"Pro-lifers" want to ban abortion....fine...

Have to ask, does that include homosexuals freedom to marry?

 

Excuse me while I just point out what you failed to read in that post:

Despite the assumption that the marketing of condom use and safe sex would encourage sexual
activities, a plethora of studies conducted worldwide have concluded otherwise. For instance, based
on years of research, the 1999 policy of American Medical Association concluded that promotion of
safer sex is effective in delaying sex in teenagers, and abstinence-only programs have limited value
(Stine 2007). In another 3-year and 10-month study in Switzerland, a public education campaign
promoting condom use is found to be effective in increasing condom use, and does not raise the ratio
of adolescents who are sexually active. The research reveals that condom use among 17-30 yearolds
increased from 8% to 52%. By contrast, the ratio of adolescents age 16-19 who had sexual
intercourse did not increase over that same period. Three other studies have drawn the same
conclusion that promotion of condom use does not boost sexual activities. Deborah Sellers et al.’s
(1994) study and Sally Guttermacher et al’s (1997) research have concluded that the promotion and
distribution of condoms did not increase sexual activity among adolescents. In another study that
measured the number of condoms students took and the subsequent changes in sexual behavior,
Kirby’s (199 research of 10 Seattle high schools also showed that making condoms available
through vending machines and school clinics did not lead to increase in sexual activity.

Not everyone can. Some people don't even know where their next meal is coming from, much less birth control.

And yet, research shows that 95% of 38,000 people interviewed have had premarital sex.

"A new study of 38,000 Americans has found that 95 percent had premarital sex, challenging the wisdom of the abstinence-only sex education programs favored by the Bush administration. According to the study’s author: “It would be more effective ... to provide young people with the skills and information they need to be safe once they become sexually active—which nearly everyone eventually will.” The study also determined that engaging in premarital sex to be fairly consistent from the 1950s on, refuting the claim that people were simply less sexually active before marriage in the good old days.
http://www.truthdig.com/eartotheground/item/20061219_95_of_americans_have_had_premarital_sex/

Hence, the need for comprehensive sex education in addition to affordable birth control for those who can't always afford it. If you are not willing to take this measure to cut the number of abortions IN HALF, while LOWERING the amount spent on welfare, you should just butt out of the abortion debate, because you are not serious about reducing abortion.

 

Sorry I was busy reading the report, not the footnote you cited. But hey, we'll just pretend it is credible.

Update: We're supposed to make national policy off of ten highschools in Seattle only? That is hardly a fair representation of the entire nation. And a few other studies at best? Doesn't seem very bright. Need more studies to be more fairly representative.

And these sorts of people have zero business taking part in an act known to cause pregnancy. It is foolish at best.

Guess what? I'm one of them, but I made damn sure to not knock anybody up. Was not always an avid walker of the path. Dad told me that he could not control me, but he did instill the knowledge off the chain that exists between my wallet and my junk. It worked.

Sex education is not something I think is evil per se, but it is something that should be done by the parent given the controversy of the topic on schools. Sex education should cover the main concern - pregnancy and the development of the body. Not how to properly fist your partner. Such knowledge has no place in a school.

Your discomfort is not a variable of consideration for me. You seen the thread "Abortion for Sterilization"? Seen the author of it?

The ignorance...

 

Off topic Red Herring.

 

You stated, "I don't think you understand how much freedom means to me.""""
I tried to point out that Freedom means a lot to others, too. Like women who want the Freedom to chose what to do with their own reproductive system, their own bodies.

YOU wouldn't give up that freedom, why should they.

 

No doubt that freedom means a lot to others too, but the price of freedom is responsibility. They currently have the freedom to do as they will with their own reproductive systems. Not asking them to give up freedom, I'm asking them to stop sending the bill to the taxpayer for abortions and birth control. Just pay for it themselves and not demand that others do so for them at gun point via taxes, as responsible people should.

If they don't want to be responsible with their chemistry sets, than please, have the decency to sterilize themselves so they don't let bad stock proliferate and don't cost the taxpayers any more money.

I wouldn't dream of impeding your freedom.

 

how so, as a response to this

it is a relevant question.

 

Topic of thread is abortion, not marriage. But if it makes you feel better, the government should not be involved in marriage either. Just like it shouldn't be involved in abortion.

 

OK, sorry bout that, just curious.

 

Another price of freedom is paying taxes....paying taxes for things we all don't , and can't, agree on.

I pay for wars I don't think were right....and we got into them by people who weren't responsible at all.

I pay for the education of kids that aren't mine...and NO one pays for my kid's education.

But paying for educating citizens is a good thing to do for the country.

As is supporting the poor to keep them from becoming poorer which would allow children(those "precious gifts" that some people don't want aborted) from suffering.

I pay for those who don't buy their own health insurance. ....


I pay for millionaires and billionaires who took tax money for their bailout and don't pay their fair share of taxes. People who aren't desperate, poor or pregnant.


I have no idea how many pennies of my taxes go toward the health care of the poor but I can afford it and I know that's the right thing to do.


But It is good though when an Anti-choicer just admits it's all about the money, not religion, not the "preciousness of life"...just the money...

 

How can you say it worked? You had premarital sex. You took the risk, and the fact that you didn't knock anybody up is not due to any wonderful parental abstinence lectures; it is due to PURE LUCK. There is no contraception that will prevent pregnancy 100% of the time.

 

Wow, you took the bait, and you ran with it. Thank you.

Indeed, I took the risks, but well after I left my parents household. And I wasn't foolish about it either, the amounts of precautionary measures taken were staggering- I may as well have been wearing a hazmat suit while doing decon on her afterwards. Plus it helps when the woman you're nailing has endometriosis as well, I selected the woman carefully before plundering her dungeon like a level 4 adventurer. And I did so with caution, luck had nothing to do with it.

