Jesus PBUH called God "Allah"

Nothing there says how your kissing the rock of allah was. So, how was it?

Quantrill

 

The "harlet" in Ezekiel is Israel. Try reading the beginning of the chapter. Israel in the OT was often referred to as YAHWEH's wife. Just as in the NT where the Church is refered to as the bride of Christ. Ezekiel is describing an unfaithful wife.

In Matthew, Jesus is simply stating that he was willing to break up the most revered social and religious institutions if it took place over the community of the new kingdom.

 

Response: No where in the chapter is the harlet referred to as Israel, nor can you quote and prove otherwise. Ezekiel is relating a story of God having sex with a girl, then becoming jealous when she becomes a whore.

In Matthew, the words "I came not to send peace" is not synonymous to "I am willing to break up a social religion". It means that a person is against peace.

 

And the word of the Lord came to me: Son of man, make known to Jerusalem her abominations, and say, thus the Lord God To Jerusalem: Your origin and birth are in the land of the Cananites; your father was an Am'orite, and your mother a Hittite.
-Ezekiel 16:1-3

Ever heard of allegory? The Bible is very different from the Koran.


Jesus is basically his followers that God comes first, even before family.

 

Response: As demonstrated, the verse does not call the harlet Israel. She is spoken of separately from Israel and Jerusalem, not as Israel or Jerusalem. As for allegory, even an allegory would have to be stated as an allegory. No where does the verse say that it is. Thus as demonstrated, the story is a disgraceful story of God having sex with a female then becoming jealous when she becomes a whore. (Ezekiel 16:8 and 38-42).

 

Prophesied where ? You are talking about Muhammad, the one that died in 632 AD,yes ?

read my post again.

Therefore You cannot know if Muhammad is corrupted or simply a self proclaimed prophet. ..

"therefore"?

i base my belief in the qur'an, in this life, in facts and in Allah.
not on the -once holy- now corrupted and altered book.
no offence, but this is how it is.

bible was from Allah, no more.
you will understand it soon, that this is my point, i hope.

OK, now we are getting somewhere. So you are now claiming that Muhammad "may" or may NOT be in the Bible today,yes ?

i'm glad we got somewhere.
i wonder where that is...

but why do i have to repeat everything?
it's not like you are trying to hear me from a mile away,
you are reading it... pay attention.

again;
that's my view, i don't know about the general consensus.
my point is; out of respect to Allah, it's impossible for me to say
which part of the bible is corrupt.

because i might be saying "nonsense" to a verse
where there might be a word of truth in it.

Who's "you guys?"

flame group in this forum.
you must understand something.
i am not writing my posts to you solely when i reply.
generally all muslims are like that.
we don't care if you self-justify or twist things...
i have no problem with you either.
nor have the will to win an argument i have already won.

i am writing for someone who is open and sincere
who might come across and actually read what's written...
i am writing for the hard-headed flame group that
i have been facing since i joined...

with the hope that maybe they'll think.

Nope, it is stated in the quran that Muhammad can be found "in our own scriptures" yet no one person has shown this to me,even those that are looking for it. Not one single Muslim/Christian, theist, or atheist can produce this evidence.

i am not claiming anything about bible.
i won't. i explained the reason above and here.
but watch those videos at my prev. post they might give you an idea
about some muslims' pov.

Easy, you get a self proclaiming prophet to write his own book...

this is not an answer. we are not in the 5th grade.

No, it was an accusation. You accused me of giving you an anti-Islam link and I did not do that. I don't throw unfounded links at other peoples faith without looking into it first, much like a "194" cut and paste discrepancies..

if you wanna take the accusation so bad, then it's yours.

still counting those 194?
bad news: they won't get any lesser by counting.
you might discuss though, that thread... still standing.

aaaaand nothing on the "sun symbolism"?


--------------


reds above.

 

look woman. This 'Response:' thing has got you tap dancing on my last nerve. We know its a (*)(*)(*)(*)ed response. So cease already.

 

You don't need someone to tell you it's allegory. You can figure it out with common sense. Cities and kingdoms cannot be people, but they can represent an entire group of people. I.e the Jews.

"and say thus, the Lord God to Jerusalem:"

From this point on, God is speaking to Jerusalem.

 

Response: You should realize that a user name shouldn't be taken literally. For you are severely "MisLed" if you think I care for your "Response".

