

 

What makes it even more problematic (for the pic three type), is that women like pic one will actually be insulted by any advance from a pic three. Only seriously stupid and misogynistic men would run such risks.

 

So fantasies of women allow men to abuse them? . Let me explain something to you about these fantasies. Women like sex. Women are not supposed to be sexual because if they are they are labeled as sluts. Therefore a man overpowering us in our fantasies is our sexuality being allowed