But hey, let's pretend that all those precautionary measures were just a fluke chance and my own foresight had nothing to do with my success in avoiding a pregnancy. You say she didn't get pregnant out of PURE LUCK. Are you telling me that contraception is just a waste of time since it is based upon pure luck? Are you telling me that I should have just not been having sex if I wasn't prepared to have a child?

If so, than I would agree with you, and I think you're on to something.

But sterilization works all the time. Something to think about. And it is reversible.

 

I'll address the parts worth addressing.

Taxes are supposed to be voluntary, not compulsory.

Sounds like you are okay with getting had to secure the jobs of bureaucrats and miscreants. Another note, the "country" is a legal fiction and construct. It is not a living breathing human being and thus cannot be benefited by anything. Human beings can be benefited. And it does benefit human beings to be educated to an certain extent, provided truth is being taught and not indoctrination, but should not be compulsory.

But if getting ripped off makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside, than be my guest.

Teach a man to fish and you won't have to keep giving him fish so he won't starve. And not everybody can afford it.

You've missed the mark, but only slightly. Yes it has a monetary element. The true mark is that it is compulsory to pay taxes to fund something that ought not be funded in the first place by the government who shakes down the citizens to pay for.

It is about reckless and foolish people robbing those who are responsible their freedom to choose what they pay for. Thus robbing them of choice.

Since you are pro-choice, you should understand this clearly.

 

As cautious as you were, luck WAS a factor. The vast majority of women with endometriosis can get pregnant. Condoms can break or slip. Pills can fail.

No, that's what pro-life zealots say. The reality-based community advises to be knowledgeable of the risks, take precautions, and if all else fails, the morning after pill is available, and if that fails as well, abortion is available.

You're wrong. Even sterilization can fail.

 

This only bolsters my argument of why people shouldn't be having sex when they are not prepared for the potential for a child. You do realize this right?

...or what people with common sense have to say about it. But for those devoid of common sense it is natural to hate those who have it - envy and all that nonsense.

Let's pretend that is true for a moment. This is just another reason to wait until a person is ready to support a child.

But tying your tubes is pretty damn effective as long as you follow instructions and verify sterility. Not rocket science.

 

This only bolsters my argument of why people shouldn't be having sex when they are not prepared for the potential for a child. You do realize this right?

...or what people with common sense have to say about it. But for those devoid of common sense it is natural to hate those who have it - envy and all that nonsense.

Let's pretend that is true for a moment. This is just another reason to wait until a person is ready to support a child.

But tying your tubes is pretty damn effective as long as you follow instructions and verify sterility. Not rocket science.

 

Bolding above , mine.


Your level of respect for women is...well, non-existent (see bolded above)....sounds like exceptional parenting doesn't inlcude lessons in respecting other humans.........which would explain your desire to punish women for having FUN sex


Your sterile (pun intended) approach to sex may be fine for you but, thank goodness, not everyone is you......



..... and abortion is still legal.....

 

NOW you agree taking away people's choice is wrong....you're learning!!!


Let me know when you find a country where you don't have to pay taxes .....or a country where you get to designate where every penny of your taxes goes...

 

An opinion of yours, not the truth however.

...did Captain Obvious tell you this? Or did he put you up to it?

- - - Updated - - -

Hardly, they are taking mine. I'm only desiring they take responsibility for their choices is all, like I do.

 

People will have sex whether or not they "should." They don't really care what you think.

People with common sense realize that most people will not abstain "until they ready to have a child."

It IS true, look it up. Why didn't YOU wait? It's easy to preach.

 

As usual, you forgot part.....the part that you can't address:

"""Let me know when you find a country where you don't have to pay taxes .....or a country where you get to designate where every penny of your taxes goes... """

 

They have no incentive to be responsible currently.

Because of lacking incentive for personal responsibility.

Spontaneous reconnection can happen but is extremely rare - not exactly the greatest argument. But I suppose makes it not a perfect one on my part. I'll revise. Sterilization is superior to all other forms of birth control.

Why didn't I wait? Personal choice. Parents can do everything right and still have castaways. Easy to preach, but I do practice what I preach, didn't always. But while I was out fornicating I didn't do any preaching either. Point is moot.

 

While I disagree with the anti-abortion/anti-birth control crowd, it is their RIGHT to voice their opinion on the matter. They can and do push for laws restricting abortion but again that is also their right. So long as there is a majority of Americans that believe a woman should be afforded the opportunity to make her own choice, even if limited to a early set period, then abortion will remain legal.

 

This might come as a surprise to you, but I've stopped responding to the worthless parts of your posts - which is a significant percentage. As well as the parts that are not convenient to reply too. If you want a better reply, learn to break up quotations. I'll not be addressing the parts that don't show up in the quote screen. What is convenient for you, is not for me and I'll not waste my time with it.

Off topic Red Herring which I decline to chase as well..

- - - Updated - - -

This might come as a surprise to you, but I've stopped responding to the worthless parts of your posts - which is a significant percentage. As well as the parts that are not convenient to reply too. If you want a better reply, learn to break up quotations. I'll not be addressing the parts that don't show up in the quote screen. What is convenient for you, is not for me and I'll not waste my time with it.

Off topic Red Herring which I decline to chase as well..

 

Personally, I don't think they should be pushing forceful legislation. But rather pushing a persuasive argument towards those getting them. Restoring the value of children and changing the perception of sex, parenthood, and personal responsibility. Chastity was once considered a very desirable trait amongst us, now it is made fun of, despite its obvious advantages. The perception of reality has a powerful effect on the potential actions of humans.

But that is my two cents.