 

Response: To the contrary, stating that something is allegory without the text stating so is a lack of common sense. For a text can't say something if the words are not there. Furthermore, the harlot mentioned is never referred to as a city or kingdom, nor can you quote and prove otherwise. Thus the story still holds as a degrading and false depiction of God.

 

Is Jerusalem a city?

 

Response: Yes.

 

I understand...... So this is your belief:

Well I will tell you where and I am glad you asked.. Since you accept the above verse (Quran) as you say, you must also accept that it clearly states that the prophet Muhammad is mentioned in our Bible, which is false as not a single person has yet shown this to be the case.

Now I understand that you say these things(below) but they are irrelevant.

They are irrelevant because in that verse, He's talking about people of his own day and we know exactly what the Bible looked like in Muhammad's day. We have copies of the Bible that predate Muhammad by 300 years. So you can't say Muhammad "may be" or "maybe not" be in our scripture because we know what scriptures said in Muhammad's day,and not only do you have to believe it's there, It's really not ... That's one reason why Muslims are desperately trying to sneak it in 'Songs of Solomon', Deuteronomy 18, NT, etc... and all the claims have been bunk, not to mention desperate.

No one person has shown this to me or anyone else,even those that are looking for it. Not one single Muslim/Christian, theist, or atheist can produce this evidence.

Unfortunately it was a very valid answer that even a 5th grader might be able to understand.

Im not taking it at all, just pointing out that you falsely accused ... Or got mixed up ...

The bad news is for you because I already presented evidence of your hack job site cut and paste. You close your eyes to proof while your credibility diminishes to dust.

Maybe you missed my post, maybe you want to derail ... What do you specifically want to know ?

 

So let us start: Why is it important to be a human being full of compassion?

http://youtu.be/HmwTYcDuyks

 

allah is satan.

God is Jehovah.

Jesus Christ is our savior.

It's just that easy.

 

No - it's not as easy. The expression "Jehova" is an empty phrase - a mistake. It's a combination of the consonantes what god had answered when someone had asked him what he should say to others to make them clear with whom he had spoken and the vocals of the word "adonai". The expression "Jehova" was never used in history - it's only a placeholder. It would be much more easy to use the word "god" instead to use the mistaken word "Jehova".

It's also more easy ot use the expression "god" instead of "Allah" - what is the same word in two different languages - English and Arab. But for Muslims it is important to exist in their own cultural identity so they are using the word "Allah" instead of the word "god". This expression shows that only and exclusively the words of Mohamemd are the only political correctness Muslims are able to accept: "There is no god except Allah and Muhamed is his prophet".

What I would say about the expression 'Satan' would confuse you now - so let me use the word devil instead. The sentence you started your speech is then: "god" (spoken in arab language) is "devil" - what makes no sense. A devil is creation and not creator.

And Jesus is not only our savior - he's the savior of the whole creation, of the whole cosmos and chaos. We are part of his creation - so he is also our savior. But this doesn't mean someone or something - even if it is only a corn of dust - is excluded from salvation - although it seems to be human beings are able to exclude themselve - or to crossover to the other side of the rainbow by accepting gods truth, gods way and gods life.

http://youtu.be/34I7LZwQdes

 

Well I will tell you where and I am glad you asked.. Since you accept the above verse (Quran) as you say, you must also accept that it clearly states that the prophet Muhammad is mentioned in our Bible, which is false as not a single person has yet shown this to be the case.

because it is corrupted.
the evidence cannot stand on an altered document.
it has to be the same message.

so again;
it might be in the book.
or it might have been removed.

people (some muslims) who are claiming those theories make sense...
but to me; whether it's in today's bible or not; i know that jesus (pbuh)
announced the coming of "ahmed" (pbuh). and when i say that i rely to
the qur'an which the true word of Allah to me...

check the general census and the theory in detail about these matters,
to understand the theory better... you won't get much out of me.

i am not interested in finding Allah's final prophet (saw) in another book.
i already found him (saw) in the qur'an, and try to practice
as he did everyday of my life, as much as i can...


Now I understand that you say these things(below) but they are irrelevant.

