Who Here Are Old Enough to Remember Back Alley Abortions?

....liberals would be chronically in pain.

 

Does it hurt that bad that you have to make up lies?

 

Some perspective...

No one knows how many illegal abortions there were before Roe. Why? Because they were ILLEGAL. The only clue we have is the number of women who actually died from illegal abortions. In the U.S. (since 1940) deaths from actual abortions (not miscarriages etc.) were reported separately (unlike most other countries who lumped all deaths from pregnancy together). Unfortunately we don't have the total number of illegal abortions so a ratio is not possible.

In 1966 deaths from illegal abortions dropped sharply by half. New and better antibiotics, better surgery techniques etc. were most likely the reason.

In 1967 NY and CA allowed abortion on demand however, there was no sharp drop in abortion related deaths. In 1973 there should have been a sharp drop in women dying however there was no such drop.

More here...

http://www.abortionfacts.com/online_books/love_them_both/why_cant_we_love_them_both_27.asp

And NO I am not trying to support illegal abortions just bringing some perspective.

 

Please notice that most experts believe the drop in maternal mortality from illegal abortions is partly due to women having abortions earlier in gestation. ALL anti-abortion legislation (euphemistically called "information" for women) is designed to DELAY abortion. If pro-lifers are truly caring about women, they won't pass legislation to delay abortion.

http://eileen.undonet.com/Main/7_R_Eile/Numbrs.htm

Journal of the American Medical Association 1992 Dec 9;268(22):3231-9

Induced termination of pregnancy before and after Roe v Wade. Trends in the mortality and morbidity of women. Council on Scientific Affairs, American Medical Association.


"The mortality and morbidity of women who terminated their pregnancy before the 1973 Supreme Court decision in Roe v Wade are compared with post-Roe v Wade mortality and morbidity...Deaths from illegally induced abortion declined between 1940 and 1972 in part because of the introduction of antibiotics to manage sepsis and the widespread use of effective contraceptives. Deaths from legal abortion declined fivefold between 1973 and 1985 (from 3.3 deaths to 0.4 death per 100,000 procedures), reflecting increased physician education and skills, improvements in medical technology, and, notably, the earlier termination of pregnancy."

 

double post

 

You won't get a true perspective from a pro life website.


But were illegal abortion deaths reported accurately? Before legalization?
Almost certainly they were! Back then it was a felony to do an abortion. When a woman was seriously injured by an abortion, she went to another doctor for care. The abortionist was nowhere to be seen. The new doctor tried to save her life, but she died anyway. Was this new, ethical physician going to deliberately falsify the death certificate (which was felony itself), to protect the abortionist? Not likely! Therefore, prior to legalization, deaths from illegal abortion were seldom covered up.

How utterly stupid. As abortion was a felony, the woman denied having one.

Of course they were covered up. Why do you think nobody knows the true statistics?


And this:


We’ve had an example of an entire nation in recent years. It was Poland. Under Communist rule in the ’80s, there were consistently over 100,000 abortions registered each year as compared to about 600,000 births. With the establishment of some self-government in 1990, with both the Church and doctors discouraging abortion, the numbers fell to 59,400

Let’s list the 1990 figures and then look ahead to 1994, the second year after abortion was forbidden except for danger to the life or health of the mother, rape and fetal handicap.

During this time the number of registered abortions declined to 176th of what it had been, and there was not a single death due to illegal abortion. All of these figures are exactly opposite of what International Planned Parenthood people in Poland predicted when the restrictive law was passed

Because they go to neighbouring countries, or make use of the abortion ship.

The people on that website are lying.

Read this:


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3035540.stm

 

That doesn't make sense since the drop in deaths from abortion took place BEFORE legal abortion in some states and you still have not addressed how you know how many 'back alley' abortions there really were. I say the whole issue is way overblown by pro-aborters.

 

One woman dying for lack of a safe and legal abortion is one woman to many. I don't need statistics.

One poor desperate woman is one too many...........

 

What is overblown? The fact that women died? While it is impossible to know PRECISELY how many illegal abortions occurred, it IS possible to estimate fairly accurately if one knows how many deaths occurred.

One thing we can do with this chart is estimate the number of illegal abortions performed.

In 1973 eg there were 615,831 legal abortions and these resulted in 25 deaths and the deaths from illegal abortions numbered 21. Since in truth the abortion providers both legal and illegal were at that time pretty similar in skill we could anticipate that there were also ~600,000+ illegal abortions performed or in total ~1,200,000 abortions in 1973. There really was not an increase in the number of abortions performed by legalizing - just a huge decrease in women's deaths from them, as the skill, and surroundings in which abortions were performed, improved.

Check the link if you wish to know how the numbers are calculated. It is impossible to calculate how many women might die if abortion is criminalized again, but it is safe to say that more women will die than do currently.

 

I gave you stats showing how many women died from botched abortions. The number does not come anywhere near what was 'sold' to the American public. I give you facts that show legalized abortion made little or no difference in the number of deaths from abortion and you can't seem to discuss the issue. Better antibiotics is the only reason for the drop in deaths by women who have had abortions. The whole issue is really made-up.

 

There is no such thing as "pro-aborters."

There is such a thing as "pro-choice."

And you are showing extremely poor faith in your post.

 

OK..let's use something that obscures the raw truth...I know...Let's call them 'pro-choicers'.....One side 'chooses' life. The other side 'chooses'.........fill in the blank.

 

Reasons for the drop in deaths from illegal abortion:

reflecting increased physician education and skills, improvements in medical technology, and, notably, the earlier termination of pregnancy

The point is that criminalizing abortion doesn't reduce the number performed at all, that has been proven using statistics from countries where abortion is illegal. So why risk increasing the number of deaths of women? Even if we don't know how many women might die, we do know that women will be taking drugs and herbs unsupervised by medical personnel increasing the RISK.

 

Not my point. I NEVER advocated criminalizing abortion. Why would you write such a thing? I think an abortion is overall deleterious to a woman and should be avoided at all costs. I realize that it is legal because SCOTUS has decided that the issue lies in the right to privacy. This puts women on their own and in full control of the human reproductive process.

My advice to women is to not have procreational sex if they don't want to get pregnant. Why is this so hard to understand?

 

One side chooses forced birth. The other side chooses choice.

 

Is sex selection a legitimate basis for use of the abortion procedure?

 

You'll never be forced to either give birth or have an abortion if you don't have procreational sex. Is this a tough concept for you?

 

Well based on SCOTUS it certainly would be legal. In fact it is none of your business what she decides to do with her fetus. It is owned by her.

 

Sex for procreation only is YOUR religious belief. Is it OK with you that some of us follow our own religious beliefs?

 

whereas thousands of babies dying from abortions however is FINE to you.

the only female you care about is the breeding age female...female babies are aborted at a higher rate than male babies.

so spare us the sanctimonious grandstanding..

 

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vYae6JSEPs"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vYae6JSEPs[/ame]

 

Sure...Whatever...I'm just giving you facts....You let a penis into your vagina and there is an almost 50% chance you will become pregnant even with contraception then, you will either 1) give birth or 2) abort. Each has its own risks. Why would you want to risk that in the first place?

 

Depends on what age the vagina owner is.

Teen girls get pregnant just standing downwind from a boy.

Older women >30-35, not so much.

 

And I should care about that why??

 

Yes, I am more concerned about the people who are actually inhabiting the planet rather than those who might never be.

And you know - that includes children starving overseas