Muslim Man Sues Business For Refusing To Shave His Beard Per Company Standards

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by liberalminority, Aug 5, 2011.

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  1. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    True.
    I presume the plaintiff is basing his claim on the following:


    with the "obligation" buttressed in the Qur'an here (IV:59):


    Whether or not the judge is going to buy that is anybody's guess...
     
  2. starbow

    starbow New Member Past Donor

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    no, the law is designed to prevent discrimination in hiring. the company is willing to hire Muslims, but the job requires them to shave their beards.

    for example in another type of job which might involve toxic waste cleanup, where a worker may be required to be fitted for and wear a mask respirator which fit snuggly over his face, a beard would also be impractical and he would also be required to shave it.

    however, in neither case is the worker required to change his religious affiliation.
     
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  3. Irishman

    Irishman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I once saw a Muslim women on vacation in Florida with my wife at Animal Kingdom, who was completely covered from head to toe in 100º weather! The only way for her to breathe were small circular slits on her face. I couldn't believe it when I saw it, how terrible that must be.
     
  4. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    Most hadiths don't count for much.. and I'll wager this employee is a young man... not an elder.
     
  5. Kimaris

    Kimaris New Member

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    It won't be. It would be the same for asking a Sikh to remove his Dastar. You cannot fire someone for their religious beliefs without their request being unreasonable. And allowing someone to wear a Kippah, Dastar, Beard, or Hijab is not unreasonable.
     
  6. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    lol well I would assume the pharmacy would be liable, not the pharmacist...

    and you can still put a nametag on a darth vader uniform.
     
  7. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    In all likelihood she was an American convert.
     
  8. Kimaris

    Kimaris New Member

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    You're reasoning is why we have discrimination laws.

    If you are of a different religion you need not apply. That is essentially what you are saying.
     
  9. Irishman

    Irishman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well considering every single other guard has to be clean shaven, I see his request as unreasonable.
     
  10. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    Would you ride with a female cabbie wearing a veil?
     
  11. Kimaris

    Kimaris New Member

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    You're example doesn't apply here. There are no extant reasons for his beard to be shaved. In this case having a beard is not unreasonable.
     
  12. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well, we're not talking about "most hadiths" here - these sayings come from Bukhari's collection which is considered by many to be the most authentic.

    That having been said, it's a tenuous argument without a specific passage from the Qur'an to support it. If I were the judge, I would rule in favor of the defendant...
     
  13. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    In general Islam is NOT about convoluted legalisms.
     
  14. Kimaris

    Kimaris New Member

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    Legally it is not. Having a beard doesn't prevent him from doing his job. It isn't about being the minority or the majority. It is about whether or his request caused an undue burden on the company.
     
  15. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's debatable. Furthermore, I'm inclined to agree with the thrust of Margot's argument that the plaintiff has a weak case - the Qur'an does NOT command Muslim men to wear beards.
     
  16. Kimaris

    Kimaris New Member

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    It is HIS religion that prevents him from cutting his beard. A Muslim must take the Quran as the very word of god but his is also afforded his interpretation.
     
  17. Kimaris

    Kimaris New Member

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    See my post above.
     
  18. starbow

    starbow New Member Past Donor

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    the extant reason is the company wishes it. the shaving of the beard does not cause an undue burden, however in the job he applied for "appearances", for the reassurance of customers, is a part of the performance. if the beard stays, he can not therefore perform his job to the satisfaction of the company's clients. the root of the legal discussion here is not discrimination since the company will hire Muslims, the root is job performance.
     
  19. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    There's NOTHING in the Koran that requires a beard, nor any mention of not cutting the beard.

    In Arabia which is about as conservative as you can get, men under 45 don't grow beards and those that do trim them neatly.

    The only ones who don't trim their beards are the Muttaween.
     
  20. freakonature

    freakonature Well-Known Member

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    Depends on the beard.
     
  21. Kimaris

    Kimaris New Member

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    Bull(*)(*)(*)(*). He is a security guard not an actor. As I said before you cannot require a Jew to remove his Kippah and a Sikh to remove his Destar.

    You are breaking the law if you fire someone because he "looks Muslim".
     
  22. Someone

    Someone New Member

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    They can set whatever codes they like, but they're required to make reasonable accommodations for religious reasons, physical/mental disabilities, etc. For example, a rule saying that employees could not kneel on the floor would not excuse a business from preventing a Muslim employee from praying.
     
  23. Margot

    Margot Account closed, not banned

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    So you wold make allowances for a mentally retarded security guard????
     
  24. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Evidently, the plaintiff is arguing to the contrary...
     
  25. The Mello Guy

    The Mello Guy Well-Known Member

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    are there any other kind?
     
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