We have copies of the Bible that predate Muhammad by 300 years. So you can't say Muhammad "may be" or "maybe not" be in our scripture because we know what scriptures said in Muhammad's day,and not only do you have to believe it's there, It's really not ... That's one reason why Muslims are desperately trying to sneak it in 'Songs of Solomon', Deuteronomy 18, NT, etc... and all the claims have been bunk, not to mention desperate.

i don't know about that.
personally i am not trying anything.
as i said; this is not my major concern.

i just tell people to seek for Allah (God),
thus be sincere and and give the qur'an a read.

even if they provide you the proof...
will you then believe?

did they believe in jesus (pbuh) when -with permission of Allah-
he performed miracles?

the heart and the loyalty count too.

you may find copies up to 500 years before.
but the prophecy must precede the prophesized matter anyway.
so i don't understand your point.


No one person has shown this to me or anyone else,even those that are looking for it. Not one single Muslim/Christian, theist, or atheist can produce this evidence.

there cannot be a proof based on an altered document.
there can only be a theory saying that "here.. we have found this
and this verse stating this, we think these verses are not corrupted,
adn we think they point to the matter".

for instance; it clearly says muhammed (saw) phonetically and
contextually in the old testament. but then people say:
"well it's solomon's song so what's that gotta do with the
muslim prophet (saw)?"

i, on the other hand, again say not much about these matters.
i just interfere where i sense a major flaw of logic.


Unfortunately it was a very valid answer that even a 5th grader might be able to understand.

what i mean is...
answering a reasoning of someone can be in two ways:
1) answer it with repeating the same sentence (ignore)
2) bring your own reason (reply)


The bad news is for you because I already presented evidence of your hack job site cut and paste. You close your eyes to proof while your credibility diminishes to dust.

dust?

again i cannot comment on bible verses out of respect.
double check the grammar in your own reasoning...

but get and compare the original verses too.
this is the only hint i will give you.


Maybe you missed my post, maybe you want to derail ... What do you specifically want to know ?

i just checked it again...
i must have missed it.
can you quote your answer?

 

most people that show up here and blindly attack muslims:

1. know thy scripture.
2. know other people's scripture too if you want to.
3. state your opinion.
4. it's ok to say when we don't know. how else will we learn?

back to these questions:

• have you read another scripture than bible?
• have you read the bible?

please...

 

Response: Because compassion is an important element to maintaining peace.

 

Yes, read several things. All scripture is worthy of being read, for true believers will have "compassion and mercy in the hearts of those who follow[ed]" Jesus.

Here is one problem, your so-called "religion" says that Allah made "be" Isa or Jesus, and yet Black Stone Idolaters say:

"[9.30] And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"

The simple fact is if you make a woman pregnant, it is your son. It does not mean anyone has to accept Jesus was a God, he bled, he died, he told us to pray to "our" father for his will on earth. Destroying people for a triviality, for not keeping up the prayer to a Black Stone Idol, that has no bearing on justice or being good to your fellow man is just plain evil.

What is the difference between seeing you as a "Black Stone Idolater" and your so-called "religion" seeing that it is okay to slay those who simply believe that Jesus' mother was made pregnant by God?

We are all sons of God, and that includes Idolaters and Pagans too, it is just only one man was made "be," and for believing it your false prophet said, "may Allah destroy them?"

Believing in a trinity is a triviality, it has no bearing whatsoever on whether someone can be good. Even if you are a Black Stone Idolater, it is a triviality, it has no bearing on whether you can reject the calls (or whatever man-made toiletry this is "may Allah destroy them") of the false prophet to slay others who do not keep up prayer to be seen of men.

And that brings us to a second problem which proves MoHamMad was a false prophet.

False prophet:

“When ye have performed the act of worship, remember Allah, standing, sitting and reclining. And when ye are in safety, observe proper worship. Worship at fixed times hath been enjoined on the believers.” 4.103

“Lo! the hypocrites seek to beguile Allah, but it is He Who beguileth them. When they stand up to worship they perform it languidly and to be seen of men, and are mindful of Allah but little;” 4.142

“O Ye who believe! Choose not for guardians such of those who received the Scripture before you, and of the disbelievers, as make a jest and sport of your religion. But keep your duty to Allah if ye are true believers.” 5.57

“And when ye call to prayer they take it for a jest and sport. That is because they are a folk who understand not.” 5.58

“Then We caused Our messengers to follow in their footsteps; and We caused Jesus, son of Mary, to follow, and gave him the Gospel, and placed compassion and mercy in the hearts of those who followed him. But monasticism they invented - We ordained it not for them - only seeking Allah's pleasure, and they observed it not with right observance. So We give those of them who believe their reward, but many of them are evil-livers.” 57.27

True prophet:

“(Mat 6:5) And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
(Mat 6:6) But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
(Mat 6:7) But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.
(Mat 6: Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.
(Mat 6:9) After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
(Mat 6:10) Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.
(Mat 6:11) Give us this day our daily bread.
(Mat 6:12) And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
(Mat 6:13) And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.”

It is an example, not a command for repetition, not a command to be seen of men to be judged by paranoid murderous men for their languidness.

Now go your way and quit worshiping false Idols.

 

As far as I know is the Islam the religion of the submission under the will of god. Besides the interesting question "What is the will of god?" there are different opinions about what submission is. Lots of peole call this special form of submission "peace" - but I think it is just simple the submission under the dead will of Muhamed. There's a big difference between a feeling of joyful inner peace or the sad peace of the graveyards or even the forced violent peace of dictatorships or ... No ... compassion has to work under normal conditions in life - maybe even in times of war. Your answer is not satisfying.

 

it won't stick if you keep repeating it.

research
i know you think you had your golden moment
when you came up with this "black stone idol" phrase.

but not really, it's nothing new.
maybe next thing you'll come up will be;
the box in the desert, or 72 virgins, or 9/11?

i'll leave you with your research now.

but wow, you really finished the research in 0.00001 seconds
and you approved yourself. what a shock!
man you are impressive.

read the qur'an:
how many times the black stone worship is mentioned, tell us.

wow... i did not see this coming.
you read the whole book with your one eye before
i even posted this message.
did you see anything? tell us tell us!

read history:
why the oldest churches are in islamic countries? tell us.
because we oppressed them or aided to live their religion?

oppressed right?
wow... you didn't even have to read.
again, that was some superman trick. you rock.

---

sorry about the sarcasm. i really tried...

on a more serious note ask if you want to learn about islam,
i will answer. but change your manners and show respect first.

not because i am a muslim but we are all human.
and we can discuss in a civilized way.

be well.

 

" The Kabah needed repairs or rather rebuilding...The rebuilding progressed and the walls were raised until it was time to place the Black Stone, al-Hajarul Aswad, on the south eastern corner of the Kabah. The Black Stone was regarded as very sacred by the Makkans and it is still regarded as sacred by Muslims...the pilgrims kiss this stone as a mark of respect and as the Sunnah (practice) of Muhammad.....

"...The first man to enter the mosque was Muhammad...He said , 'Give me a cloak.' When they brought him a cloak, he spread it on the ground, placed the Black Stone over it and said, 'Let the elders of each clan hold on to one edge of the cloak.' They did so and carried the stone to its place. Muhammed then picked up the stone and put it in its place on the wall of the kabah. " (Islam Beliefs and Teachings, Ghulam Sasrwar, p.83)

The kabbah, the black stone, allah, all were part of the worship of stones or rocks by the Arabs. It continues today as Islam. muhammed simply built a new religion around it adding his supposed revelations.

Quantrill

 

It is good to have a sense of humor.

The Black Stone Idol thing came about when I saw a bunch of Iranians with all their icons of the Ayatolla, and a Muslim had said something about Catholics and their idols, so it just figures, if a Muslim sees Catholics as idolaters and polytheists what is good for the goose...

I didn't count them, but if keeping up prayer is a command to the Jews in The Children of Israel, and the Red Stone Idolaters, Romans, and others that have been conquered and are in a state of subjection and humiliation...:

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/k/koran/koran-idx?type=simple&q1=keep+up+prayer&size=First+100

It is somewhat obvious that verses that demand the Idolaters repent and pray is not for them to pray to their idols.

Governments have some right to demand compliance, religions do not. The Old Testament with regard to the Moabite idol worship comes to mind; certainly a State has some right to demand that John Edwards not talk to the dead or read palms of old women for their Social Security Checks.

Christian history is full of abuse, and still with Romans 1:26-27... To try and make the Koran squeaky clean, being somewhat impossible if it is truly the word of God or has revealed status with no errors, is going to be a problem in the modern world.

Live long and prosper.

 

Response: There may be many opinions as to what the submission is, but there is only one correct one. For submission to the will of Allah would mean exactly what the words say. And that is to follow the command of Allah. Allah's comand is to follow the Qur'an and Sunnah.

As for the answer not being satisfying, no one, nor islam, is a fault for your inability to be compassionate.